From personal experience there are indeed quite a few people, especially in New York, who pull in $400k or even $1 million and feel like they're poor. Their houses are huge, but they're not even close to the size of the residences of those making $10 million+. They get to go to the Met Gala, but their richer friends get to actually interact with the celebs. Stuff like that. NYC in particular is like a fractal experience of wealth—no matter how wealthy you are, you're always going to feel poor unless you're pulling in billions, and even then I'm sure you feel poor compared to Bezos. This is partially why the abolition of classes benefits everybody. Even the mega-wealthy are caught in the rat race of never-ceasing capital accumulation! Of course, they all get Central Parked when the time comes, but at least their distance ancestors won't have to feel trapped the way they did.
NYC is ridiculous. I make 100k exactly here (sorry comrades, I'm good with code, I work at a start up, flame me if you have to) and I wouldnt call myself lower class, but its not like I get to own everything. Everything here is just unreal expensive, it sucks.
Engels' family owned a factory, don't beat yourself up about it. Agreed that NYC is some weird hellhole where everything is expensive, but it's also weird to me that I have friends who are like "it's so expensive to live here" on $100k+ families when neighbors down the street with three kids get by ok on $65k. I feel two ways about it, in that the expensive trope is simultaneously very real and something only specific to 20 and 30 somethings "trying to make it" in the city.
I totally get what you mean by that, and I think a part of that is if you're moving into the city you're more likely to land in an expensive neighborhood, and it makes all the difference. But it also could just be people in their 20s don't know how to live yet, idk
You'd need to make a million dollars a year (and like every year, re not just one good year, over the course of your kids education) at least to afford this in SF or NYC. 4 kids in private school is like 200k in post tax money already.
If you want an honest answer, it's that 400k a year after taxes is like 250k in SF or NYC. You can own a 1.2 million dollar place that costs like 6,000 a month or 72k a year (in SF or Manhattan that's like the median home so nothing fancy outside of the location appeal).
In these big cities 20% of kids are going to private school, and that costs 40k a year per kid. If you decide to go that route and have 2 kids, you have like 70k left for everything including savings for retirement and what not.
The point here is, that this is what middle class America is. It's just that in like Texas or Florida or something you can get this same lifestyle making half as much if not even less. And it's also that in places like SF or NYC a middle class life just isn't possible unless you make an insane amount of money. Additionally, if you are like the average age of people on this website, your parents could have that lifestyle in these places making less than half this amount in today's dollars.
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From personal experience there are indeed quite a few people, especially in New York, who pull in $400k or even $1 million and feel like they're poor. Their houses are huge, but they're not even close to the size of the residences of those making $10 million+. They get to go to the Met Gala, but their richer friends get to actually interact with the celebs. Stuff like that. NYC in particular is like a fractal experience of wealth—no matter how wealthy you are, you're always going to feel poor unless you're pulling in billions, and even then I'm sure you feel poor compared to Bezos. This is partially why the abolition of classes benefits everybody. Even the mega-wealthy are caught in the rat race of never-ceasing capital accumulation! Of course, they all get Central Parked when the time comes, but at least their distance ancestors won't have to feel trapped the way they did.
NYC is ridiculous. I make 100k exactly here (sorry comrades, I'm good with code, I work at a start up, flame me if you have to) and I wouldnt call myself lower class, but its not like I get to own everything. Everything here is just unreal expensive, it sucks.
Class traitors are cool, comrade :fidel-peace:
Engels' family owned a factory, don't beat yourself up about it. Agreed that NYC is some weird hellhole where everything is expensive, but it's also weird to me that I have friends who are like "it's so expensive to live here" on $100k+ families when neighbors down the street with three kids get by ok on $65k. I feel two ways about it, in that the expensive trope is simultaneously very real and something only specific to 20 and 30 somethings "trying to make it" in the city.
I totally get what you mean by that, and I think a part of that is if you're moving into the city you're more likely to land in an expensive neighborhood, and it makes all the difference. But it also could just be people in their 20s don't know how to live yet, idk
Hey, I mean those two things are definitely related.
Fucking oversized apartment/house, in the most expensive area
Their 4 kids go to insanely expensive private schools
They think they have to buy expensive clothes and don't know what used cars are
That can be enough by itself. They are still saving money up, but they still have to think about money a lot because they are burning so much of it.
You'd need to make a million dollars a year (and like every year, re not just one good year, over the course of your kids education) at least to afford this in SF or NYC. 4 kids in private school is like 200k in post tax money already.
If you want an honest answer, it's that 400k a year after taxes is like 250k in SF or NYC. You can own a 1.2 million dollar place that costs like 6,000 a month or 72k a year (in SF or Manhattan that's like the median home so nothing fancy outside of the location appeal).
In these big cities 20% of kids are going to private school, and that costs 40k a year per kid. If you decide to go that route and have 2 kids, you have like 70k left for everything including savings for retirement and what not.
The point here is, that this is what middle class America is. It's just that in like Texas or Florida or something you can get this same lifestyle making half as much if not even less. And it's also that in places like SF or NYC a middle class life just isn't possible unless you make an insane amount of money. Additionally, if you are like the average age of people on this website, your parents could have that lifestyle in these places making less than half this amount in today's dollars.