If this is too close to sectarianism I get it, but I keep hearing about Marxist-Leninist-Maoists at the periphery of other discussions and all I know about them is:

  • they seem to be distinct from other Maoist tendencies
  • their name is often shortened to Maoist in conversation
  • the tendency is at least nominally a synthesis of Mao's writings into prior ML theory, done by someone named Gonzalo
  • their reputation among MLs seems to be deviant
  • I think the rapper Power Struggle alludes to being one, which is my sole investment in this question
  • CriticalResist8 [he/him]
    ·
    1 year ago

    I'll try to answer following the non-sectarian rules.

    MLs uphold Mao as a theoretician of marxism-leninism, but don't see him as doing anything different from MLism, which we hold to be the most adaptable ideology of communism and so we don't see a point in considering that Mao wrote

    Mao himself wrote for the conditions of China at the time and didn't call himself anything other than a marxist-leninist. Some of the stuff he wrote and theorised some people have told me had been practiced by Lenin before him, just without a name (like the mass line). I'm not sure about that personally but it's what some people say.

    Where it gets complicated is you have ML-MZT (Marxist-Leninist with Mao Zedong Thought, not repudiating that Mao was an ML but incorporating what's applicable from him into MLism), Maoism, MLMism, and still some MLMpM -- Marxist-Leninist-Maoists (principally Maoists).

    Though nowadays from what I understand you pretty much only have MZT and MLM left, and they just call themselves Maoists.

    I also heard in China some people call themselves Maoists and it has a different meaning than in the rest of the world, but I don't know about that personally.

    Gonzalo was the leader of the Shining Path, or Communist Party of Peru - Shining Path (there were two parties). He was the one who first synthesized Maoism in the 80s, and I think also started MLMpM. He alleged -- or at least Maoists allege -- that Mao's contributions to marxism were sufficient to consider MLMism the most advanced ideology of the proletariat, and thus all MLs should become MLMs, like all Marxists previously became Marxist-Leninists. Personally, in the time Maoism has existed, I have never seen the universality of the protracted people's war. It has only succeeded in China so far, and was practiced by Mao due to the conditions in China at the time: a large population fighting against an outside invader in a mismatched war (Japan being much more trained and equipped than the Chinese).

    Now, I hope this still assumes good faith and doesn't break the non-sectarian rule, but it's no secret (although still a bit niche) that Maoism was also being promoted by the CIA both in the US and outside, because they wanted it to exacerbate the Sino-Soviet split in a divide and conquer move. In Peru, where Gonzalo was from and operated, the CIA even distributed the little red book in universities. Gonzalo himself was quite a character and you know, there's been controversy with the Shining Path regarding civilian populations, but at the same time there's also lies against communist figures so I won't get into these incidents here.

    I'm not saying Maoists are feds mind you, but it could help explain why there are so many Maoist ideologies and subgroups and why many actually disagree with each other. The PPW that I talked about is apparently not upheld and practiced by all Maoists. You also recognize Maoists because sometimes, they like to speak in very poetic prose, I think coming from Mao's own writings (he was a poet before he became a writer).

    Maoists also don't uphold the AES line, which is held by all MLs and was first theorised by someone from the USSR whose name I forgot, I think shortly after Stalin's death. To that end Maoists don't believe China is socialist, which is the biggest demarcation in the west between MLs and MLMs. Though to be honest, I realise when writing these lines I actually have no idea why they don't like China and what that has to do with Mao's writings. I think it might come from the Three Worlds theory he wrote on which... was completely wrong. Like there's Mao the general, and there's Mao the statesman. And the two are very different lol, Mao kinda became cringe towards the end of his life. That's also why we sometimes call them ultras (since you were asking), because no revolution is ever good enough for them if it isn't waged exactly how they want it to.

    The one thing we all kinda agree on is the USSR became revisionist after Stalin lol

    • infuziSporg [e/em/eir]
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      Adding onto this, MLMs see Mao's contributions as a crucial modification of Marx's and Lenin's theories. The biggest change is doing away with the idea that modes of production have to proceed linearly and that peasants need to be torn from their land and made into industrial workers to be able to abolish capitalism; the theory allows for jumping straight to socialism from feudalism.

      In addition to M-L-MZT (mostly the Chinese model, Marx and Lenin with lots of footnotes by mostly Chinese Communists) and M-L-M (more standardized with Mao as a key elaborator on Lenin the way Lenin was for Marx), you also have Maoist-Third-Worldists, who believe that revolution only has a good chance of happening in the Third World/Global South/periphery due to the highest level of "contradictions" (better understood as Oppositions) there, and that the core, including the workers, is bought off with the fruits of imperialism, and is irredeemable until a global wave of revolution makes its way there from poorer countries.

      Maoists have several core ideological or strategic principles like Mass Line, New Democracy, and Protracted People's War.

      Since the end of the Cold War, Maoists have achieved a mixed victory in Nepal, and stood their ground in India and the Philippines, which is more Ws than any other tendency can claim in the same time period, except maybe for Socialism in the 21st Century.

      • drinkinglakewater [he/him]
        ·
        1 year ago

        more Ws than any other tendency can claim in the same time period, except maybe for Socialism in the 21st Century

        What does Socialism in the 21st Century refer to here?

        • HauntedBySpectacle [he/him, comrade/them]
          ·
          1 year ago

          Not OP but I understand that term to refer to the ideology of what are sometimes called the Bolivarian revolutions, in Venezuela, Bolivia, Nicaragua

    • Llituro [he/him, they/them]
      ·
      1 year ago

      To expand on the end, Maoists don't like China because they see the Dengist turn as a revisionist betrayal of Mao's vision and strategy. Maoists also will usually defend the cultural revolution and the great leap forward, but not anything more recent like tiananmen, where they tend to start looking like what might be called ultras

    • Judge_Jury [comrade/them, he/him]
      hexagon
      ·
      1 year ago

      Thank you very much for the rundown, context is exactly what I was looking for. I don't have much to say about it, I was just curious where a rapper I like was coming from with lines like "Marx, Lenin, Mao got books to go around" and "combatting wrong ideas and revisionists", since those seemed like they could fit any ML tendency, but strongly suggested MLM

    • MoreAmphibians [none/use name]
      ·
      1 year ago

      I have never seen the universality of the protracted people's war. It has only succeeded in China so far

      What about Vietnam?

      • mazdak
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        deleted by creator