My understanding is that the "personality disorders" section of the DSM was unreliable/wildly subjective and existed for completeness only rather than as a really valid diagnosis? This is almost certainly true in how the labels get used and I think somewhat undermines that these are disorders in a medical sense and just kind of a catchall for people that society doesn't like (I am aware of the overlap)
I know one diagnosed narcissist who fits the whole stereotype up and down, and I know a lot of other people with diagnosed personality disorders who are not the monsters society accuses them of being. I also know a lot of selfish assholes who have not been diagnosed with any mental health condition. I think to a large degree people use medical language to describe people who have hurt them or behaved badly, or just behaved in a way they don't like, because it reduces that person to an irredeemable, absolute monster. You can write them off as something inhuman, like a vampire, and absolve yourself for failing to recognize them, or their abusive behavior, or acting on it, or whatever feeling of guilt or failure is gnawing at you. P*do gets thrown around very casually the same way - If you can get your audience to accept that your opponent deserves the epithet then you can do whatever you want to the opponent. They're an absolute monster at that point.
It's not good. Medicalizing your opponent in an argument or whatever doesn't generally serve your argument. Yeah, yeah, fallacies, whatever, fuck the debate club nerds, but in this case the ad-hominem attack is something to be concerned about. And when it become a widespread way of shutting down someone's argument or speech or whatever in a community it can be readily weaponized by bad actors to disrupt the community.
And when it gets used often enough, people really do think that us actual narcisstists are irredeemable monsters. That's why I've been told to my face that I don't deserve to live because of my disability.
It's often more subtle than that, though. Constant, constant microaggressions. The most common problem being that neurotypical empathy doesn't work on narcissists and NTs tend to take personal offence when they can't read our minds.
Yeah, the way narcissist gets thrown around it's usually medicalizing selfish behavior or speech, or at least behavior and speech that the poster believes to be unusually selfish. But it's a word that gets thrown around very casually without much consideration.
https://www.etymonline.com/word/narcissism
Apparently it's always been a psychology term in English. There were instances where comparisons to Narcissus were used to accuse someone of excessive self love, but "narcissist", "narcissistic", and "narcissism" are all medical terms. And, of course, once someone has labelled you a narcissist there is no possible defense, because any attempt to defend yourself is ascribed to narcissism.
I'm fine with it being banned. Being an asshole is not a psychological disorder and doesn't need to be assigned to an underlying psychiatric condition that essentializes the persona and positions them as incapable of self reflection or acting in good faith.
The comparison between narcissism and anger management problems and pedophilia is much closer than autism, schizophrenia, or even just basic anxiety.
These people have problems with inhibitions that would ordinarily stop them from abusing other people. Not every mental disorder demands accomodation in the same way.
Sorry you thought you found one of life's cheat codes. You'll always be searching for those
You're so fucking pathetic trying this debate bro shit here. You have no fucking clue how many smug dipshits like you we brush off regularly. Just pack it up bud, go outside. I think you need some fresh air.
Have you checked your apartment for black mold? I know that can really fuck your brain up.
This is not a dishonest debating tactic and you are defending the idea that people with inhibition problems that threaten others need accomodations in the form of never being called out
Imagine we stopped using "mad" because some people have anger issues.
Imagine we stopped using "nonce" because, some people are pediphiles.
Imagine we stopped using "narcissist" because some people are narcissists.
Doesn't make any sense. They're pejorative for a reason. These are abusive tendencies towards others.
I think the issue here is that Magicker is medicalizing bad behavior. They're not saying someone behaved badly, they're saying someone has a medical condition that makes them inherently evil and untrustworthy. You can say someone is being selfish, or lying, or being unreasonable, or whatever, without diagnosing them.
totes fair, i was thinking it through myself and trying to explain it is one of the ways I do that. i had to go hunting around to find that the term has always been medical.
if the user in question hadn't posted about getting help, I might agree with you. but I've had my mind changed. running to 4chan to bully people is coward shit.
That doesn't have any relevance to the conversation about the use of the word constituting a slur.
The latter two points are just conjecture. I told you I happened to find hexbear screenshots on "chans". I happen to agree with the takes. You're just assuming that the takes were on 4chan.
Sorry but I actually know a thing or two about psychology (not from Tiktok) and I'm not terribly swayed by forum users going off out-of-context screenshots
It's extremely hilarious to see all these midwit redditors wandering in, seeing new ideas to them framed in ways they have never considered before, whose mental fortitude just collapses and all they can do is insist that a bunch of leftists who have been exposed to liberal bullshit their entire lives and everywhere outside of Hexbear, must be the ones shuttering themselves into an echo chamber. You're the first one to grasp for a philosophical metaphor (and fail, of course) but it's all the same shit. Ignorant, uninteresting liberals panicking at new ideas and trying to comfort themselves with any possible excuse.
Yeah, see, you've had Platos Cave explained to you and you're still misusing it. No one is that stupid, so the bit becomes too obvious. You messed up the bit.
My fellow Hexbear users aren't familiar with all the logical fallacies we should avoid in debates, so we tend to use ad hominems and such way too often. We especially use the Preconception Prejudice Bias too much, link if you're unfamiliar.
Wasn't the nword blocked by the slur filter for awhile now?
since the beginning of the website lol
Maybe they aren't referring to the N-word, but to the literal phrase "n-word"
They're referring to "narcissist". Which should be banned as a pejorative because it's the name of a mental disability.
My understanding is that the "personality disorders" section of the DSM was unreliable/wildly subjective and existed for completeness only rather than as a really valid diagnosis? This is almost certainly true in how the labels get used and I think somewhat undermines that these are disorders in a medical sense and just kind of a catchall for people that society doesn't like (I am aware of the overlap)
I know one diagnosed narcissist who fits the whole stereotype up and down, and I know a lot of other people with diagnosed personality disorders who are not the monsters society accuses them of being. I also know a lot of selfish assholes who have not been diagnosed with any mental health condition. I think to a large degree people use medical language to describe people who have hurt them or behaved badly, or just behaved in a way they don't like, because it reduces that person to an irredeemable, absolute monster. You can write them off as something inhuman, like a vampire, and absolve yourself for failing to recognize them, or their abusive behavior, or acting on it, or whatever feeling of guilt or failure is gnawing at you. P*do gets thrown around very casually the same way - If you can get your audience to accept that your opponent deserves the epithet then you can do whatever you want to the opponent. They're an absolute monster at that point.
It's not good. Medicalizing your opponent in an argument or whatever doesn't generally serve your argument. Yeah, yeah, fallacies, whatever, fuck the debate club nerds, but in this case the ad-hominem attack is something to be concerned about. And when it become a widespread way of shutting down someone's argument or speech or whatever in a community it can be readily weaponized by bad actors to disrupt the community.
And when it gets used often enough, people really do think that us actual narcisstists are irredeemable monsters. That's why I've been told to my face that I don't deserve to live because of my disability.
It's often more subtle than that, though. Constant, constant microaggressions. The most common problem being that neurotypical empathy doesn't work on narcissists and NTs tend to take personal offence when they can't read our minds.
doctors never fail to be the absolute worst
Occasionally they do
Yeah, the way narcissist gets thrown around it's usually medicalizing selfish behavior or speech, or at least behavior and speech that the poster believes to be unusually selfish. But it's a word that gets thrown around very casually without much consideration.
Apparently it's always been a psychology term in English. There were instances where comparisons to Narcissus were used to accuse someone of excessive self love, but "narcissist", "narcissistic", and "narcissism" are all medical terms. And, of course, once someone has labelled you a narcissist there is no possible defense, because any attempt to defend yourself is ascribed to narcissism.
I'm fine with it being banned. Being an asshole is not a psychological disorder and doesn't need to be assigned to an underlying psychiatric condition that essentializes the persona and positions them as incapable of self reflection or acting in good faith.
Also serves to poison the well in cases where acting out of self-interest might genuinely be called for.
I always assumed it was a non-medical term first, that changes things.
Go look at the actual thread 🤣
The person who's definitely not the aggrieved narcissist from the other thread sure has a lot to say about me gently ribbing them
yep, I'm very protective of new users who ask for accommodation. I'm not ashamed of that.
Me when I pretend the person saying the word "narcissist" is okay to use thinks we should use the N word
(I am screenshotting a sentence where they say the opposite)
no no I think it's very funny you think the nword is at all comparable with cracker.
Let's make it boneheaded so you can't miss it:
Saying "narcissist" is a slur is like saying "cracker" is a slur.
yep a user asking for accommodation is just like the oppressor
This is also much like when pedophiles try to include themselves in the "neurodiverse community"
The comparison between narcissism and anger management problems and pedophilia is much closer than autism, schizophrenia, or even just basic anxiety.
These people have problems with inhibitions that would ordinarily stop them from abusing other people. Not every mental disorder demands accomodation in the same way.
Sorry you thought you found one of life's cheat codes. You'll always be searching for those
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This is similar to how people call sexuality a "drive" when it's just an incentive reward system in the brain, not a survival thing.
You're so fucking pathetic trying this debate bro shit here. You have no fucking clue how many smug dipshits like you we brush off regularly. Just pack it up bud, go outside. I think you need some fresh air.
Have you checked your apartment for black mold? I know that can really fuck your brain up.
You all have literally learned psychology from youtube and tiktok, that's where all the resources in /c/neurodiverse@hexbear.net lead
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This is not a dishonest debating tactic and you are defending the idea that people with inhibition problems that threaten others need accomodations in the form of never being called out
Imagine we stopped using "mad" because some people have anger issues.
Imagine we stopped using "nonce" because, some people are pediphiles.
Imagine we stopped using "narcissist" because some people are narcissists.
Doesn't make any sense. They're pejorative for a reason. These are abusive tendencies towards others.
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I'd like you to do better too. Thank you so much for engaging in good faith Comrade™️
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How does not calling out negative behaviors help people who are themselves trying to limit them
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I think the issue here is that Magicker is medicalizing bad behavior. They're not saying someone behaved badly, they're saying someone has a medical condition that makes them inherently evil and untrustworthy. You can say someone is being selfish, or lying, or being unreasonable, or whatever, without diagnosing them.
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totes fair, i was thinking it through myself and trying to explain it is one of the ways I do that. i had to go hunting around to find that the term has always been medical.
OP is deliberately misrepresenting what's going on haha, whatever it's not important. You have a good one
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Oh don't worry about me sweetums
if the user in question hadn't posted about getting help, I might agree with you. but I've had my mind changed. running to 4chan to bully people is coward shit.
That doesn't have any relevance to the conversation about the use of the word constituting a slur.
The latter two points are just conjecture. I told you I happened to find hexbear screenshots on "chans". I happen to agree with the takes. You're just assuming that the takes were on 4chan.
DEBAAAAATE MEEEEEEE!!!! WAAAAAHHHHHHH!!!
Shut the fuck up nerd.
You're doing Stalin's work comrade
Holy shit this is the dumbest shit I've ever heard.
This has gotta be a bit. No way this guy is real.
Sorry but I actually know a thing or two about psychology (not from Tiktok) and I'm not terribly swayed by forum users going off out-of-context screenshots
The psychology bachelor's degree haver has logged on
Basic competency and reading comperhension haver
Says the guy who consistently does not understand Plato's Cave, a literal intro to philosophy concept covered in one or two lectures
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It's extremely hilarious to see all these midwit redditors wandering in, seeing new ideas to them framed in ways they have never considered before, whose mental fortitude just collapses and all they can do is insist that a bunch of leftists who have been exposed to liberal bullshit their entire lives and everywhere outside of Hexbear, must be the ones shuttering themselves into an echo chamber. You're the first one to grasp for a philosophical metaphor (and fail, of course) but it's all the same shit. Ignorant, uninteresting liberals panicking at new ideas and trying to comfort themselves with any possible excuse.
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Yeah you're just being cringe on purpose now. The smug Redditor parody is way too obvious to be real. Sorry, the bit is old now.
This is a narcissistic circlejerk within the Plato's Cave of the western left, watchers of the shadows projected by the US polity 🧐
The definition of cringe here is being anything outside that
Yeah, see, you've had Platos Cave explained to you and you're still misusing it. No one is that stupid, so the bit becomes too obvious. You messed up the bit.
You're just doing the site bit of deliberately misunderstanding things when it suits you to "own the chud"
I've pointed out before you'll say a house rep with like 6 kids has "incel energy"
Incel is a state of mind. Like you might have children of your own (I seriously hope you do not) but I would still say you have incel energy.
My fellow Hexbear users aren't familiar with all the logical fallacies we should avoid in debates, so we tend to use ad hominems and such way too often. We especially use the Preconception Prejudice Bias too much, link if you're unfamiliar.
Cracker isn’t a slur it’s a scientific designation for “soulless monster”
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