You still vote for the dems even if they’re centrists. Because the opponents are literally FASCISTS. Right now, YOU are the one who’s letting fascists control the government because of your hatred of centrists and neoliberals. Even the Soviet Union allied with the US and UK when it came time to fight the Nazis. Why won’t you do the same?
Yeah 100%. Capitalism is the fuel that creates Fascism to defends itself. The Nazis came in power (rather than the socialists :ussr-cry:) because of capitalism. But you still vote for the neoliberals against the fascists. The USSR didn’t declare war on the entire world during WW2. They allied with the capitalists to defeat the fascists.
Right now, YOU are the one who’s letting fascists control the government because of your hatred of centrists and neoliberals.
that's just like...not how voting works. i did vote for dems btw, in races that ended up being close and important for senate and gubernatorial positions. but WE, we the voters that is, have little to do with who controls the government because we don't pick who runs and we don't have power to control what they do when they get there. in 2020, dems had a better position than they currently do, and yet did very little. they could have protected abortion before it was overturned, they could have pressured rbg to resign before she died in office, etc. etc. etc. if it weren't joe manchin and kristin sinema being the individual embodiments of a block to popular policy, they would simply be leading a slightly larger cohort of right-wing dems that would form an anti-anything-good voting bloc. how much do they need to have the senate by for you to not make excuses for them?
I 100% get your point and agree with it. Dems, as an institution, are bad. So are the Republicans. My whole point is that the Republicans, as seen by recent anti-trans, anti-gay and anti-abortion bills in their states, are gonna sink to levels of depravity the Dems wouldn’t.
Sure, maybe, Biden lied and even if we won the House, he wouldn’t have put forth an abortion bill. I think he would’ve but I can understand why people think otherwise.
BUT if you have a Dem House, you won’t have anti-trans and anti-abortion bills either! Which is a distinct possibility in a republican government. Maybe not right now, but in 2024?
BUT if you have a Dem House, you won’t have anti-trans and anti-abortion bills either! Which is a distinct possibility in a republican government.
that's the rub. this is a very short-sighted thing to struggle with us about ideologically. you're absolutely right, pretty much the best median behavior you can expect from a dem-led governing coalition is a bit of respite from active harm, and that's if you're not black or an immigrant or someone in a part of the third world that we're currently bombing. when dems refuse to go solve people's problems, it's simply a matter of time before the fascist flood gates burst. spending energy thinking about, much less arguing about, voting and who's doing it hard enough is energy that you're not using figuring out how to build power for when the dem "do no harm by doing nothing at all, probably" coalition collapses terminally. it doesn't really matter whether they would or wouldn't end up trying to put out an abortion bill. if they did, it's only so little respite from the very real reactionary material forces that are building up as the internal stability of the imperial system breaks down as it is.
That’s a good point. My idea is not to just vote and keep voting for the Dems in hopes that things never get worse. You vote for the Dems and then use that time of respite to build up organisations for socialism and solidarity.
Approximately one million Iraqis, 2 million prison slaves, an indeterminate number of concentration camp tenants and an ever-growing list of police murder victims would like a word with you
Sure, but now we're at the point of splitting hairs about who at the table are nazis and who at the table are simply arming, funding and refusing to hinder the nazis while also doing nazi shit
Iraq happened under Bush. But yeah, I get your point. Dems are bad. They’re capitalists. But just look at the anti-trans, anti-gay, anti-abortion legislation passing around in Rep states right now. Do you want that nationally?
And the useless complicit fucks in the democratic party all voted for it. The president isn't king, I was very young at the time but I still remember every adult around me, even the so-called peace lovers, calling for the middle east to be nuked. I refuse to allow anyone to memory hole this.
But just look at the anti-trans, anti-gay, anti-abortion legislation passing around in Rep states right now. Do you want that nationally?
The last several decades have demonstrated comprehensively that what I want does not matter, as I am not in a position of power. You should instead be asking that question to the useless complicit fucks in the democratic party, because it would appear from their complete spineless inaction, nauseating displays of performative helplessness and seemingly pathological urge to please the fascists with needless 3/5ths-style compromises that they do, in fact, want that nationally.
That’s a good point. The Dems are, I guess, as bad as the Reps on a lot of issues. But I don’t see any issue where they’re worse while there are plenty where the Reps are just outright evil.
They don't need to be worse themselves when they just hand control over to the fascists at every opportunity. If there was a serial killer around, and I took people's donations promising to keep them safe, only to hand the gore-streaked maniac their housekeys as soon as I saw him, I would rightfully be convicted as an accomplice.
As I replied to @MeatfuckerDidNothing:
You still vote for the dems even if they’re centrists. Because the opponents are literally FASCISTS. Right now, YOU are the one who’s letting fascists control the government because of your hatred of centrists and neoliberals. Even the Soviet Union allied with the US and UK when it came time to fight the Nazis. Why won’t you do the same?
:maybe-later-kiddo:
Wow. Could you not use a right-wing misogynist caricature?
You're pretty much literally reciting what the person pictured said. Like almost word-for-word.
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deleted by creator
Yeah 100%. Capitalism is the fuel that creates Fascism to defends itself. The Nazis came in power (rather than the socialists :ussr-cry:) because of capitalism. But you still vote for the neoliberals against the fascists. The USSR didn’t declare war on the entire world during WW2. They allied with the capitalists to defeat the fascists.
deleted by creator
100%
that's just like...not how voting works. i did vote for dems btw, in races that ended up being close and important for senate and gubernatorial positions. but WE, we the voters that is, have little to do with who controls the government because we don't pick who runs and we don't have power to control what they do when they get there. in 2020, dems had a better position than they currently do, and yet did very little. they could have protected abortion before it was overturned, they could have pressured rbg to resign before she died in office, etc. etc. etc. if it weren't joe manchin and kristin sinema being the individual embodiments of a block to popular policy, they would simply be leading a slightly larger cohort of right-wing dems that would form an anti-anything-good voting bloc. how much do they need to have the senate by for you to not make excuses for them?
I 100% get your point and agree with it. Dems, as an institution, are bad. So are the Republicans. My whole point is that the Republicans, as seen by recent anti-trans, anti-gay and anti-abortion bills in their states, are gonna sink to levels of depravity the Dems wouldn’t.
Sure, maybe, Biden lied and even if we won the House, he wouldn’t have put forth an abortion bill. I think he would’ve but I can understand why people think otherwise.
BUT if you have a Dem House, you won’t have anti-trans and anti-abortion bills either! Which is a distinct possibility in a republican government. Maybe not right now, but in 2024?
that's the rub. this is a very short-sighted thing to struggle with us about ideologically. you're absolutely right, pretty much the best median behavior you can expect from a dem-led governing coalition is a bit of respite from active harm, and that's if you're not black or an immigrant or someone in a part of the third world that we're currently bombing. when dems refuse to go solve people's problems, it's simply a matter of time before the fascist flood gates burst. spending energy thinking about, much less arguing about, voting and who's doing it hard enough is energy that you're not using figuring out how to build power for when the dem "do no harm by doing nothing at all, probably" coalition collapses terminally. it doesn't really matter whether they would or wouldn't end up trying to put out an abortion bill. if they did, it's only so little respite from the very real reactionary material forces that are building up as the internal stability of the imperial system breaks down as it is.
That’s a good point. My idea is not to just vote and keep voting for the Dems in hopes that things never get worse. You vote for the Dems and then use that time of respite to build up organisations for socialism and solidarity.
But I did vote for them. :i-voted: If they wanted more people to vote for them, they should have run better candidates.
Even if the Dem candidates are bad, you still vote for them because the other side is running nazis.
And the dems were funding those nazis because they don't care.
Yeah as I’ve said countless times. Dems are bad. But they’re not fascists. So you side with the Dems against the fascists.
Approximately one million Iraqis, 2 million prison slaves, an indeterminate number of concentration camp tenants and an ever-growing list of police murder victims would like a word with you
To be unreasonably fair, liberals are also genocidal, it isnt an exclusive feature of fascism.
Sure, but now we're at the point of splitting hairs about who at the table are nazis and who at the table are simply arming, funding and refusing to hinder the nazis while also doing nazi shit
Lol yeah, super pedantic of me
Iraq happened under Bush. But yeah, I get your point. Dems are bad. They’re capitalists. But just look at the anti-trans, anti-gay, anti-abortion legislation passing around in Rep states right now. Do you want that nationally?
And the useless complicit fucks in the democratic party all voted for it. The president isn't king, I was very young at the time but I still remember every adult around me, even the so-called peace lovers, calling for the middle east to be nuked. I refuse to allow anyone to memory hole this.
The last several decades have demonstrated comprehensively that what I want does not matter, as I am not in a position of power. You should instead be asking that question to the useless complicit fucks in the democratic party, because it would appear from their complete spineless inaction, nauseating displays of performative helplessness and seemingly pathological urge to please the fascists with needless 3/5ths-style compromises that they do, in fact, want that nationally.
That’s a good point. The Dems are, I guess, as bad as the Reps on a lot of issues. But I don’t see any issue where they’re worse while there are plenty where the Reps are just outright evil.
They don't need to be worse themselves when they just hand control over to the fascists at every opportunity. If there was a serial killer around, and I took people's donations promising to keep them safe, only to hand the gore-streaked maniac their housekeys as soon as I saw him, I would rightfully be convicted as an accomplice.
impressive bit account.
gotta admit it keeps things interesting lol