And hey, I too used to be a smug liberal who looked down upon everyone who wasn't in lock step with US propaganda, but if you're trying to convince people of something I'd recommend you don't bookend every comment with reddit-ass insults to people's intelligence.
It would be great if Euromaiden was an actual popular revolution that turned control over to the people, but any legitimate popular energy was hijacked by western-backed right wing forces.
Nevertheless, that still means there are millions of Ukrainians who would prefer association with the EU over Russia. I think a lot of people take issue with the framing of it all as an artificial coup without popular support because that implies there's no one in Ukraine who wanted (however misplaced we might find it) to be in the EU and aligned with the US?
Agreed, but I think it's also important to specify that the coup refers to how the US Ambassador basically hand-picked the provisional government that ended up in power immediately after, and not the protests that started after the initial announcement that the EU deal was off.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LL4eNy4FCs8
I like this video for this very reason. It unequivocally states that NATO's eastward expansion provoked the Ukrainian invasion without regurgitating Kremlin talking points.
think a lot of people take issue with the framing of it all as an artificial coup without popular support because that implies there's no one in Ukraine who wanted... to be in the EU and aligned with the US.
I think that implication mistakeningly conflates the protests with the resulting coup. The protests had real popular energy behind them and spotlit grassroots leaders (until the western-backed literal Nazis took center stage). The coup pushed those people and their interests aside in favor of whoever Victoria Nuland favored.
None of this refutes what I argued above, that the protests were quickly taken over by right wing groups propped up by the West, with the new government handpicked by the state department:
That probably would have been more convincing if I didn't personally know people who took part in the revolution and then fought Russia,
Cool are they happy with Victoria Nuland selecting their government?
or if Zelensky didn't have sky high popular support,
I haven't seen an approval poll inside of Ukraine for a while but the guy banned opposition parties so it's not like you'd have any other political option at the moment lol.
or if he wasn't Jewish.
Seriously very funny to pretend like a Jewish president wipes out the neo-Nazi reality of the Azov battalion.
the insults are just to amuse myself, and because you deserve them.
Liberals do not argue in good faith. Every time they start JAQing off and question the validity of your claims, they mean to attack your character and have no interest in the claims themselves. It is not contradictory that they ask the same questions again and again, because their questions aren't questions, they're attacks.
They did a coup in 2014 with the help of Nazi militias.
Nice condescending ableism at the end there. Libs stay classy.
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lol, you're just gonna get another comment deleted for ableism, so I won't even bother to address anything you said
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Quick! Quick! Say another ableism thing!
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aww, you poop your pants little guy?
It would be great if Euromaiden was an actual popular revolution that turned control over to the people, but any legitimate popular energy was hijacked by western-backed right wing forces. This is evident by the fact that the grassroots protest leaders where shut out of the new government to make space for neo-Nazis handpicked the US state department (you can hear Victoria Nuland say "fuck the EU" around 10 mins into this video before selecting the new Ukrainian cabinet).
And hey, I too used to be a smug liberal who looked down upon everyone who wasn't in lock step with US propaganda, but if you're trying to convince people of something I'd recommend you don't bookend every comment with reddit-ass insults to people's intelligence.
That's seriously
, like how was it a popular movement when the next president was a literal billionaire oligarch who supported the protests?
Wasn't that guy voted out as soon as there were formal elections though?
Nevertheless, that still means there are millions of Ukrainians who would prefer association with the EU over Russia. I think a lot of people take issue with the framing of it all as an artificial coup without popular support because that implies there's no one in Ukraine who wanted (however misplaced we might find it) to be in the EU and aligned with the US?
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Agreed, but I think it's also important to specify that the coup refers to how the US Ambassador basically hand-picked the provisional government that ended up in power immediately after, and not the protests that started after the initial announcement that the EU deal was off.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LL4eNy4FCs8
I like this video for this very reason. It unequivocally states that NATO's eastward expansion provoked the Ukrainian invasion without regurgitating Kremlin talking points.
I think that implication mistakeningly conflates the protests with the resulting coup. The protests had real popular energy behind them and spotlit grassroots leaders (until the western-backed literal Nazis took center stage). The coup pushed those people and their interests aside in favor of whoever Victoria Nuland favored.
And if I recall, the Nuland picks were voted out first chance the Ukrainian people got.
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Obama black, no more racism
Only freedom!
None of this refutes what I argued above, that the protests were quickly taken over by right wing groups propped up by the West, with the new government handpicked by the state department:
Cool are they happy with Victoria Nuland selecting their government?
I haven't seen an approval poll inside of Ukraine for a while but the guy banned opposition parties so it's not like you'd have any other political option at the moment lol.
Seriously very funny to pretend like a Jewish president wipes out the neo-Nazi reality of the Azov battalion.
Whatever gets you off then, I guess.
Zelenskyyyy's approval ratings were in the toilet before the war, and wartime approval ratings don't really count to me, that's like saying Dubya was beloved because of how high his approval ratings were after 9/11.
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Liberalism 101:
Liberals do not argue in good faith. Every time they start JAQing off and question the validity of your claims, they mean to attack your character and have no interest in the claims themselves. It is not contradictory that they ask the same questions again and again, because their questions aren't questions, they're attacks.
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