This is actually the most correct he's ever been shown to be. He didn't want to throw in with Kreegyr because Kreegyr was an idiot who was going to get his people killed, and he was exactly right about that. Hell, he talked shit about people who wanted to restore the Republic and he's ultimately shown to be right about that too, given the Sequels
An interesting angle is that Andor says in the movie that he's been fighting the empire since he was 6, and the Andor show runners decided to portray him as a child on a planet devastated by imperial extraction... Except the imperial extraction was long before the Old Republic became the Galactic Empire.
I think they're not going to forget that he's ideologically aligned against the liberal Old Republic almost as much as the Empire.
That's true. Hell, when Maarva takes him, she outright says that the Republic is on its way and they'll kill everyone there.
I'm mostly excited for what this could do for the portrayal of Mon Mothma, given that we know she's ideologically committed to restoring the Republic, and eventually does
And when Clem (andors dad) gets executed for rabble rousing protest policing, is it stormtroopers or clone troopers who do the deed? Does Syril’s childhood bedroom have stormtrooper or clone trooper action figures? The Republic was a type of Empire
Also, Karn's childhood room has a bunch of clone trooper action figures. It's such an interesting detail to specifically say that that little fascist shit grew up idolizing the Republic
I love this line of thinking because the prequels and Clone Wars were basically about how the Republic was basically already an empire, but they rarely if ever seemed to acknowledge that. This thing that feels like the central theme of those works also somehow feels like subtext. Like, the very first episode of Clone Wars has Yoda convince people to join the Republic and the episode ends with a Republic Cruiser, which obviously looks very similar to a Star Destroyer, entering their system. There's a little tongue-in-cheek irony to it, but it's mostly played as a victory rather than very ominous symbolism. And I've had multiple arguments with people who thought that the slavery of the clones was fine because the Jedi treated them well, which A) no they didn't, they threw them into a meat grinder and B) even if they did, they're still basically child soliders.
My point is, I'm glad we have a work directly engaging with this thought and I hope they go further with it. And now I also want something set before or during the prequels that explores this even more, and explicitly.
The Umbara arc is the biggest missed opportunity in the "clones are slaves" and to this day it irritates me.
General Krell basically mistreated the clones, kept throwing them in harm's way because his strategy was just brute forcing everything, and it got to the point he was going to execute soldiers who take out a giant enemy ship because their mission was unauthorised.
The clones only turned against him when it was revealed he was working against the Republic, which lets the audience paint his disregard for clone lives as "oh he was just evil, the jedi don't do that"
Someone once said the arc should have ended in the clones turning against him after the execution order and covering it up, basically rising up and defending themselves.
I would like that. Honestly, the thing I'd like the most is if Krell was never a Seperatist, if he was just really callous and cruel to his clones and the Jedi knew and enabled it because he "got results". That was basically the Jedi strategy at a structural level anyway.
I stole this part from A More Civilized Age, but what if that was the case, and then there was one more episode at the end of the arc for his trial and the Jedi just closed rank to protect him from what they viewed as (maybe correctly?) a power play by Palpatine?
That could be cool, but I do really like the idea that the clones just off him, blame it on the Umbarans and then swear amongst themselves to never let that happen to them again.
Yeah, I'd like that too. And that would also work way better if Order 66 was something that they were all aware was a thing like Episode 3 kinda implied, rather than it being a mind control thing.
Nah you are right about the themeing. I take it as saying that the Republicans and the Separatists so suddenly found themselves fighting the same enemy. All the reasons the Seppies hated the Republic remain, and all the affection the citizens of Ferrix have for their republic have been taken away. The clones within a moment became stormtroopers, which plays into why the CIS was fighting them (on an individual level) and how the Republic's good had become so easily excised.
Yeah taking into account R1 and the OT it seems like Mothma gets dragged along through the revolution by the more radical wing of her faction, pretty sure she isn't relevant at all in the grand scheme until after the Empire is defeated and she becomes a politician in the New Republic (and fails to stop the First Order from rising lmao).
The New Republic getting wrecked by the fascist breakaway they neglected to deal with is a lovely, unintentional piece of commentary on Liberalism in general.
all that's missing is space operation paperclip, although the oldschool rebellion was hoovering up defectors left and right so maybe that's where wookiee von braun shows up, idk.
The very existence of the OT will always undermine this however, since we know that the "insane" people were right and they won in the end. And the prequels will always be about how the "sane" people failed, and even the sequel trilogy wouldn't have happened had the "sane" people not failed again off-screen.
Theyre still working with the partisans in rogue one, albeit saw goes wildly insane with some sort of desert mind squid situation
I mean Saw is calling everyone not part of his faction out in andor as feds, libs, splitters, and wreckers. Not that he's wrong though.
literally us
fr fr
This is actually the most correct he's ever been shown to be. He didn't want to throw in with Kreegyr because Kreegyr was an idiot who was going to get his people killed, and he was exactly right about that. Hell, he talked shit about people who wanted to restore the Republic and he's ultimately shown to be right about that too, given the Sequels
An interesting angle is that Andor says in the movie that he's been fighting the empire since he was 6, and the Andor show runners decided to portray him as a child on a planet devastated by imperial extraction... Except the imperial extraction was long before the Old Republic became the Galactic Empire.
I think they're not going to forget that he's ideologically aligned against the liberal Old Republic almost as much as the Empire.
That's true. Hell, when Maarva takes him, she outright says that the Republic is on its way and they'll kill everyone there.
I'm mostly excited for what this could do for the portrayal of Mon Mothma, given that we know she's ideologically committed to restoring the Republic, and eventually does
And when Clem (andors dad) gets executed for
rabble rousingprotest policing, is it stormtroopers or clone troopers who do the deed? Does Syril’s childhood bedroom have stormtrooper or clone trooper action figures? The Republic was a type of EmpireAlso, Karn's childhood room has a bunch of clone trooper action figures. It's such an interesting detail to specifically say that that little fascist shit grew up idolizing the Republic
I literally just added that comrade, great minds
I love this line of thinking because the prequels and Clone Wars were basically about how the Republic was basically already an empire, but they rarely if ever seemed to acknowledge that. This thing that feels like the central theme of those works also somehow feels like subtext. Like, the very first episode of Clone Wars has Yoda convince people to join the Republic and the episode ends with a Republic Cruiser, which obviously looks very similar to a Star Destroyer, entering their system. There's a little tongue-in-cheek irony to it, but it's mostly played as a victory rather than very ominous symbolism. And I've had multiple arguments with people who thought that the slavery of the clones was fine because the Jedi treated them well, which A) no they didn't, they threw them into a meat grinder and B) even if they did, they're still basically child soliders.
My point is, I'm glad we have a work directly engaging with this thought and I hope they go further with it. And now I also want something set before or during the prequels that explores this even more, and explicitly.
The Umbara arc is the biggest missed opportunity in the "clones are slaves" and to this day it irritates me.
General Krell basically mistreated the clones, kept throwing them in harm's way because his strategy was just brute forcing everything, and it got to the point he was going to execute soldiers who take out a giant enemy ship because their mission was unauthorised.
The clones only turned against him when it was revealed he was working against the Republic, which lets the audience paint his disregard for clone lives as "oh he was just evil, the jedi don't do that"
Someone once said the arc should have ended in the clones turning against him after the execution order and covering it up, basically rising up and defending themselves.
I would like that. Honestly, the thing I'd like the most is if Krell was never a Seperatist, if he was just really callous and cruel to his clones and the Jedi knew and enabled it because he "got results". That was basically the Jedi strategy at a structural level anyway.
I stole this part from A More Civilized Age, but what if that was the case, and then there was one more episode at the end of the arc for his trial and the Jedi just closed rank to protect him from what they viewed as (maybe correctly?) a power play by Palpatine?
That could be cool, but I do really like the idea that the clones just off him, blame it on the Umbarans and then swear amongst themselves to never let that happen to them again.
Yeah, I'd like that too. And that would also work way better if Order 66 was something that they were all aware was a thing like Episode 3 kinda implied, rather than it being a mind control thing.
It's Clone Troopers but right after Order 66 aka the establishing of the empire. The very early days basically.
This. In fact the rally is pro=Republic. You hear one of the guys who gets shot yell "long live the Republic"
Damn L, my bad
Nah you are right about the themeing. I take it as saying that the Republicans and the Separatists so suddenly found themselves fighting the same enemy. All the reasons the Seppies hated the Republic remain, and all the affection the citizens of Ferrix have for their republic have been taken away. The clones within a moment became stormtroopers, which plays into why the CIS was fighting them (on an individual level) and how the Republic's good had become so easily excised.
Yeah taking into account R1 and the OT it seems like Mothma gets dragged along through the revolution by the more radical wing of her faction, pretty sure she isn't relevant at all in the grand scheme until after the Empire is defeated and she becomes a politician in the New Republic (and fails to stop the First Order from rising lmao).
The New Republic getting wrecked by the fascist breakaway they neglected to deal with is a lovely, unintentional piece of commentary on Liberalism in general.
:chefs-kiss:
all that's missing is space operation paperclip, although the oldschool rebellion was hoovering up defectors left and right so maybe that's where wookiee von braun shows up, idk.
real post-war italy moment
the big mouse really wants to portrait the people actually doing something for the rebellion as insane people.
The very existence of the OT will always undermine this however, since we know that the "insane" people were right and they won in the end. And the prequels will always be about how the "sane" people failed, and even the sequel trilogy wouldn't have happened had the "sane" people not failed again off-screen.
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Star Wars is almost forced to be based simply because the enemy is the Empire.
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