The Nazi Germany stuff bothers me the most. Like, I think a lot of people don't realize how lucky the Germans were. They were never, ever going to win, they literally didn't have the equipment, fuel, etc to do so. It was just a question of how long they would last and how many people they would kill before that point. The USSR and the USA briefly being on the same team is just too much.
People that do this about the Civil War are stupid for basically the same reasons btw
That's the thing that really gets me about WW2. If the French actually took some precaution and preempted the idea that the Germans were going to pull off an extremely bold, risky offensive because The only conceivable way for Germany to have won the battle of France was a lightning fast offensive that took France out of the war before French Colonial and British troops and supplies made their way into France, then France could have easily won. Germany went with the only plan that COULD have won them the war, even though it was extremely unlikely to work, but it did and now human history has been changed forever. If the Germans slipped up or if the French actually could have predicted Germany's plans, the war could have been over by 1941, even without Soviet or American intervention
Hell, the French and British could have started and ended the war by 1939 if they actually pulled up their fucking big boy pants and deposed Hitler for very blatantly violating the Treaty of Versailles by unifying with Austria, but no, because instead we just needed "appeasement"
Yeah the German and to some extent Japanese leadership had to go to war for the preservation of their own personal power.
Hitler did a fake economic miracle by borrowing money at an incredible rate, so badly that German capitalism was bound to collapse again in just a couple years if Germany did not overthrow their debtors, enslave much of Europe, and steal gold.
Of course Hitler's internal logic was "if I do nothing I definitely have to resign in disgrace, but hey if I kill 40, 50 million people then I have a chance!"
This is what a lot of a presentation for my history class was about, basically what if the Germans never got their Munich agreement and then got crushed by the combined arms of France, the USSR, and Czechoslovakia. German forces would get bogged down in the mountains of Czechia and would never get through the line. After a few months, the sheer military might of France and the Soviets would have beaten the Nazis back, and a red and gold flag would hang over the Reichstag 5 years earlier. Of course, no ww2 means a radical change in the course of history, which my presentation was mostly about. It's so interesting to think about how different it all could have gone if the Brits had some backbone/sense as to not give the Nazis everything they wanted.
While this is just some nerd on the internet speculating about history, I'm pretty sure that Germany STILL would have lost even if France/UK enforced the treaty if Versailles AND the Soviets stayed out of it. Germany wasn't in a place for a protracted war and could have been easily snipped in the bud if they went early
Oh yeah, Germany was a literal paper tiger in terms of their actual military strength, any real pressure on them in 1937-1938 would have caused either them backing down from their claims, or if they went to war on the Allies terms they would be swiftly defeated, whether through blockade ala ww1 or a full on invasion through France.
At least that is what I assume, as our world allowed the Nazis to enforce their claims and get away with stupidly risky maneuvers,both political and militarily.
Thing is, there's a lot of potential win conditions for Germany. Imperial countries sue for peace, write up new treaties and draw new lines on the map, and wash your hands of the whole affair. All of Germany's newly obtained wealth off the back of that murder and brutality just becomes a footnote in the history books just like it is in the history books of every imperial power.
There's a lot of potential endings to World War 2 that involve imperialists shaking hands in a smoke filled room and just agreeing on new borders while they all switch their attention towards how they're going to divide up Africa and South America and Asia. The Soviet Union entering the war changed that. And even then a tremendous amount of work was done to reform Germany's standing as a European power.
The what ifs are always "what if they didn't do something inconceivably stupid at Dunkirk/Stalingrad", without asking the question "wait, why should the military that consistently makes incredibly dumb decisions, and is under equipped and faces resources shortages win?"
The Nazis, I mean. Off the top of my head, having the rest of Europe play appeasement, having Spain not be communist, and taking both the French and the Soviets at least partially by surprise.
Beyond that, their victory condition was to take over the USSR at an incredibly rapid pace. The window between the spring mud getting solid enough to drive on and winter coming is just too short to take over all of Russia. Even if they had taken Moscow, it's not like Stalin just says "oh well" and surrenders, fuck no.
Sorry for the late & short response, today was busy and I have an early morning tomorrow as well
The Nazi Germany stuff bothers me the most. Like, I think a lot of people don't realize how lucky the Germans were. They were never, ever going to win, they literally didn't have the equipment, fuel, etc to do so. It was just a question of how long they would last and how many people they would kill before that point. The USSR and the USA briefly being on the same team is just too much.
People that do this about the Civil War are stupid for basically the same reasons btw
Not to mention their ideology was basically a hundred contradictions in a trenchcoat
No shortage of that running around the world on any given day.
The Battle of France is never one of the things that gets alternate historied. Not even Hitler expected it to go as well as it did.
That's the thing that really gets me about WW2. If the French actually took some precaution and preempted the idea that the Germans were going to pull off an extremely bold, risky offensive because The only conceivable way for Germany to have won the battle of France was a lightning fast offensive that took France out of the war before French Colonial and British troops and supplies made their way into France, then France could have easily won. Germany went with the only plan that COULD have won them the war, even though it was extremely unlikely to work, but it did and now human history has been changed forever. If the Germans slipped up or if the French actually could have predicted Germany's plans, the war could have been over by 1941, even without Soviet or American intervention
Hell, the French and British could have started and ended the war by 1939 if they actually pulled up their fucking big boy pants and deposed Hitler for very blatantly violating the Treaty of Versailles by unifying with Austria, but no, because instead we just needed "appeasement"
Yeah the German and to some extent Japanese leadership had to go to war for the preservation of their own personal power.
Hitler did a fake economic miracle by borrowing money at an incredible rate, so badly that German capitalism was bound to collapse again in just a couple years if Germany did not overthrow their debtors, enslave much of Europe, and steal gold.
Of course Hitler's internal logic was "if I do nothing I definitely have to resign in disgrace, but hey if I kill 40, 50 million people then I have a chance!"
This is what a lot of a presentation for my history class was about, basically what if the Germans never got their Munich agreement and then got crushed by the combined arms of France, the USSR, and Czechoslovakia. German forces would get bogged down in the mountains of Czechia and would never get through the line. After a few months, the sheer military might of France and the Soviets would have beaten the Nazis back, and a red and gold flag would hang over the Reichstag 5 years earlier. Of course, no ww2 means a radical change in the course of history, which my presentation was mostly about. It's so interesting to think about how different it all could have gone if the Brits had some backbone/sense as to not give the Nazis everything they wanted.
While this is just some nerd on the internet speculating about history, I'm pretty sure that Germany STILL would have lost even if France/UK enforced the treaty if Versailles AND the Soviets stayed out of it. Germany wasn't in a place for a protracted war and could have been easily snipped in the bud if they went early
Oh yeah, Germany was a literal paper tiger in terms of their actual military strength, any real pressure on them in 1937-1938 would have caused either them backing down from their claims, or if they went to war on the Allies terms they would be swiftly defeated, whether through blockade ala ww1 or a full on invasion through France.
At least that is what I assume, as our world allowed the Nazis to enforce their claims and get away with stupidly risky maneuvers,both political and militarily.
Thing is, there's a lot of potential win conditions for Germany. Imperial countries sue for peace, write up new treaties and draw new lines on the map, and wash your hands of the whole affair. All of Germany's newly obtained wealth off the back of that murder and brutality just becomes a footnote in the history books just like it is in the history books of every imperial power.
There's a lot of potential endings to World War 2 that involve imperialists shaking hands in a smoke filled room and just agreeing on new borders while they all switch their attention towards how they're going to divide up Africa and South America and Asia. The Soviet Union entering the war changed that. And even then a tremendous amount of work was done to reform Germany's standing as a European power.
because it was the Belgian's fault and they try to cover this up
The Belgians deliberately ensuring Hitler beat France is 100% what I would expect from the tbh
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the nazis rolled basically the best land force at the time (them or the rkka) by doing something so inconceivably stupid it actually somehow worked
The what ifs are always "what if they didn't do something inconceivably stupid at Dunkirk/Stalingrad", without asking the question "wait, why should the military that consistently makes incredibly dumb decisions, and is under equipped and faces resources shortages win?"
uh... which ones and how?
The Nazis, I mean. Off the top of my head, having the rest of Europe play appeasement, having Spain not be communist, and taking both the French and the Soviets at least partially by surprise.
Beyond that, their victory condition was to take over the USSR at an incredibly rapid pace. The window between the spring mud getting solid enough to drive on and winter coming is just too short to take over all of Russia. Even if they had taken Moscow, it's not like Stalin just says "oh well" and surrenders, fuck no.
Sorry for the late & short response, today was busy and I have an early morning tomorrow as well