I still cannot understand the “russian bots sabotaged Hillary’s election” narrative. She won the popular vote by several millions, lost the electoral college by like 10. Did the KGB invent the electoral college? Because it seemed like an ordinary election with the exception of the funny candidates
I genuinely feel like i’ve lost my mind because whenever this topic comes up, no one seems to acknowledge this. Not even people here. Am i missing something? Am I missing the big picture when I point out Hillary literally won and still lost and that tankies or bernie bros or putler bots couldnt’t sway shit? Unless they assume Hillary would’ve won 5 million more votes if the bernie bros didn’t have allegiance to russia and caused her the electoral votes? What am i missing?
It's more because liberals will use the electoral college to make their point in a way. In their Russia fantasy the disinformation campaign influenced enough swing state voters to turn the electoral vote in favor of Trump.
They'll even acknowledge that the electoral college is flawed (they've been on that spiel ever since the 2000 election), but they won't ever actually make a push to reform or completely get rid of it because they also wholeheartedly believe American institutions are damn near infallible.
They'll even acknowledge that the electoral college is flawed (they've been on that spiel ever since the 2000 election)
Yeah libs used talk about the EC, now their go to obsession is "first past the poll"/ranked choice. Every vote evangelist is flogging this as a magic bullet to save what they think is democracy
Even a moderate understanding of modern history reveals that people will happily vote in fascism. Or fascists will just ignore the voting altogether and seize power while libs wring their hands. Very big brain stuff
That’s part of it, but also any realistic path to eliminating the EC or rendering it neutral would require the DNC to win over a lot more state governments, and the Dems are deathly allergic to engaging in that sort of long-term strategy. Not to mention having to expand the party beyond their coastal and urban enclaves.
"Everyone believes they are immune to propaganda." - Group of Redditors buying into blatant propaganda.
Yes, it's Russian propaganda that caused Hillary to lose, and not her unmasked contempt for anyone not completely adherent to neoliberal ideology. The success of the previously unknown Bernie's campaign should have been a wake up call to at least act like you could play nice with the more progressive folks. Bernie was never going to be the VP pick, but there were a handful of others that would have been at least throwing a bone to that part of the base.
Nope, she picks Tim "Pro Life" fucking Kaine, but it was Russian ops that convince those Michigan voters to pick Stein.
IMO both things are true. Yes she won the popular vote undeniably, however that doesn't excuse her disastrous campaign, most of the time Trump would not have been even close and the electoral college issue is something they as Adults In The Roomtm should have taken into account when propping up Trump. At this point it is all academic debate anyway, like going back and looking at what they did wrong etc.
The point is yes she won, but it should not have been that close and it wasn't an upset or unlikely result, it is now understood it was just their incompetence overall.
The same thing is happening right now too, Biden should be far more popular than Trump under almost every scenario except for the fact Dems keep making incredibly dumb decisions, almost as if they don't want to win...
Russian hackers hacked the results so it flipped to a Trump victory instead.
Serious answer: the DNC was not in a position to admit defeat, for it would mean conceding defeat to the progressive wing led by Bernie Sanders, which was growing stronger by the day back in 2017. Hillary’s loss had to be blamed on something, or someone. Lie through the teeth if they had to, but they cannot risk having their party getting overrun by the progressives. The Russians thus became the scapegoat to this intraparty struggle in the DNC.
I still cannot understand the “russian bots sabotaged Hillary’s election” narrative. She won the popular vote by several millions, lost the electoral college by like 10. Did the KGB invent the electoral college? Because it seemed like an ordinary election with the exception of the funny candidates
I genuinely feel like i’ve lost my mind because whenever this topic comes up, no one seems to acknowledge this. Not even people here. Am i missing something? Am I missing the big picture when I point out Hillary literally won and still lost and that tankies or bernie bros or putler bots couldnt’t sway shit? Unless they assume Hillary would’ve won 5 million more votes if the bernie bros didn’t have allegiance to russia and caused her the electoral votes? What am i missing?
It's more because liberals will use the electoral college to make their point in a way. In their Russia fantasy the disinformation campaign influenced enough swing state voters to turn the electoral vote in favor of Trump.
They'll even acknowledge that the electoral college is flawed (they've been on that spiel ever since the 2000 election), but they won't ever actually make a push to reform or completely get rid of it because they also wholeheartedly believe American institutions are damn near infallible.
Yeah libs used talk about the EC, now their go to obsession is "first past the poll"/ranked choice. Every vote evangelist is flogging this as a magic bullet to save what they think is democracy
Even a moderate understanding of modern history reveals that people will happily vote in fascism. Or fascists will just ignore the voting altogether and seize power while libs wring their hands. Very big brain stuff
That’s part of it, but also any realistic path to eliminating the EC or rendering it neutral would require the DNC to win over a lot more state governments, and the Dems are deathly allergic to engaging in that sort of long-term strategy. Not to mention having to expand the party beyond their coastal and urban enclaves.
I love the irony in the cognitive dissonance:
"Everyone believes they are immune to propaganda." - Group of Redditors buying into blatant propaganda.
Yes, it's Russian propaganda that caused Hillary to lose, and not her unmasked contempt for anyone not completely adherent to neoliberal ideology. The success of the previously unknown Bernie's campaign should have been a wake up call to at least act like you could play nice with the more progressive folks. Bernie was never going to be the VP pick, but there were a handful of others that would have been at least throwing a bone to that part of the base.
Nope, she picks Tim "Pro Life" fucking Kaine, but it was Russian ops that convince those Michigan voters to pick Stein.
Johnson got twice the third party voters than Stein if I remember correctly. You never hear them getting mad at libertarians.
IMO both things are true. Yes she won the popular vote undeniably, however that doesn't excuse her disastrous campaign, most of the time Trump would not have been even close and the electoral college issue is something they as Adults In The Roomtm should have taken into account when propping up Trump. At this point it is all academic debate anyway, like going back and looking at what they did wrong etc.
The point is yes she won, but it should not have been that close and it wasn't an upset or unlikely result, it is now understood it was just their incompetence overall.
The same thing is happening right now too, Biden should be far more popular than Trump under almost every scenario except for the fact Dems keep making incredibly dumb decisions, almost as if they don't want to win...
Russian hackers hacked the results so it flipped to a Trump victory instead.
Serious answer: the DNC was not in a position to admit defeat, for it would mean conceding defeat to the progressive wing led by Bernie Sanders, which was growing stronger by the day back in 2017. Hillary’s loss had to be blamed on something, or someone. Lie through the teeth if they had to, but they cannot risk having their party getting overrun by the progressives. The Russians thus became the scapegoat to this intraparty struggle in the DNC.
Just remember there is nothing to understand. It's cope. Those idiots lost a layup with a bad candidate and a surprisingly good showing from Trump.
They won't take responsibility, so it was a Russian disinfo thingy.