I had always assumed that if a man had gotten a woman pregnant, then if that pregnancy is carried to term, both partners should be financially responsible for the child regardless whether the man had wanted to have the child or not. The mindset being "they got them pregnant, so you have to face the consequences'".

I was talking with some people online, and they asserted that if the man did not want to have the child, then they should be able to apply to be resolved of any financial responsibility towards caring for it. I was at first against this proposal, but I feel like I now understand it better. Our current legislation was created at a time where abortion was tantamount to murder, and since it was illegal, an obligation of financial responsibility was the only way to ensure that women weren't stranded with children they couldn't afford to raise. But now that we live in a world where abortion is legal (for now), and where abortion procedures are safer than carrying the child to term, there doesn't seem to be a good argument for men still needing to be financially responsible for unwanted children. Men probably would still need to assist in paying for the procedure, but outside of that, I think they had a point. Please explain to me if there is anything I'm failing to consider here.

I also want to apologize for the binary language I used in writing this. I tried at first to write this in a more inclusive way, but I struggled wrapping my head around it. If anyone can educate me in how to write in a way that doesn't disclude non-binary comrades, I would appreciate it.

  • ofriceandruin [none/use name]
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    4 years ago

    This whole "this is what adults do" rhetoric is straight out of the right-wing playbook, as I've said many times before.

    The solution is simple, state child support and no more shaming making this an individual problem. I thought we lived in a society? Not some kind of thatcherite hell-hole.

    • gay [any]
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      4 years ago

      This whole “this is what adults do” rhetoric is straight out of the right-wing playbook, as I’ve said many times before.

      No, they say you have to get married to fuck. I say you have to do sexual activities that fit your threat level. If the 1% failure rate of birth control is too much for you, go give head and get fucked in the ass or choose partners who have no way of getting pregnant (older cis women, cis women with no wombs, trans women... cis men?)

      The solution is simple, state child support and no more shaming making this an individual problem. I thought we lived in a society? Not some kind of thatcherite hell-hole.

      You're gonna have to wait will we reach full space gay communism to fuck babes raw, sorry

        • gay [any]
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          4 years ago

          We're gonna have to wait till fully space gay communism to have college education and healthcare absolutely for free, not through taxes. Right now I'm okay with telling men to get pegged, get sterilized or be celibate if the don't want to face the tiniest possibility of paying for child support (which... could also not happen if the child is adopted).

          • ofriceandruin [none/use name]
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            4 years ago

            We’re gonna have to wait till fully space gay communism to have college education and healthcare absolutely for free, not through taxes. Right now I’m okay with telling men to get pegged, get sterilized or be celibate if the don’t want to face the tiniest possibility of paying for child support

            And right now I'm ok with telling men to not pay for something they don't want. If you don't want the child, you shouldn't be forced to pay.

            • gay [any]
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              4 years ago

              And right now I’m ok with telling men to not pay for something they don’t want.

              Cause you're dumb

              If you don’t want the child, you shouldn’t be forced to pay

              How'bout you invest in some condoms, practice your pull-out game? Or maybe stop putting your dick in people who can conceive?

              What's funny is that you're acting like leaving the child without access to food, healthcare, housing and education is not a super common thing to do nowadays lmao. Men still do that, don't worry

              • ofriceandruin [none/use name]
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                4 years ago

                How’bout you invest in some condoms, practice your pull-out game? Or maybe stop putting your dick in people who can conceive?

                Thanks Jordan Peterson for the personal responsibility "buck up buckaroo" pep talk.

                Men still do that, don’t worry

                Yeah I know, so let's have a support system in place. Maybe if there wasn't such a burden for support, those men might even be involved positively in the kid's life. Our current system right now is just creating all sorts of negative incentives to just dump the kid.

                • gay [any]
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                  4 years ago

                  Maybe if there wasn’t such a burden for support, those men might even be involved positively in the kid’s life

                  :agony-consuming:

                  "Sorry kid, I engaged in consensual sexual activity that could get your other parent pregnant and decided I couldn't vibe with you. I know you're the product of my actions and that the smallest thing I could do is make sure you don't die in your first 18 years of life... maybe even less if your other parent had a partner who was willing to adopt you... but yeah the state is just so oppressive"

                  What even are material conditions.

                  MRAs be like: I'm so mad when I can't dump children in the middle of the forest. Why do they have to be human people smh

                  • ofriceandruin [none/use name]
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                    4 years ago

                    What even are material conditions

                    Precisely, which is why I'm proposing something to replace our current system, i.e. make the material conditions better for all parties.

                    • gay [any]
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                      4 years ago

                      "Precisely, which is why I’m proposing something to replace our current system, i.e. make the material conditions better for all parties." - The Origin of the Family, Private Property and the State, Friedrich Engels

                        • gay [any]
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                          4 years ago

                          No. I adhere to "person who did sex that could end in conception and the person who decided that abortion and adoption weren't for for them has to help the child live because that's a human person".

                          Again, sorry that current society makes having sex that can end in conception so inconvenient. Jokerfying as we speak

                          • ofriceandruin [none/use name]
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                            4 years ago

                            Sorry that this is such a struggle session for you. Clearly I haven't done the proper hermeneutics on engels and marx to be able to come to the conclusion that if someone doesn't want a child that they should be forced to pay support when it's not only concievable, but doable right now to have a system of universal support in place.

                            • gay [any]
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                              4 years ago

                              Marx lost so many kids, I'm sure he understood how vulnerable they are when they're little. And then would dunk on you for being so immature when it comes to sex

                              • ofriceandruin [none/use name]
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                                4 years ago

                                Marx also had financial support... from Engels. So is it hard to ask for societal support?

                                Also, Marx wasn't the ideal father, and I imagine if you were living back then you'd be doing this weird shaming that you're doing now, ironically.

                                • gay [any]
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                                  4 years ago

                                  Marx was struggling HARD with money lmao

                                    • gay [any]
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                                      4 years ago

                                      You're acting like its comparable to abandoning a child with a parent who can't cover all the child's need? NGL, kinda cringe