this particular heresy isnt heresy because we decided its not heresy
even if we said it was heresy for centuries its definitely not heresy now because we say so.
yes these are definitely logical beliefs built upon a factual foundation and not at all an arbitrary demarcation of in-group amd out-group. calling it thats heresy!
yes im sure its very comforting to all the heretics thats have been murdered for their heresy that they arnt actually heretics.
heresies do get accepted and folded into the orthodox structure, and that may happen after many years or immediately depending on the politics of the time, but any departure from traditional belief is heresy until that belief is the tradition.
declaring the catholic pope to not be catholic is absolutely heresy
Yeah, but here's the thing, under "Traditional Belief" there are usually several positions. Optimistic universalism isn't a mainstream position, but it's been part of the church since the 500s. Similarly discussion on points not settled by doctrine, or where doctrine has proved insufficient is allowed and encouraged by church scholarship, because otherwise there would be no church scholarship.
Beliefs might not be accepted, they might even be officially considered wrong, but the church has several grades of formally stated erroneous positions that aren't considered heresy proper.
Yes, declaring the pope not to be catholic is probably heresy. It is at least propositio theologice erronea.
yes im aware, but my original point remains the same. heresy is defined by its departure from traditional belief and that is the only unifying concept behind all things which have been called heresies.
until such time as the church rules that the catholic pope is not, in fact, catholic, declaring him not to be can safely be called heresy as the traditional belief is that the catholic pope is, yknow, catholic. :che-laugh:
this particular heresy isnt heresy because we decided its not heresy
even if we said it was heresy for centuries its definitely not heresy now because we say so.
yes these are definitely logical beliefs built upon a factual foundation and not at all an arbitrary demarcation of in-group amd out-group. calling it thats heresy!
Well, in the case of Eastern Orthodox it was a misinterpretation of theology caused by translation errors from Greek to Latin.
Similarly with Joan of Arc's conviction being overturned or Gaileo being absolved. The Church admitted the error.
It takes a few centuries, but the Catholics do, eventually, after much bloodshed and awfulness, admit when they were wrong.
yes im sure its very comforting to all the heretics thats have been murdered for their heresy that they arnt actually heretics.
heresies do get accepted and folded into the orthodox structure, and that may happen after many years or immediately depending on the politics of the time, but any departure from traditional belief is heresy until that belief is the tradition.
declaring the catholic pope to not be catholic is absolutely heresy
Yeah, but here's the thing, under "Traditional Belief" there are usually several positions. Optimistic universalism isn't a mainstream position, but it's been part of the church since the 500s. Similarly discussion on points not settled by doctrine, or where doctrine has proved insufficient is allowed and encouraged by church scholarship, because otherwise there would be no church scholarship.
Beliefs might not be accepted, they might even be officially considered wrong, but the church has several grades of formally stated erroneous positions that aren't considered heresy proper.
Yes, declaring the pope not to be catholic is probably heresy. It is at least propositio theologice erronea.
yes im aware, but my original point remains the same. heresy is defined by its departure from traditional belief and that is the only unifying concept behind all things which have been called heresies.
until such time as the church rules that the catholic pope is not, in fact, catholic, declaring him not to be can safely be called heresy as the traditional belief is that the catholic pope is, yknow, catholic. :che-laugh: