American “Revolution”: The “Black Hole” of American Electioneering and the Lessons China Must Draw — Qiao Collective
www.qiaocollective.com
The assumption that the US political system is "perfect" prevents systemic critiques of American liberalism and individualism, Chinese blogger Tu Zhuxi argues.

Everyone outside the imperial core is subjected to the American/European outside observer, the least you can do is return the favor.

Maybe it'll stop some people from going "China bad this. China bad that" when they haven't read a single letter from someone who lives there.

  • snackage [he/him]
    6·
    4 years ago

    That’s essentially what the author is complaining about when he says the U.S. doesn’t function because “ethnicity, blood, land, language, culture, and history are not key factors” in its national identity.

    Why to willfully misinterpret what the author is saying there. This is not a complaint but an observation plainly stated. It's to draw a contrast between his assertion that US identity is based on "political values" instead of "ethnicity, blood, land, language, culture, and history are not key factors" because it's a nation of immigrants. You can disagree with him on the claim but you can't say he is saying that that stuff has to exist because he never says that.

    • skollontai [any]
      1·
      4 years ago

      The section is headed "Why Can’t America Criticize Its Own System?", with the clear argument that the centrality of political values to the system (as opposed to China's "national identity based more on culture and language") makes our system of government less effective and unable to respond to crises like COVID-19. That's a bad take. I believe you don't need a national identity based on a specific culture and language to create a successful political system capable of systemic self-critique. You're welcome to disagree, of course, but I encourage you to keep your eyes open against the influence of nationalism in any left movement--Chinese, American, or otherwise.

      • snackage [he/him]
        2·
        4 years ago

        I don't think America's identify is centrally based on political value alone but that's a point I'm not interested in discussing.

        I'm objecting to you quoting the author and misscharacterizing his arguments based on the out of context quotes. The author is writing for a Chinese audience and it's natural he would emphasis the Chinese situation. It's also undeniable that the American discourse never entertains a systemic critique and takes the American and by extension the post-WWII Western system of governance a priori as infallible. It's well within reason to want to interrogate why that is.

        • skollontai [any]
          2·
          4 years ago

          I don't believe I"m mischaracterizing his arguments, but agree to disagree.

          I guess in general I just wonder at the value of this kind of discourse. American media does China dirty all the time, making gross generalizations about a country of a billion plus people. The proper response to that is not to, in turn, make gross generalizations about a country of 300+ million (i.e. "American discourse never entertains a systemic critique and takes the American and by extension the post-WWII Western system of governance ipso facto as infallible"). Instead U.S. and Chinese leftists should be writing about each other's work, learning from each other's struggles and supporting each other's efforts. Dismissing BLM in the way this author does is not constructive to an international left project.

            • skollontai [any]
              2·
              4 years ago

              tfw Sanders is the entire American left

              I dunno, this kind of nihilism about the Western left may work for people who don't live in the West, but it's not politically useful for those of us who do. Ostensible "leftists" from other countries like the author of the article should be seeking to make connections with the people who are actually engaged in anti-imperialist struggle, not strawmaning Sanders as the leftward limit of American politics. The American left is weak, but it hasn't always been, and it won't always be. In my part of the U.S., being a Sanders stan is centrist. That's my point--generalization bad, amplifying the voices of comrades good.

                • skollontai [any]
                  2·
                  4 years ago

                  Lol, I said I wanted to burn the constitution one comment down from here, comrade. Totally agree that the regime is wholly unacceptable. I simply disagree with the author of this piece that the American left is DOA. The western left is not 100% made up of children who love Bernie Sanders... Chris Mullin saw the Corbyn/Sanders thing coming four decades ago.

                  Also I'm a fan of "political and civil rights" and not a fan of ethnic nationalism (anywhere, but particularly in one of the world's two superpowers). So yeah, I disagree with this author on a lot.

                  the American left has always, always supported American imperialism (wars, coups, sanctions).

                  Due respect, but you may wish to learn a little more about the history of the American left before you sound off like this. Both of the high points of American left power (post WWI and 1969) revolved around opposition to wars. Obviously I wish the American left had done a better job in opposing American imperialism, but the one thing you learn reading history is that there is always someone who is seeing the issue clearly at the time. I mean, there were even parliamentarians opposing British activities in India in the 18th century on what we would now call anti-imperialist grounds. The fact that they failed does not diminish the fact that they were right.

                  All “authoritarianism” smears against global south leaders can be traced back to the bullshit spouted by the “founding fathers” while they owned slaves. It’s a pseudo-religion which not even American leftists reject.

                  I hope you meet some actual American leftists someday. Founding fathers fetishism is the province of right wingers and people from Massachusetts, as far as I can tell.

          • snackage [he/him]
            3·
            4 years ago

            Fair enough. It's just I think Tu Zhuxi is 100% right when he says no current American will ever advocate for burning the constitution and anything less isn't enough.

            • skollontai [any]
              2·
              4 years ago

              Lol, I'm a current American, I'm here, I'm advocating for it! I know a few hundred other people in my local org who agree! More to the point, the American left has been advocating for it for centuries. You won't get it from Hollywood movies (though Reds is fun), but there's a long history from August Willich through Emma Goldman, Fred Hampton, London Meyer, the Lincoln Brigade, etc. etc. who all fought to get rid of the constitution in it's current form. Hell, abolishing the senate was a mainstream position from the failure of the postwar anti-lynching bills until well until the 70s. Rep. Dingell, the longest-serving congressperson in history and no leftist by any standard, called for scrapping much of the constitution in his retirement speech just a few years ago. These things are up for debate, comrade, and if those voices aren't appropriately amplified by the mainstream American media, they should certainly be amplified by a Chinese "leftist" writing about America.