Here in (country) everyone on the left hates surrogacy with a burning passion, since it involves rich people essentially buying babies and using the bodies of poor women for their own benefit. Even the right wing parties feel sliiightly uncomfortable discussing said topics (with the exception of the extremely liberal ones who also love to act all european and modern).

Even sitcoms such as Friends or Always Sunny in Philadelphia had plotlines where this happened and they didn't pointed out how some rich fuck was taking advantage of a poor person. (Well, it was a sitcom so the poor person was either an asshole or doing it out of the goodness of their hearts, but you get the picture: whitewashing surrogacy is also bad).

So yeah, what's the deal with that? No one points out how fucked up it is???

  • camaron30 [he/him]
    ·
    2 years ago

    Buying babies is wrong. Also exploiting poor women.

    • Zuzak [fae/faer, she/her]
      ·
      2 years ago

      Doesn't really answer my question. A woman working at McDonald's is being exploited, that doesn't mean that it should be illegal for women to work at McDonald's - ofc ideally wage labor and exploitation should be abolished, but that should be addressed holistically, not by pointing at random things and banning them. Is there evidence that women who engage in surrogacy have a high regret rate?

      I don't really agree with the framing that surrogacy is the same as "buying a baby" and I'd rather base my beliefs on actual evidence and material analysis, which is why I asked about negative consequences and not like, whether you think it's bad vibes.

      • camaron30 [he/him]
        ·
        2 years ago

        It literally is buying a baby.

        Sure, it doesn't have negative consequences, which is why only desperate, poor women are forced into it. Or how the surrogate companies have lots of fucked up conditions in their contract. Or how they pay extremely little. Or how it leaves the women with life-long consequences...

        • Zuzak [fae/faer, she/her]
          ·
          2 years ago

          It literally is buying a baby.

          You can repeat that over and over at me but if it didn't convince me the first time I'm not sure why you think stating it a third time would. I don't agree with that framing, and I'm reserving judgement on the issue until I can look at actual evidence, which I'm guessing you're not interested in providing, in which case I just don't really care.

          Quick Google search turned up this.

          Ten years following the birth of the surrogacy child, surrogate mothers scored within the normal range for self-esteem and did not show signs of depression as measured by the Beck Depression Inventory. Marital quality remained positive over time. All surrogates reported that their expectations of their relationship with the intended parents had been either met or exceeded and most reported positive feelings towards the child. In terms of expectations for the future, most surrogates reported that they would like to maintain contact or would be available to the child if the child wished to contact them. None expressed regrets about their involvement in surrogacy.

          Do you have a better source, or is this all just knee-jerk?

          • camaron30 [he/him]
            ·
            2 years ago

            Oh cool. So they don't experience depression 10 years after being exploited. Good to know.

            It's hilarious how low your standards are. Let's flip this: why the hell should buying a baby (and yes, i don't care about your feelings, it literally is what's happening. I can say "buying a womb if you prefer) be legal??

            • Zuzak [fae/faer, she/her]
              ·
              2 years ago

              If you actually looked at that study - which at this point it seems clear that you have zero interest in actual evidence - it also surveyed them after one year and found similar results.

              It’s hilarious how low your standards are. Let’s flip this: why the hell should buying a baby (and yes, i don’t care about your feelings, it literally is what’s happening. I can say "buying a womb if you prefer) be legal??

              I don't really care how you want to frame it, because I don't base my beliefs on framing, I base them on evidence and material analysis. But since you seem entirely disinterested in that and are operating purely on vibes and framing, I'll play your game: why do you think it's ok for the state to legislate what women can and can't do with our bodies?