It's a situation that I have been expecting for a while, but I wasn't fully ready to accept it. Specifically it's one of my LGBTQ friends who honestly believes in the democrats will protect them and their partner. I have tried to make the point that both parties are eroding any sort of civility towards all marginalized groups, but fear seems to drive them more than logical observations. They make the excuse that change doesn't happen over night and that the left continues to grow and will have meaningful affects down the road. I fundamentally just don't agree with that idea and vocalize it regularly. More and more it is ending up in a circular argument where I am painted as unrealistic and my rhetoric (leftist rhetoric) is doing more harm than good because it promotes distrust in the only system we have to work with. I try to tell them it's kind of the whole point. We gotta start somewhere if we want to see a better, more representative system, but they are so hung up on the immediate future while simultaneously saying that my idealistic feelings are shortsighted and I cant expect change in the immediate future... The double-talk is wild, I know.
I am trying my hardest to stop from engaging at this point because on the most basic level we agree on a lot of stuff, but they are just way to wrapped up in the fear mongering of the democratic party. They know that the two party system is broken, they know that something drastic needs to change, but they also think that they are powerless to do anything except choose the lesser evil. It pains me because I am watching them do the same shit past generations have done, where they give up on their ideals for the sake of preserving the current status quo that they benefit from. I am legitimately watching them imply "fuck you, got mine" under the guise of civic duty and I hate it. I want nothing more than to be able to finally say "I told you so" without being a smug asshole about it and ruining our friendship.
Thanks for reading my rant. It's probably a bit disjointed, but the frustration is boiling over and I needed to vent to the only group of people that seems to understand the hopelessness of being a disenfranchised leftist.
people constantly claim we're on the tipping point because we are. Project 2025 has planned out every single step to ruin the country for everyone but the 1%, and if Trump can't make it, someone else will. Last time Trump was unorganized and still caused massive chaos (Jan 6? Mexico wall anyone?). Republicans need to only win once to turn everything for the worse, and you are literally helping them. You had 4 years to get people to vote third party, and you failed. Now is time for harm reduction. Vote blue, especially if you're in one of the swing states, and help everyone out like a true commie.
I don't live in the US, it was your (as in the commie people living there) job to organize, I just care about people's well-being in general and recognize Trump's distopian hellscape.
Kamala isn't perfect, nobody is, not even you, but it's currently the best chance America has.
That's what they said the last time and the time before that and that and that and that and that and that. There's alwys something that makes it so we just have to accept this rotten dog of a candidate. If the rule you followed has brought you to this, of what use was the rule?
Furthermore whenever the dems do win, what is said of the left? "Oh turns out we didn't need them at all!" What happens when they lose? Then it is the fault of the left. We were on the tipping point last time as well and the dems have had 4 years to do something about it, you failed. Why should we vote for someone who will do nothing to take us back from the alleged brink we're at?
The country was on the precipice of destruction last election and the one before that and so on. The dems have had decades to pull us back from the alleged brink. They have now had 4 years in power, yet here we are once again. You failed. The dems are looking to lose to Donald Trump, yet somehow we failed? The dems lost a massive lead to Donald Trump, you failed. If you are a realist, then accept reality.
Why should people vote for a party that constantly cries wolf, yet never does anything about the wolf apart from copying the wolfs' policies, working with the wolf, calling for bipartisanship with the wolf party, bragging about how much more wolf-like they are than the wolf party and so on?
There's plenty of people voting third party or voting uncommited or abstaining from voting. Seems to me it has worked out completely well. I can imagine it's hard to understand when you are only ever thinking about the current election and never what happened in the past or what the future brings, but most things aren't done in a few years. I'm honestly impressed with how these movements are developing, considering the amount of ratfucking they've been subjected to.
You really do not understand politics, do you?
Did you think you had something here? "Nobody is perfect" is the dems ole-faithful. You can't go pobodys nerfect about genocide.
Trump did bad things. So have the Dems. And sincerely describing someone who actively supports genocide as "not perfect" just shows what a disingenuous lib you are. Your version of "harm reduction" has, for decades, done nothing but emphasize and prolong the harm.
I don't live in the US either. I just care about people's wellbeing in general. You should recognise that literally wherever on the planet you live, that organising and doing direct action would be more productive than telling people anywhere that voting matters. What a fucking waste of political energy.
I'm happy where my country stands at, thanks.
Right, so let's elect the guy who will do imminent and immediate harm, and a lot more of it, because that's better obviously
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2024/oct/17/trump-wins-elections-outcomes-stakes
I am a realist. The genocide, at least for now, won't stop, but we have the power to not make it worse. What do you chose?
There it is. "I don't care about anyone else, I like how my life is and want the status quo". Do direct action and organise to help OTHERS, if your country is a super paradise then do direct action to pressure your government into condemning genocide. Sadly I think you won't ever resort to actually doing something to help.
It's not worth engaging, really. You clearly know all this and actually just don't give a fuck.
I do care for people, hence why I'm writing here, in the hope of convincing even one person to vote the right person, since physically going there isnt feasible.
what if they already did? the US is such a huge economical power that no-one but themselves can push it towards a better future, and all the third party voters are doing is assuring that the genocide is gonna continue under Trump's regime (since that's basically what it is apparently, thank SCOTUS)
If you actually cared you'd spend the freetime you have to volunteer for a cause, the dems need people so go do something for them, since you care so much lmao. This isn't for anyone, you're doing this for you, because your brain gives you sweet sweet serotonine when you argue with strangers online
The country is currently, according to you, on the tipping edge of something cataclysmic and you're happy with that? Lmao
As opposed to the lady who will do imminent and immediate harm, but where dorks like you go outside and fight against it?
In your case the realistic option would be to acknowledge that your candidate has a better chance of winning the election if she stops supporting a genocide, and instead of arguing with leftists online you put your energy towards pushing your candidate to make those concessions. What do you choose?