I'll probably get downvoted for saying this, but a large part of the problem is that much of the left (at least online) is more concerned with validating their own grievances against other groups than with actually bringing down capitalism. This doesn't just apply to veterans, either, but to liberals, PMCs, religious folks, white men, white women, the DSA, socdems, STEMlords, and any other group or individual who isn't the totally pure One True Leftist™ foretold of in legends.
I do get that many on the left are emotionally damaged and value having an identity and community that accepts them, and that isn't a bad thing by any means. In order to protect this, however, many instinctively turn towards gate-keeping, which is very likely hinder the left's ability to accomplish anything in the world at large going forward. It's not something I see discussed a lot here or in other online left spaces, but maybe it's something we really should talk about more.
I’ll probably get downvoted for saying this, but a large part of the problem is that much of the left (at least online) is more concerned with validating their own grievances against other groups than with actually bringing down capitalism.
100%, this right here. So many of the "left" aren't really leftists. They are armchair leftist edgelords who act like they are the next Che Guevara's on the internet and just make Twitter or Facebook accounts filled with Soviet imagery that they find cool. It's like a left version of 4chan trolls in a way. It's one of the reasons the left in America is so small and seen more as a counter culture online thing than actual organizations. The far right militias completely outnumber us in organizations and anyone who has been paying attention since Gamergate should know the far right is damn good at radicalizing and pushing their propaganda. They don't spend a lot of time infighting over stupid shit like the left does. They go into forums and completely radicalize them before you even know it. I saw this with gaming forums time and time again.
Veterans are potential comrades. They come out of the military often screwed over by the VA and the government. Many of them are only going into the military today cause there are no job opportunities if you're poor and if you come from a rural small town that has been completely de-industrialized. No one wants to spend their whole life working at a Dollar store or McDonalds for shitty wages. It don't help that they come from poverty and a place of hopelessness, so they see joining the military as an escape. 4 years and they can go to college, which is one of the main reasons that teenagers enlist straight out of high school.
The armchair leftist response is to just say fuck these people in the name of their quote on quote "anti-imperialism". I often say this on here and will continue to say it, If you don't talk to them, someone else will. So many veterans come out of the military disillusioned by the system and not trusting the government that just used them as a meat shield. By just looking down at these people for enlisting in the first place, is the wrong attitude and will lead someone else to talking to them instead. That someone else is going to be the far right.
These veterans are people we should be talking to. If you don't talk to them someone else will.
I think this is mostly seen online, when the organizing is in person and has a physical presence people are much more reasonable.
Also, the idea that the right doesn't infight is laughable lol. They're significantly worse than we are. Don't forget that American fascism is based on intense individualism and these people all think that they should be the leader. It's why you see so many "lone wolf" Nazis.
The only reason they can get away with the militias is because after Waco, the FBI won't go near them. Meanwhile they'd just put any leftist militia in prison for life (which is why SRA is so adamant about Not being a militia).
Most of the time people don’t want to hear that they were part of the problem regardless of your intentions and solutions, whether it’s out of pride, nationalism, or ideology.
You'd have a better chance of winning these people over if you actually told them the truth that they were manipulated and used for imperialism, rather than talking down to them like that.
It seems like communists were able to recruit the military because everyone was starving and suffering.
Or maybe those countries had a sense of pride and patriotism? Look at how much the Russian people loved their country in the USSR. Albania under Hoxha was very patriotic. Only when it's CHINA do people on this site approve of it. Western leftists have this weird hatred for everything that has to do with their own country and don't even want to think twice about the possibility of the everyman working class people having a sense of love for their country.
Fact is, a lot of people still have a sense of pride and love for America. By just telling them "fuck America", it isn't going to win them over. Most veterans who are disillusioned are very specific in how they talk about how much they love America and hate the government.
Ball Falls To Ground When Dropped. We Must Organize Against Gravity
I mean, the military is made up of the lower classes. while it serves a reactionary function, the people making up its lower ranks aren't necessarily ideologically committed against us and they certainly aren't materially so. we should in theory be able to recruit some percentage of them. I don't think this means, as some argue here, that we should cease criticism of vets or the military, just that we should make an effort to recruit those most accessible to us, then let them lead the effort to recruit a solid percentage of the military.
after all, who's going to train us to fight?
