This was taken from an old prepper forum that I can't actually find. It has an interesting perspective and would be great to go in c/SHTF if that community existed. Anyway:


I grew up in West Africa and lived through Civil Wars in 3 nations: Liberia, Sierra Leone & Gambia. Literally as we escaped to another country, war broke out there (the point of that is unrest in one location can turn into unrest in a neighboring location)

I learned many lessons from these experiences and hope that my experience can be of some benefit to you as you prepare for whatever comes.

When society deteriorates, it's ugly. The majority of people are not prepared. During the first few days, people hold onto hope that things will go back to normal and someone will save them. For that week, many are largely in denial that what's going on will last longer than a few days.

About a week into a SHTF event like a civil war, people become EXTREMELY desperate. Parents start begging for food for their children, etc.

This is when you have to be very careful in helping others because you too could become an easy target. During one outbreak of war in Liberia, my family and others bugged out to heavily fortified military compound.

On our way to the compound, we had to stop and spend a night at a family friend's house. Armed robbers came to the house that night and tried to steal from us. The homeowner's wife was killed in the attack. She was shot through the window in front of us. They wanted to set the house on fire to smoke us out, but it was raining heavily that night and they apparently ran out of ammo.

They left and said they would be back. We fled the house right after and slept in the bushes on a nearby beach.

The next morning we made it to the compound where we stayed for months until a cease fire was called. The compound was attacked on two occasions during those months.

During another outbreak of war (the war lasted over a decade with periods of cease fire) when we didn't have that compound available, we traveled on foot across the city to my grandmother's house.

This time, the community tried to protect itself from armed robbers. We created a night watch of ordinary people that would monitor the neighborhood. Finding allies like this was very helpful.

Basic necessities were needed the most. Coffee, tea & sugar became the biggest commodities. People who smoke or drank gave those up quickly. If you were drunk or high, you were not attentive to potential attacks.

The people who joined the night watch got paid in food. You gave them enough food for that day.

Basic necessities bought you allies. The vast majority of people wanted some sense of normalcy. They didn't just turn into savages. My father had his coffee everyday for example.

Rice was a major staple because it filled you up. We often had it with something called bulgur wheat.

People needed toothpaste and powdered milk. Toilet paper was a luxury and very few people had them. After you've used newspapers, you'll work for free for TP.

Having a clean water supply was important. People often got sick from drinking unclean water so basic medication was also important.

Unless you were participating in the war, you didn't use much ammo to be honest. You also didn't want people knowing how many guns you had so you wouldn't be a target of armed robbers, especially if you were a small group. Using ammo could draw the wrong crowd so you didn't unless you had to defend your area.

While you're prepping, load up on basic necessities. People won't risk their lives for cigarettes or alcohol like you see in the movies, but they will risk their lives for food for their kids.

During those wars I experienced, people still banded together. They still wanted a sense of community, a sense of normalcy. Have like minded allies, even if they're not part of your immediate group.

One way we survived was by banding together and laying low. Don't show a lot of people your goods. The main thing is to survive and you do so by not drawing too much attention.

It's why I wouldn’t barter things like marijuana, much alcohol, etc. A lot of these things start to attract the wrong element. Stick to many basic necessities. During the war, rebels used child soldiers, these kids were drugged up. People who had marijuana attracted rebel forces who killed them and took their weed.

We experienced so much more than this but I hope this is helpful to you as you prep to survive without yourself becoming a target during a SHTF situation. A war is one of the worst SHTF situations to encounter.

    • Dear_Occupant [he/him]
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      4 years ago

      So do I, which is why I'm saying use bikes.

      (BTW that was me upvoting you for having a good faith conversation about this, not because I an conceding the point.)

      • WoofWoof91 [comrade/them]
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        4 years ago

        pushbikes are shit for transporting cargo

        horses can be hooked up to a wagon or a cart
        or oxen come to think of it, or cows at a push
        or dogs

        doing that with a pushbike dramatically reduces your range, and theres only so much you can fit in panniers/backpacks, plus on a pushbike it's gonna be far more tiring compared to a motorbike

        • Dear_Occupant [he/him]
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          4 years ago

          I agree. I am not saying we won't ever use horses. But I am not about to put my 70-something mom on one, and if I need to get a routine message upriver to the 2nd St. Louis Comrades Brigade, I'm putting somebody on two wheels.

          There is no one size fits all answer here, but bikes fill in a lot more of the gaps starting out. I mean if you're volunteering for the job of stablemaster...

          • WoofWoof91 [comrade/them]
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            4 years ago

            But I am not about to put my 70-something mom on one

            fair point, but you could put her in a cart, anyone with basic woodworking knowledge and basic tools could knock a reasonably solid one together in a day

            and if I need to get a routine message upriver to the 2nd St. Louis Comrades Brigade, I’m putting somebody on two wheels

            oh yeah, for small courier work over relatively short distances a pushbike is perfectly fine, I was more thinking about versatility and large cargo loads is pretty much the domain of the horse or ox (outside of motorised transport)

            • Dear_Occupant [he/him]
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              4 years ago

              I agree with the overall thrust of your thinking here, but I think you are dramatically underestimating the amount of labor and expertise involved. While we still have electricity, I recommend you follow up on this line of thinking and put together a list of particulars you would expect of any group that intended to use horses, and while you're at it, get us prepared for using goats and donkeys too. How much water, how much straw, how much ranging room while they're not at work, how much fencing, what sort of structure will we need to build, those sorts of things.

              • WoofWoof91 [comrade/them]
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                4 years ago

                How much water

                one horse is about 5 to 10 gallons per day, more if worked hard/hot weather. Depending on access to a river, that could be an issue, but if you do have a natural source of water, setting up a makeshift purifier is pretty easy

                how much straw

                1.5-2.5% of their body weight daily in forage, assuming you don't live in a desert, that can be made up with grass and other wild plants

                how much ranging room while they’re not at work

                tricky one, ideally, you would fence out as much room as you could reasonably defend/watch over. If you have very limited space, I can't see you having a horse handy in the first place

                what sort of structure will we need to build

                something that will stay up and protect from the weather pretty much

                also this assumes the group wouldn't take up a nomadic lifestyle, which could be beneficial for keeping away from the fash

                • Dear_Occupant [he/him]
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                  4 years ago

                  I don't know how much more gently I can put this: if you think this question can be answered in a comment, then you are still missing the point. I am giving you a homework assignment, this is not a pop quiz. I expect you to learn something when I send you on this mission. You are not showing your work right now.

                    • Dear_Occupant [he/him]
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                      4 years ago

                      Here's what: it's going to take more effort to run a stable than what you just gave me for an answer to my question. The point of the question was to get you to explore the issue, not to give me whatever answer you had ready off the top of your head. I am presenting you with an invitation to use your insight for real value.

                      In other words, you will get instantly laughed at and ignored if you propose this idea in the event that you ever happen to be in a room where people must consider this an an option. I can pick up the phone right now and call someone who can tell me a lot more of what I need to know about horses. I'm pretty sure I can knock on a random door on my street and get that much. If this is a line of preparation you truly care about, then I am suggesting you master it.

                      • WoofWoof91 [comrade/them]
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                        4 years ago

                        Here’s what: it’s going to take more effort to run a stable than what you just gave me for an answer to my question. The point of the question was to get you to explore the issue, not to give me whatever answer you had ready off the top of your head. I am presenting you with an invitation to use your insight for real value.

                        so you are acting like a twat and talking down to me, got it

                        In other words, you will get instantly laughed at and ignored if you propose this idea in the event that you ever happen to be in a room where people must consider this an an option.

                        have you ever actually talked to people in real life?

                        • Dear_Occupant [he/him]
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                          4 years ago

                          Yes, have you? My pupils are doing great, I could not possibly be more proud of them. I must have mistaken you for one of them.

                            • Dear_Occupant [he/him]
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                              4 years ago

                              Good luck with that. Meanwhile I'm over here doing cardio with people who don't get their feelings hurt over not needlessly murdering horses. I'll still be around when you've gotten yourself over the heat of being corrected in the kindest way I know how to muster. For now though, I'm done here.