I've been hearing more and more really scary shit about how Turkey is handling the aftermath of this earthquake. From strangling communications used, among other things, by people trapped to tell rescuers they're alive, to preventing the movement of people internally, a general lack of mobilization of emergency resources that were supposed to be in place and paid for by a specific tax after the last devastating quakes.
Yeah it seems really bad. There's footage of news that wasn't even state owned just ignoring a woman who had literally just been rescued because she was complaining about the government response and her still trapped family.
edit: to add, erdogan said in a very recent speech that anyone criticizing the government recovery effort is a bastard. it's basically a trump recovery effort without any pretense of freedom of speech
hmm, where are you hearing that from?
its the aftermath of a mass casualty disaster, things are pretty chaotic. But you can rest assured that Turkiye is doing the best it can, as are organisations in that country and also from other countries.
I think its useful to keep in mind that Erdogan is deeply unpopular with the west, and there are elections coming soon that the west would like his party to lose. so if you rely on western sources, including social media, it can create an impression that goes against common sense - like that Turkiye deliberately harms its own disaster relief efforts or its own people.
hmm, where are you hearing that from?
My turkish friends said as much. And it's not just Twitter, neither is this the first time it happens.
What people miss about Erdogan isn't just that he's 'unpopular with the west', the opposition is even more anti-western in matters regarding the PKK, the gulenists, greece's territorial claims, sweden, and refugees or everything else that is a grievance between Erdogan and the West. It's really not as simple as 'western media wants Erdogan down because he's the turkish Putin'.
Erdogan is a masterful and ruthless politician willing to ally anyone and do anything to secure his own power. And the turkish state has been entirely purged and subjugated to him. The AKparty has become a confederation of kleptocrats who hang entirely on the personal power of their kingpin, and not only has state services broken down under Erdogan but so did capitalist corruption increase. One of the government's greatest constituencies is the sort of construction company that pays bribes to skim on earthquake safety regulations so they can save extra cash to buy their condos in Barcelona together with their EU membership. The turkish state is not about to let that sort of conversation happen so close to the elections.
and also his party have passed some good laws and made some good decisions
Well, yes which is why I said the AKparty became a kleptocracy. Erdogan used to be at the head of a rather diverse and interesting political movement and at this point most people who aren't cronies have jumped ship. Because the AKP today is about Erdogan and how much money being friends with Erdogan can make you. There is a point where infrastructure spending becomes building shopping malls to shore up your supporter's bank accounts and that was when Turkiye's economy completely collapsed and Erdogan was forced to make peace with all of Turkiye's former geopolitical rivals in exchange for investment money.
But the sanctity of Erdogan's government isn't up for discussion. The complete control of turkish media and the state apparatus is. Which is the case at the moment. Prestige media takes its marching orders from the palace, which also maintains control over social media. Which I believe was also curtailed when the big fires happened and people found out that the government didn't even have the means of putting them out or helping people anymore.
Turkiye isn't China. It's not controlling people's anger so that it can stabilize the situation and change policy according to their demands. It's a representative democracy like any other and the government is focused on winning elections.
For a country to get anything done, it needs to first move away from oligarchic models of government, which is what Erdogan has made steps towards.
I'm sorry but this has no basis in reality. Erdogan has empowered an oligarchy with himself at it's head. You're just ignoring everything that I'm saying in favor of a fantastical Turkiye that doesn't exist.
Never thought this site would have Turkish Nationalists. I thought they hated leftists.
It's complicated, because Erdogan has shaken hands with pretty much the entire political spectrum of Turkiye. And promptly burned bridges with them when it was useful to do so. A lot of reddit educated people think that Erdogan is just a big meanie persecuting an esoteric self support religious organization ie the gulenists. Except Gulen and Erdogan were allies and Gulen's movement was instrumental in how Erdogan captured the turkish state, subjugated the judiciary and broke down the professional bureaucracy.
So who are the Turkish Nationalists in that situation? Is it the AKPartists who want CIA Gulen extradited and punished because of the attempts coup few years ago? Or is it the opposition, who hates Gulen even more since he pulled a Gorbachev, helped destroy the rule of law in their country, and now lives with all the rights and privileges of a wealthy Pennsylvanian? The answer is probably most both at this point.
Yeah, super weird to see one pop up here. Erdogan is anti-communist and has been extremely harsh in crushing Turkish leftists and Kurdish movements. He's also an Armenian genocide denialist...
Once saw a comment here that was excusing Azerbaijan by saying that Armenia "deserved it"
Total control of the media is what happens in every country
Yeah and I'm not about to pretend that it doesn't happen in Russia or the US because I agree or disagree with the parties in power, or with their political projects. The turkish state is under the private interests of Erdogan's family and their cronies in the AKP. Their control of the media reflects that. Their nation building ambitions are far from a country like China's. It's a standard representative democracy living through a breakdown of law and living standards. That's what is at stake in Turkiye, not a fantasy where the Turkish president is some sort of far sighted Dengist beset by his enemies.
Would anyone seriously rely on Twitter to do rescue efforts. Especially Elon Musk's Twitter. Seems like one of those dumb western things where they pretend US controlled social media outlets are a beacon of Freedom™.
I mean if youre buried alive and your phone still works, might as well post it everywhere
