So in the UK the tories and media keep saying the national debt is the highest its been since the ww2 (which is true of pretty much any year since the 80s). And that we need to raise taxes, tighten our belts etc to pay back what we borrowed to get us thru the pandemic.
Now I know this kind of treating a countries finances like household finances and talking about national debt like its credit card debt is disingenuous and just used as a way to justify squeezing people more than they are already.
But what I don't know with enough authority to be able to talk to people about it is why this is the case? How is national debt different and wtf is it? Who do we owe it to and do we even need to pay it back etc?
Ofc I know the whole thing is bullshit anyway any only exists to preserve the current power structure but let's leave that for now.
Be good to hear thoughts from someone who knows things.
less than 30% of the debt, you make that sound like a fucking miminal amount, but when you compare the GDP of tons of fucking countries how you minimalize it would be tantamount to a fucking deserved death sentence.
japan isn't ruffling any fucking feathers asshole, they have long ago decided they were willing to participate in the global hegemony. they're a fucking capitalist country completely aligned with the united states. singapore is also on good terms with the capitalist government of the united states.
the argument is that the US completely runs the fucking global economy and should they fucking choose to default on whatever the fuck they want they've got the bombs to do whatever the fuck they want. why the fuck do you think we've got all the nukes?
yeah it's just bonds... that's all it is, tell that to grenada. you let us get your resources by "competing" in the global market or we'll just take your shit. and the US doesn't even really give a fuck about the corporations, if it came down to it and the corporations did anything to try to bow out, the US would just go full fascist, ban travel, and take everything.
What? What does the GPD of other countries have to do with this? Your argument is that the US doesn't care about debt because somehow they don't have to pay back foreign debt. Except they do, and even if they didn't have to, what about the other 70+% of debt that isn't concerning them?
So? Again, what does all this irrelevant shit have to do with this? Are you saying that other countries are not expecting Japan or Singapore to pay back debt because they aren't annoying the US? Have they also secretly defaulted? Wtf is your argument lol.
Yes, any country can default regardless of bombs, and in the case of most countries, no one will invade them. Like, idk, Argentina last year. In fact many do. It's just really bad for their economy because not just other countries, but also private entities WITHIN the country don't want to buy the bonds any more as well as a bunch of other related consequences.
National debt is not a downpayment. National debt is interest on bonds semiannually as well as a larger sum when the bond matures, which is usually a set date years later. There's a bunch of different types of Bonds you can buy, with different maturities etc. So the US has to CONSTANTLY pay all of these (either interest or payments after the bond matures) to different creditors. It's not a case of "gimme money, I'll give it back to you whenever I want". If the US stops paying, then they default. The US has never defaulted in its history, and, again, it's not a case of having to pay back the debt EVENTUALLY, there isn't some kind of big payment day that they're pushing back, there's just an ever increasing sum that they pay back all the time, month after month after month with no signs of being anywhere close to default, because debt is not just losing money, debt is also the way countries cover their deficits and gain a large sum of money they need for the short term to function and/or create growth. So your claim simply does not correspond to reality.
I already explained it to you, jeez.
Did Grenada own US debt and wanted the US to pay it back? LOL.
Who tf is "you"?
Lol what
I'm not sure there is much point in continuing this, you seem dead set on being wrong and you're ignoring what's being said.
your entire point of view ignores imperialism as a precursor to capitalism, and fails to address the US defense budget.
No it doesn't. You're just wrong and confused by what national debt is. I explained to you why US imperialism is a thing, and it has nothing to do with national debt default, which the US has never ever done and is not interested in doing. Also imperialism is not a "precursor" to capitalism wtf are you saying lol read, idk, something, for instance Lenin.
yeah about that
What is it with you constantly posting links that disprove your point in the title and somehow thinking they prove your point?
Do you know what precursor means? If you actually read the book it literally says imperialism came AFTER colonialism, and it is a product, NOT a precursor of modern capitalism.
Now can you find ONE instance of the US defaulting on debt, or any serious economist, marxist or otherwise, who believes the US is planning to default on debt any time soon?
the point is not that the US has defaulted, it's that they will never have to. whether they have or not is irrelevant. nuclear weapons ensure they won't have to. ever. is anyone collecting on US debt? we have the highest national debt, do you think it's a fucking coincidence that no one is knocking?
do you think imperialism existed before or after capitalism?
Sigh. Look, this is gonna be my last reply., you can simply google all this stuff or idk ask someone, all of what I'm gonna say is uncontroversial info, none of it is opinion.
First of all, "precursor" means "before". Except the book you linked to is literally about imperialism being a product of modern capitalism, so after.
Second, yes, everyone is collecting US debt, all the time. This was explained multiple times. Ask any rando with a bond. Again, national debt isn't like a loan shark banging your door to get his money. It's a bunch of coupons and payments that are happening all the time for millions of different bonds that have been sold to millions of different entities, including entities that own thousands of different bonds purchased at different dates with different properties, due dates, and interest rates. All of these entities are pretty much automatically receiving what they are supposed to bit by bit regularly. The reason US debt is increasing is not because the US is ignoring the creditors and failing to repay (which would be a default) but because it is issuing more bonds and accruing more debt (often but not necessarily to the same entities) than it repays. Again, not by failing to pay up, but by getting NEW debt. The creditors aren't tapping their feet impatiently waiting for the US to decide to repay them, the US does repay them exactly when they expect to be repaid (which is why the US can have a stable AAA credit rating), it's just that they (or other creditors) are also lending more to the US by buying new bonds. These new bonds are in turn sold precisely because US bonds are extremely reliable, and the US regularly pays interest as well as the payments after the bonds expire all the time. And if they were ever short on money to pay the bonds they'd just print more.
Third, a default is literally when you stop paying your debt. If they have never defaulted it means they've never failed to pay up debt. When you say "they will never have to default", then what you're saying is that they'll never fail to pay back debt. It's the opposite of what you are trying to say.
"highest" doesn't always mean "latest." if you think that imperialism only existed after captialism you're fucking wrong and rethink your position.
your second paragraph was just a wall of bullshit.
default means officially saying that you can't pay. the US will never have to default because if anyone feels like collecting and they don't want to pay they'll just invade or bomb them.
adios.
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You know it's time to disengage when someone with the username Contrarian tells you to disengage.
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