This is another example of why the “porn = evil + addictive” brainworms are so dangerous. I’ve seen this same ideology dressed up in the language of anti-capitalism sometimes and it is extremely dangerous.
Comment I made a couple days ago:
Dudes blaming porn are just horny, feeling guilty, and then pathologizing themselves and their own libidos.
Porn addiction is as real as addiction to any other media or behavior. You could in theory wind up with a compulsion or something, but it’s not really an addiction.
What does happen to a lot of chuds is that they’re taught their libido and emotions are demonic. Then every time they’re horny, they feel like they’ve morally failed. In many cases, they feel they’ve failed against a literal demon that is now able to “possess” them.
They then associate guilt, self-loathing, and failure with getting off and the natural cycles of their own libido. Tie that in with misogyny and blaming women / queer people for their own “failures” and yeah :yikes:
Basically it’s a self fulfilling recipe for winding up as a fuckwad. That (guilt => orgasm reward => guilt) loop is what gets to religious people like this and turns them into virulent misogynists / queerphobes / etc.
The guilt loop is useful for controlling people and teaching them to invest in patriarchal systems, so conservatives naturally encourage it. There is a huge and very profitable industry built around “curing sex and porn addiction”.
These brainworms are entirely something people can work through too, but many won’t when they think it’s how god wants them to be.
If you genuinely believe that re-enforcing behavioral patterns of emotional self harm every time your libido spikes is actually you triumphing over demons in an act of literal spiritual warfare then… yeah.
Yeah, standard church is like watching paint dry. Evangelical mega churches are unfortunately pretty entertaining , especially if you’re in a small town. It’s literally a weekly free rock concert that tells you to hate yourself and everyone around you.
Combine that with being some of the only places for community aid and you’ve got a deeply fucked up evil version of dual power.
I forget not everyone grew up with and escaped that. It’s a big part of why I’m an active leftist. I’ve had to live in the world the right wing wants for everyone and it’s fucking bleak.
For any Christians reading all this, I don’t even hate Christianity. Liberation theology and Christian socialists do a lot of good.
The church is an incredibly efficient social structure and community mechanism which is why predators and reactionaries co-opted it as a means of consolidating power.
Acquainted with a few liberation theology/socialist Christians. Ye, that's their logic basically. Essentially once large scale organized Christianity took off it became a tool coopted by reactionaries for power & wealth that ignored the original message. Personally can't speak to the accuracy of this since my knowledge of the history of Christianity is lacking but I suppose you can certainly argue that case, a lotta evangelicals certainly aren't paying attention to the "love thy neighbor, the rich are sinful, etc." shit.
That and creationism had a really big impact on me growing up. Getting past them was difficult. It's really tough to describe the cumulative effect from being raised that way.
Happy to find someone here who shared that background :solidarity:
Counterpoint, the guy from that thread who said he was worried he was becoming an incel because he had hated that women shared his hobbies admitted that he consumed porn daily. I'm neither sex negative nor anti-porn, but there is definitely a connection between having an extremely shitty view of women and porn consumption.
This dude here is just a bog-standard self-loathing bigot, though. He was before he consumed porn and still is.
socially isolated allosexuals are probably gonna use porn. some of those people are isolated because they're chuds, rather than the porn making them become chuds. some of them will be isolated because of trauma and severe rejection sensitivity, poverty in a capitalist society, and a pandemic, but it's been a few years and i don't hate women yet.
I'm not sure if we're talking about the chicken or the egg in this scenario.
I'd consider it that the dehumanizing aspects of porn tend to be reflecting an already misogynistic and racist society that already has sexual pathologies going on, moreso than the porn creating or even antagonizing it.
Or maybe it does, maybe it's part of the feedback loop that seems to create this type of toxic thought.
I'll say I watch porn a decent amount and it hasn't done shit to me, but I'm able to separate porn as fantasy from the reality of a real relationship. Though I'm not into the abusive stuff.
But I still think most people can do that as well, and the ones that cannot would likely find another outlet to exacerbate their toxic predilections one way or another.
They then associate guilt, self-loathing, and failure with getting off and the natural cycles of their own libido. Tie that in with misogyny and blaming women / queer people for their own “failures” and yeah
You mention this rhetoric being being reframed with an anticapitalist perspective and I totally agree. I think men feeling guilty for being horny transcends political boundaries and you basically need to find a therapist (if you can afford one) to talk to about it because men don't usually talk about those issues with each other.
The Mormon, protestant,a nd Catholic obsession with masturbation would be funny if it didn't cause so many problems.
Also imagine having such a boring ass conception of demons that you think feeling horny is demonic possession. Motherfucker I at least want to turn weird colors and fly through the night terrorizing the townspeople.
This is another example of why the “porn = evil + addictive” brainworms are so dangerous. I’ve seen this same ideology dressed up in the language of anti-capitalism sometimes and it is extremely dangerous.
Comment I made a couple days ago:
Dudes blaming porn are just horny, feeling guilty, and then pathologizing themselves and their own libidos.
Porn addiction is as real as addiction to any other media or behavior. You could in theory wind up with a compulsion or something, but it’s not really an addiction.
What does happen to a lot of chuds is that they’re taught their libido and emotions are demonic. Then every time they’re horny, they feel like they’ve morally failed. In many cases, they feel they’ve failed against a literal demon that is now able to “possess” them.
They then associate guilt, self-loathing, and failure with getting off and the natural cycles of their own libido. Tie that in with misogyny and blaming women / queer people for their own “failures” and yeah :yikes:
Basically it’s a self fulfilling recipe for winding up as a fuckwad. That (guilt => orgasm reward => guilt) loop is what gets to religious people like this and turns them into virulent misogynists / queerphobes / etc.
The guilt loop is useful for controlling people and teaching them to invest in patriarchal systems, so conservatives naturally encourage it. There is a huge and very profitable industry built around “curing sex and porn addiction”.
These brainworms are entirely something people can work through too, but many won’t when they think it’s how god wants them to be.
If you genuinely believe that re-enforcing behavioral patterns of emotional self harm every time your libido spikes is actually you triumphing over demons in an act of literal spiritual warfare then… yeah.
:desolate:
Jeez guess it's good I found church boring
Yeah, standard church is like watching paint dry. Evangelical mega churches are unfortunately pretty entertaining , especially if you’re in a small town. It’s literally a weekly free rock concert that tells you to hate yourself and everyone around you.
Combine that with being some of the only places for community aid and you’ve got a deeply fucked up evil version of dual power.
I forget not everyone grew up with and escaped that. It’s a big part of why I’m an active leftist. I’ve had to live in the world the right wing wants for everyone and it’s fucking bleak.
For any Christians reading all this, I don’t even hate Christianity. Liberation theology and Christian socialists do a lot of good.
The church is an incredibly efficient social structure and community mechanism which is why predators and reactionaries co-opted it as a means of consolidating power.
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Acquainted with a few liberation theology/socialist Christians. Ye, that's their logic basically. Essentially once large scale organized Christianity took off it became a tool coopted by reactionaries for power & wealth that ignored the original message. Personally can't speak to the accuracy of this since my knowledge of the history of Christianity is lacking but I suppose you can certainly argue that case, a lotta evangelicals certainly aren't paying attention to the "love thy neighbor, the rich are sinful, etc." shit.
With a 10% tip
*terms and eternal damnation may applyI was raised in the church too and the process you describe here made high school FUCKING TORTUROUS.
Abandoning that guilt was a crucial first step in developing into a healthy(ish) person.
Proud of you comrade. Not enough people do that work.
:rat-salute:
:hyperflush: thx
That and creationism had a really big impact on me growing up. Getting past them was difficult. It's really tough to describe the cumulative effect from being raised that way.
Happy to find someone here who shared that background :solidarity:
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Thats not sexual violence thats a dangerous kink that people should be more familiar with before deciding to engage with it
Also, yeah, its frightening how common it is, at least from second hand sources (bi partners)
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Counterpoint, the guy from that thread who said he was worried he was becoming an incel because he had hated that women shared his hobbies admitted that he consumed porn daily. I'm neither sex negative nor anti-porn, but there is definitely a connection between having an extremely shitty view of women and porn consumption.
This dude here is just a bog-standard self-loathing bigot, though. He was before he consumed porn and still is.
socially isolated allosexuals are probably gonna use porn. some of those people are isolated because they're chuds, rather than the porn making them become chuds. some of them will be isolated because of trauma and severe rejection sensitivity, poverty in a capitalist society, and a pandemic, but it's been a few years and i don't hate women yet.
This. Saying porn makes people chuds is ascribing a bunch of power to porn that it very obviously doesn’t have.
It’s completely understandable that an isolated person would reach for porn. :shrug-outta-hecks:
Just so I understand, are you suggesting that porn was making him hate women and into an incel?
If so, I don’t think that’s an accurate read. I’m not at all surprised an alienated dude with unpacked misogyny was watching a ton of porn though.
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I should've read this before posting because I did a chicken v egg analogy too lol
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I'm saying the way women are treated in some porn is dehumanizing and I think it contributed to his hatred of women.
I'm not sure if we're talking about the chicken or the egg in this scenario.
I'd consider it that the dehumanizing aspects of porn tend to be reflecting an already misogynistic and racist society that already has sexual pathologies going on, moreso than the porn creating or even antagonizing it.
Or maybe it does, maybe it's part of the feedback loop that seems to create this type of toxic thought.
I'll say I watch porn a decent amount and it hasn't done shit to me, but I'm able to separate porn as fantasy from the reality of a real relationship. Though I'm not into the abusive stuff.
But I still think most people can do that as well, and the ones that cannot would likely find another outlet to exacerbate their toxic predilections one way or another.
:this:
That poster turned out to be a troll looking to doxx people IIRC so not the best example.
You mention this rhetoric being being reframed with an anticapitalist perspective and I totally agree. I think men feeling guilty for being horny transcends political boundaries and you basically need to find a therapist (if you can afford one) to talk to about it because men don't usually talk about those issues with each other.
The Mormon, protestant,a nd Catholic obsession with masturbation would be funny if it didn't cause so many problems.
Also imagine having such a boring ass conception of demons that you think feeling horny is demonic possession. Motherfucker I at least want to turn weird colors and fly through the night terrorizing the townspeople.