But seriously, why didn't communism triumph in the 20th century when things were looking so good? If the russian revolution and chinese revolution can succeed, liberating 800 million people, 1/3rd of the world's population, defeat the nazis, why couldnt we finish the final stretch? What was the fatal flaw?

      • Vncredleader
        ·
        3 years ago

        pretty much. it is the same reason those parties largely went along with WW1. Ireland was the first, even before the Russians, and eventually ended up being the only other european revolution of that time to somewhat stick even if betrayed and leading to a civil war. I think much of that comes from the fact that the irish by and far didn't have the opportunity for comfort. You had the classic Irish elite who sold them out sure, but some concessions had to be made to them because their status as a colonized people made for a contradiction that could not even be temporarily resolved. You never got something close to that in Germany, while in Ireland people who otherwise would be SPD or tuned out of politics, engaged in revolutionary action and aligned with the nascent Soviet Union

    • SeventyTwoTrillion [he/him]
      ·
      3 years ago

      As the other commenter said, Matt Christman and his co-host has talked about it in one of the Hinge Points episodes and broadly goes through the events. The series as a whole is a good listen and pretty interesting.

      • CommieElon [he/him]
        ·
        3 years ago

        It’s funny that the chapos get a lot of shit for being libs but Matt consistently has great takes and actually knows his history.

        • SeventyTwoTrillion [he/him]
          ·
          3 years ago

          Yeah, when listening to them, I can see why most serious communists on here who believe in AES and love the USSR don't like the Chapos very much. Definitely some weird takes here and there. But I think they collectively have one of the less shit opinions about China if you absolutely have to be a typical western leftist who hates any socialism that isn't theoretical, which is basically "Think what you want about China but if you're more concerned about what the Chinese government is doing, which you have no way of affecting, than what the United States is doing, which you can theoretically affect, you're a fucking moron." Unfortunately I think their influence on the younger left has diminished due to the rise of breadtube and their epic twitch streamers but they still have one of the largest Patreon bases on the website, which is something.

          And yeah, Matt is legitimately very intelligent and I agree with the vast majority of his takes. And even the ones I don't agree with, I sorta have to be like "Well, he's read his shit so at least I know he's coming at this from a place of knowledge and good faith and not just agreeing/disagreeing with something because he doesn't know shit about it." He's honestly probably one of the best thinkers we have on the left, certainly in the top 10% of at least vaguely prominent socialists alive today, just because he's done the goddamn reading.

          • badtakes [he/him]
            hexagon
            ·
            3 years ago

            communism is when you believe in AES and love the USSR

    • Mardoniush [she/her]
      ·
      3 years ago

      A bunch of things, like the SPDs betrayal. But ultimately The Battle of Warsaw prevented the Soviets giving direct support to any revolutionary outbreak.