- cross-posted to:
- memes@lemmygrad.ml
- memes@lemmy.ml
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The problem is that libs refuse to actually accept the truth. "Oh that's not capitalism, that's cronyism!" "That's not capitalism, that's corporatism!" "That's not capitalism, that's just the problem with big government corruption!" "That's not capitalism, that's just one bad example!" etc etc etc. You can show them an absolute mountain of evidence and they'll just wave it away until they can't, at which point they switch to "Well maybe that is capitalism, but that's just the price we have to pay! It's the best system we got! It's human nature!!!"
Libs are mostly unredeemable.
It's entirely vibes-based. You could show a liberal every piece of evidence as to why capitalism or the United States is evil, and why even the "good" things aren't even that good, and they'd dismiss each point as you went as "Well, sure, but that individual data point doesn't spoil the project as a whole, it still possesses many good qualities," until they've dismissed the entire graph of points. Because nobody is actually thinking in terms of "I am a disconnected impartial observer. I have a long list as to why capitalism is good and why it's bad, I have a long list as to why communism is good and why it's bad, and so on for every ideology or sect of note, and I simply follow the one with the largest number of good points, or smallest number of bad points." They might think that they think like that, but they don't - it's largely just vibes and horror/feelgood stories in the media that they've internalized.
Nor am I saying that one should think like that, that just sounds fucking exhausting and also impossible because until aliens make themselves known, there are no beings outside of the class dichotomy.
Talk of “manufacturing” and “inventing” suggests an imposition over and against the individual’s will. I believe that, on the contrary, the process of Western propaganda is better understood in terms of “licensing”: the issuing of moral license for the bourgeois proletariat to profitably go along with bourgeois designs without the feeling of shame overwhelming. In this alternative account people aren’t “brainwashed” insofar as they don’t actually believe the lies, not in the way that we generally understand belief. It’s more correct to say that they go along with them, whether enthusiastically or apprehensively, because it’s actually their optimal survival strategy.
Given that most non-Marxist economics is just ahistorical fiction and explicitly designed to best serve the rich, economics as a field is also part of this "licensing", despite being used as a justification by many liberals as to why capitalism is good and communism is bad.
I don't think you're conclusion follows. It really just seems that worldviews are not susceptible to a Popperian style falsification, which philosophy of science already knew like 50 years ago.
Orphan Grinding and Orphan Grinding accessories has been our way of live for hundred of years. My grandest father caught his first feral orphan at the wee age of 12 metric years and his father taught him how to safely operate the machine, which back then required a whole room and grinding a single orphan took 2 hours. His grandfather lost a leg because of the dangerous conditions and an orphan-involved jammed femur. The machines are much smaller and safer these days.
Liberals who are in a position to become uncomfortable/helpless usually figure out what the problem is
For me it seems nowadays the "capitalism is evil" is often the easy part, but getting through the part of "unfortunately there's no realistic alternative" is hard, no one wants to listen through an hour long lecture on economic theory (I rarely interact with ideological liberals in a context where these discussions happen to be honest)
Actual libs get a pass, they're anticapitalists like us. Any capitalist claiming to be a lib or someone claiming a capitalist a lib is just messed up from the life-long programming
That's not what liberal means.
There is no such thing as an anti-capitalist liberal. Liberalism is the ideology of capitalism. Liberals created the capitalist world order. That's not life long programming, thats several hundred years of political theory and basic definitions.
If you want to pretend that liberal means something else great, just don't claim that everyone else in the world using the word correctly is wrong.
I mean I think Richard Rorty makes a compelling case that anti-capitalism actually carries the purported goals of liberalism further than so called "liberal" economics and so he was happy to identify self-consistently as an anti-capitalist liberal.
Quick, what is the major right wing party in Australia called?
I'm part Czech part British part French. You'd be wrong in all of those countries too.
Can you also please tell me what the name of the party is that all the fascists created in Japan after ww2 and which still rules to this day?
Very czech/Brit/French/Japan -centric view. The rest of the world rolls their eyes
You mean like Nazis called themselves socialists? Do you believe them??
(Never trust a right winger. Never trust what they call others, never trust what they try to call themselves)
So you're one more throwing slurs at anti-capitalists etc. Mask off moment
The French liberals that carried out the Revolution would be rolling their eyes at you. The English and French political theorists that invented liberalism would be rolling their eyes at you
If liberals are staunch anti-capitalists, then name one
The french revolutionaries literally liberated themselves of the. same. things. we need again.
But you're messing with me. I now recognize the account from the other trickses you naughty ;)
The french revolutionaries literally liberated themselves of the. same. things. we need again
You think liberal just means belief in liberation? Okay, nice that you have your own special definition that no other leftist uses.
But you're messing with me.
No I'm being honest. Just like every other time I've replied to you
trickses
Where's the trick? You're the one claiming every other leftist is brainwashed because we don't use your personal definition of liberal. We use the one based in theory and history
And if you want to prove us wrong. Name one anti-capitalist liberal
Come on now. "You're claiming" you say on things once again come from your head. You're not even trying after all the friendly banter we tried.
Are you implying that a rhetorical mistake of someone assuming own thoughts as others' is somehow a disability?
When the point is mocking you and your bullshit, insults do work really well
It's a sure way to troll for sure. Pointless and a waste of energy, but we can't be angry at fire for burning for it is its nature
Apparently they just got banned for report abuse.
They never even named one liberal anti-capitalist
the best. Many people are saying this. Really terrific mods
The french revolutionaries literally liberated themselves of the. same. things. we need again.
The fuck you talking about that was a bourgeois revolution that overthrew feudalism. There's a reason Les Mis is about a revolt that took place 40 years later.
Yeah sure, they might do. What does that have to do with the issue at hand?
Very interesting! What feeling of yours makes you insert rage to my post?
You can take this as a "no u" if you want
It really is interesting that someone pushes these own ideas of rage and smugness towards someone else. Force enough and I'll get annoyed and you'll get a self-fulfilling prophecy? Plausible, but it's still weird until those qualities are displayed
I'm not a yank and what BurgerPunk told you is 100% correct.
But I suppose you're just trolling for attention.
With respect, liberalism is the ideology of free markets and private property. It is the ideology of capitalism. To be a "lib" is to be a capitalist.
If you still call yourself a lib and not a socialist, you should stop. It is political illiteracy.
This is a joke right? Literally have never heard anyone say this
they aren't sending their best
