You can criticize religion but come on you have to admit blasting depictions of Mohammed onto government buildings in response to the first beheading was a moronic idea that did nothing but make everything worse.
It's almost like Hebdo makes fun of everyone, they make fun of Catholics as well Keep on that attitude that you shouldn't do anything to upset Muslims. If someone feels that upset about a stupid cartoon that they go and behead someone, then maybe they should get their heads checked and it's their problem and not anyone elses
well obviously beheading someone over your religion is a ghastly and horrible act but its also a political act, and it didn't occur in a vaccuum. when muslims in france are ostracized and radicalized because of it, you don't .... continue to ostracize them even more after this.
I'm also part of a group that is used as cheap labor in Western Europe and lots of my countrymen are getting paid under minimum wage and living 10 people per apartment so they can send money back home to their families. Where are we killing people in the streets? Mexicans are ostracized in America and you don't see Mexican terrorists. There is something going on in those communities, we should follow the Chinese model. Reeducation, shutting down illegal mosques and ones who are spreading this kind of nonsense (many of whom are sponsored by Saudis), etc.
i agree that something has to be done like re education, but it has to be done well, in a way not to ostracize muslims in france further. my whole point is pouring fuel into the fire doesn't do anything good, it will have negative outcomes for muslims in france, and frankly, will result in more murders like this.
Except there is no way to do it without ruffling some feathers. You shut down some Saudi mosques, someone will get upset, you nationalize the hiring of imans, someone will get upset.
Did we forget that the return and expansion of "radical Islam" was a direct result of western intervention in emerging Middle Eastern SSR's? That the violent and brutal forces of reaction were directly funded and supported by the US state department in an attempt to cripple the development of socialism in the region? That to this day terrorism is still being directly funded and controlled by western powers against socialists.
This situation is clearly a result of religious radicalization coupled with poor material conditions. Just think about how many fundamentalists in America would snap and turn into extremists. It's not a specifically Islamic thing.
The purpose of religious extremism is to serve as a catch of false consciousness, to re-direct anyone who's beginning to understand that their conditions are shit and turn them into a tool of oppression against others who are gaining consciousness.
And I agree about stopping the inflammatory bullshit. It's in bad taste. Especially because there isn't any sort of racial equality. It's a joke at their expense.
i agree 100% with you. the other user, who i guess got banned lol, was being annoying but i was hoping i could get them to understand what they're saying in good faith, oh well. i mean we already have fundamentalists in america who snap and turn to extremists, and then kill people. if france wants to address the problem with islamic extremism in their own country they have to grapple with their past do something to hit the core of the issue. obv reeducation camps could work but you would have to try to tightrope deradicalization with allowing them to preserve their culture. thats ostensibly what china is doing, though who knows exactly whats going on there, im sure its probably better than whatever france could come up with.
blasting depictions of the prophet in response to this is just ludicrous. all it does is give french racists a smug feeling for being "cultured" while actually being responsible for a rise in extremism and violence. not only is it horrible and racist, its also stupid.
Yep, also you can't deradicalize without also fixing the initial problem of poor material conditions. Just arresting people and telling at them to not be terrorists isn't going to work. Would be cool to actually have legitimate reporting about China's de-radicalization programs in the west, but I guess the intelligence agencies have no interest in deradicalization. It's a tool that they aren't willing to part with.
You can criticize religion but come on you have to admit blasting depictions of Mohammed onto government buildings in response to the first beheading was a moronic idea that did nothing but make everything worse.
It's almost like Hebdo makes fun of everyone, they make fun of Catholics as well Keep on that attitude that you shouldn't do anything to upset Muslims. If someone feels that upset about a stupid cartoon that they go and behead someone, then maybe they should get their heads checked and it's their problem and not anyone elses
well obviously beheading someone over your religion is a ghastly and horrible act but its also a political act, and it didn't occur in a vaccuum. when muslims in france are ostracized and radicalized because of it, you don't .... continue to ostracize them even more after this.
I'm also part of a group that is used as cheap labor in Western Europe and lots of my countrymen are getting paid under minimum wage and living 10 people per apartment so they can send money back home to their families. Where are we killing people in the streets? Mexicans are ostracized in America and you don't see Mexican terrorists. There is something going on in those communities, we should follow the Chinese model. Reeducation, shutting down illegal mosques and ones who are spreading this kind of nonsense (many of whom are sponsored by Saudis), etc.
i agree that something has to be done like re education, but it has to be done well, in a way not to ostracize muslims in france further. my whole point is pouring fuel into the fire doesn't do anything good, it will have negative outcomes for muslims in france, and frankly, will result in more murders like this.
Except there is no way to do it without ruffling some feathers. You shut down some Saudi mosques, someone will get upset, you nationalize the hiring of imans, someone will get upset.
totally
but broadcasting depictions of mohammed on gov buildings generally has no good outcomes to it, its only intention is to ruffle feathers.
Did we forget that the return and expansion of "radical Islam" was a direct result of western intervention in emerging Middle Eastern SSR's? That the violent and brutal forces of reaction were directly funded and supported by the US state department in an attempt to cripple the development of socialism in the region? That to this day terrorism is still being directly funded and controlled by western powers against socialists.
This situation is clearly a result of religious radicalization coupled with poor material conditions. Just think about how many fundamentalists in America would snap and turn into extremists. It's not a specifically Islamic thing.
The purpose of religious extremism is to serve as a catch of false consciousness, to re-direct anyone who's beginning to understand that their conditions are shit and turn them into a tool of oppression against others who are gaining consciousness.
And I agree about stopping the inflammatory bullshit. It's in bad taste. Especially because there isn't any sort of racial equality. It's a joke at their expense.
i agree 100% with you. the other user, who i guess got banned lol, was being annoying but i was hoping i could get them to understand what they're saying in good faith, oh well. i mean we already have fundamentalists in america who snap and turn to extremists, and then kill people. if france wants to address the problem with islamic extremism in their own country they have to grapple with their past do something to hit the core of the issue. obv reeducation camps could work but you would have to try to tightrope deradicalization with allowing them to preserve their culture. thats ostensibly what china is doing, though who knows exactly whats going on there, im sure its probably better than whatever france could come up with.
blasting depictions of the prophet in response to this is just ludicrous. all it does is give french racists a smug feeling for being "cultured" while actually being responsible for a rise in extremism and violence. not only is it horrible and racist, its also stupid.
Yep, also you can't deradicalize without also fixing the initial problem of poor material conditions. Just arresting people and telling at them to not be terrorists isn't going to work. Would be cool to actually have legitimate reporting about China's de-radicalization programs in the west, but I guess the intelligence agencies have no interest in deradicalization. It's a tool that they aren't willing to part with.