1. It would be infinitely safer

  2. It’s not worth dying on behalf of the Democratic Party

  3. She’d be able to radicalize far more young people and be the most popular streamer in history

  4. IT’S NOT WORTH DYING FOR THE FUCKIN DEMOCRATS holy shit talk about a close call

  • CyborgMarx [any, any]
    ·
    4 years ago

    All politics in the west is a lifestyle brand, leftists shouldn't be denying reality just because it makes us unconformable, you organize around the conditions that actually exist not the conditions we wished to exist

    Besides, the Bernie campaign did manage to successfully pull American politics slightly leftwards and massively swelled the ranks of people who were actually willing to consider socialism in the US

    People say this, but forget that without Trump on the other side of that equation Bernie's message would have hit the same way it hit the previous 40 years, which is to say not that well, and AOC is no Bernie and never will be, unless of course Ben Shapiro somehow becomes a Trumpian like figure for the American right in the next 20 years, in which case she may have a chance

    • machiavellianRecluse [none/use name]
      ·
      4 years ago

      All politics in the west is a lifestyle brand, leftists shouldn’t be denying reality just because it makes us unconformable, you organize around the conditions that actually exist not the conditions we wished to exist

      I think then it is our task to figure out how to change this. Being only a lifestyle brand will guarantee we don't make a dent on imperialism but create a group of people who grow old look at their bills and think (oh yeah politics was just fun activity who has the time -- and rightfully so). I will be honest something like m4a while good would be a hollow victory to me if it means we dust our hands go home and forget about the cost that America exacts on the world. There is a reason so many "radicals" from the anti-war movement in 1960s onwards just joined the establishment.

      People say this, but forget that without Trump on the other side of that equation Bernie’s message would have hit the

      That is a gross mischaracterization. In 2016 Bernie was popular not because of Trump but because he represented an alternative outside of Hilary (like Trump is a reason he had to fold, do you think he would endorse Hilary so readily if the opponent was someone other than Trump?). He is the result of decades of austerity in the neoliberal era.

      • CyborgMarx [any, any]
        ·
        4 years ago

        In 2016 Bernie was popular not because of Trump but because he represented an alternative outside of Hilary

        Bernie got his shot in spring 2016 because Trump broke all the political taboos in the fall and late summer of 2015, and he scared people, a lot of people, Hillary didn't become a major player until AFTER bernie folded. It was Trump who struck the populist tone first (and stuck with it) not bernie, even tho he was better at it (for a couple months until he folded)

        do you think he would endorse Hilary so readily if the opponent was someone other than Trump?

        Yes, absolutely, bernie would have folded no matter what, the narrative works for any Republican which is why the dems will do the same thing in 2022 and 2024, they're never gonna stop and the succ dems will continue to fold

        • machiavellianRecluse [none/use name]
          ·
          4 years ago

          Hillary didn’t become a major player until AFTER bernie folded.

          Uhh what? If Bernie could win then why would he fold. Not sure what you mean here. Unless we are just talking about social media hype or something. Edit: I know the Dems ratfucked Bernie but I just am having trouble understanding what you meant here (like what do you mean by a major player? Likely to win the dem primary? Media attention? Polling or something? If you have souces on say polling or something then that would be great).

          Yes, absolutely, bernie would have folded no matter what, the narrative works for any Republican which is why the dems will do the same thing in 2022 and 2024, they’re never gonna stop and the succ dems will continue to fold

          I don't disagree with this and I see that proving that something won't happen "as easily" is virtually impossible. But I would say that he folded far too easily this time around (as opposed to the last cycle) and the only explanation I can give is that he really wanted a united stand against Trump (and maybe he really didn't want people voting in covid season). In any case, this direction of discussion is probably pointless.