The labour minister announces a major reform to the communist country's state-controlled economy.

uhh can anyone debunk this if it isn't true, or clarify if this is some dengist thing

Labour Minister Marta Elena Feito said the list of authorised industries had expanded from 127 to more than 2,000.

Only a minority of industries would be reserved for the state, she said.

  • _else [she/her,they/them]
    ·
    4 years ago

    i think the prc is a vile piece of shit imperialist stain on the world map since dengism, and I question whether it's any less awful than the american empire. I certainly don't think it's worse, but I do not think it is a good place.

        • RedDawn [he/him]
          ·
          4 years ago

          Yes I forgot about that part of Lenin’s Imperialism where he talks about how imperialism is when countries are big.

      • Veegie2600 [none/use name]
        ·
        4 years ago

        I often question whether China, Russia, etc. could manage to be truly imperialst of they wanted to. Like the U.S has both countries almost completely surrounded by propped up western puppet states.

      • _else [she/her,they/them]
        ·
        4 years ago

        oh they're better and tend to move with a softer less anvilicious hand than the west, but they are. if you want to to deny that, I want some of your drugs.

    • kimilsungist [they/them]
      ·
      4 years ago

      unless youve spent hours obsessively learning about china and its system please shut the fuck up, us people with a special interest in China's economic and political system are laughing at you

      • _else [she/her,they/them]
        ·
        4 years ago

        ive spent a lot of time learning about capitalism, yes. I don't love maoism, but I have a certain grudging respect, and I've taken some important lessons from it that are very dear to me. I mourn its loss in its homeland.

    • regenerativedespair [she/her]
      ·
      4 years ago

      Huh, interesting. I didn't realize there were people on the board that had this point of view, I was downvoted to hell on another account months ago for questioning the party's narrative around some parts of Chinese history. People were very...well, from my perspective, they were defensive.

                              • leftcompride [none/use name]
                                ·
                                4 years ago

                                If the validity of a viewpoint is dependent on the accomplishments of those who hold it, then the capitalist class must be right, considering that all economic development has happened under capitalist rule, including in the AESC.

                                Also what accomplishments have AESC done that capitalist states have not better? In terms of wealth, life expectancy, scientific advancement, etc.

                                      • leftcompride [none/use name]
                                        ·
                                        4 years ago

                                        wtf im a capitalist now since they achieved everything (including defeating the Nazis because the USSR was capitalist)

                                        • Praksis [any]
                                          ·
                                          4 years ago

                                          Just wanna say I love your posts purely because I finally get to see arguments from a non-ML standpoint

                                          • garbology [he/him]
                                            ·
                                            4 years ago

                                            It would also have been interesting to see ML counter-arguments to a leftcom position. Unfortunately all we got was PPB and shit-talking. Too bad.

                                  • leftcompride [none/use name]
                                    ·
                                    4 years ago

                                    That kind of rhetoric may be moving, but it should be equally moving for you when Taiwan and SK ended famine and hunger within 2 decades, or when Botswana became of the most developed nations in Africa due to their free market reforms. What's the difference between those countries and China/Cuba other than the red flags and socialist rhetoric? Why not champion those countries and their economic systems for achieving the same thing? You are simply desperate to find a "winning" team and that's why you latch on to these countries.

            • disco [any]
              ·
              4 years ago

              You say you’re a leftcom, but you’re standing for right wing regimes pretty hard in this thread. 🤔

              • leftcompride [none/use name]
                ·
                4 years ago

                Speaking facts is not "standing for right wing". All economic development so far has happened under capitalism. The concept of using China's development as a victory of socialism is absurd. Any liberal with a brain would laugh at any leftist trying to use China as an example of socialism.

                • PaulWall [he/him]
                  ·
                  4 years ago

                  lmfaooooooooooooooooo

                  just because you affirm your interpretation of the state of affairs as fact doesn’t mean it isn’t still just your interpretation of the state of affairs. what a weak fucking argument you have when you have to just affirm your view as if it was just a “fact of reality” as you say. as if reality isn’t structured by our ideologies. read kant and zizek

            • Harukiller14 [they/them,comrade/them]
              ·
              4 years ago

              South Korea

              That place that was essentially rebuilt with the help of the West in order to project western power next to North Korea? You don't say.

              • leftcompride [none/use name]
                ·
                4 years ago

                So SK would never have been able to develop without the West? Is that your thesis, that the orientals can only develop with Western aid? Did Singapore receive any aid? SK developed becuase of their industrial policy, strong state support of local capital, rule of law, and export oriented growth like China.

                  • leftcompride [none/use name]
                    ·
                    4 years ago

                    Glad to see we agree. There are too many delusional leftoids who think China is socialist or will be socialist, or that China's development is due to socialism. Im not even sure why people stan China.

                    • ItGoesItGoes [he/him]
                      ·
                      4 years ago

                      What an ignorant, you shouldn't talk about things you know nothing about. Besides, I can feel your clear bias, Western saviour complex, imperialism, chauvinism and racism.

                      Chinese people learn about communism since they are kids; the members of the party are required to learn about Marxism and do analysis every week. But here you are, you clearly know more than them, Western man.

                      I doubt you have ever been in China, and I doubt even more that know how to speak Chinese, yet here you are, talking shit about things you know nothing about.

                      I live in China, and know how to speak Chinese. This country is not perfect, there are many things that need to improve, but you know what? I know precisely because of communism, in China the state cares about its citizens; in China the state ultimately rules for the people, and not the corporations. The handling of the COVID is the best example of this: since the beginning of the pandemic the Chinese state used all his resources to save as many people as it could, even if it meant sacrificing the country's economy. Western regimes, on the other hand, keep continuously edging between trying to enact meaningless measures, and keeping the economy afloat, ultimately achieving nothing. This is just an example among many others. When you live here you notice how many socialist programs there are, and how many things are only possible here because of the communist nature of the state — a state that cares about people, and not a burgeoisie state that cares about corporations.

                      I imagine you want an example of the mentioned above, I will give you: I'm China the price of public transportation is ridiculously low, and allows you to go almost everywhere, even remote villages (I know well because my girlfriend is from one). The prices of public transportation clearly don't cover it's costs, it's clearly not profitable, yet there it is. And I will say it again: even to remote villages.

                      Now, if you are wondering what Xi thinks about the future of communism in China: http://www.qstheory.cn/dukan/qs/2019-04/01/c_1124307480.htm

                      I imagine you can't read it, which just proves what I already imagined: you are a western leftist chauvinist that opens his mouth to talk about things we knows nothing about. You are fucking disgusting.

                      Again, China is not a perfect country, and as a communist, I'm not happy with many things myself. But acting like Chinese know nothing about communism, but you, a Westerner that learned about communism yesterday, do; that's just not right. Also, saying the success of China is not because of communism, ayy lmao, what a fucking tool you are. According to your logic then India should have long reached, and surpassed China, India is a capitalist democracy, yet the differences between both states are clear.

                      With the shit you wrote you only proved how much of an ignorant western chauvinist you are. I hope next time you don't know shit about other countries, you keep your mouth closed, although I know it's hard for you, Westerners.

                      • LibsEatPoop2 [he/him]
                        ·
                        4 years ago

                        India only opened up to Neoliberalism in the 90s which was decades after China. Of course it hasn't achieved as much. There isn't anywhere for India to go right now than up (as far as the line goes anyway). But I'm not here to defend India. Repeatedly calling someone names makes you look childish. Not to mention, nothing @leftcompride wrote (that I've read so far or the comment you're replying to) seemed to involve any 'western savior complex' or 'imperialism' or 'chauvinism' or 'racism'. I don't like that they used 'leftoid' as a word, I'm not defending them or their opinion.I have a feeling they're not really a chapo anyways. But you are being needlessly aggressive.

                        • ItGoesItGoes [he/him]
                          ·
                          4 years ago

                          seemed to involve any ‘western savior complex’ or ‘imperialism’ or ‘chauvinism’ or ‘racism’.

                          His comments are a clear assumption that "Chinese don't know better", and "Chinese don't know about communism". Apparently, years of Chinese Marxist analysis are wrong, and they need this Western ultimate leftist to tell them they got it wrong, and how to do things well. Pretty racist imo.

                          But you are being needlessly aggressive

                          I'm just really tired of seeing people talking about things they don't know. The current sinophobic climate in the West doesn't help too. Also, I feel he is an useful idiot doing the bidding for Western imperialism.

                      • leftcompride [none/use name]
                        ·
                        4 years ago

                        Nice wall of text. Cant see any evidence that China is anything but a capitalist country tho.

                        Communism is not when people learn about communism. Communism is not when "government is benevolent". Communism is not when development happens. Your understanding of socialism is completely fucked and anti-Marxist.

                        • ItGoesItGoes [he/him]
                          ·
                          4 years ago

                          Nice nothing burger. Are there any communist countries in the world currently? Communism can't be immediately achieved, not when the international bourgeoisie still dominate the world. Having a party, and a state whose ultimately goal is achieving communism is better than nothing, however. Read the article I posted.

                          • leftcompride [none/use name]
                            ·
                            4 years ago

                            Ah yes the classic excuse of "they are on the path to socialism". Must feel great to have the main thesis of your worldview be an unfalsifiable claim. Don't have to do any kind of analysis at all, just wait for 2050. I suggest you read Marx.

                            • ItGoesItGoes [he/him]
                              ·
                              4 years ago

                              Nice assumption that Chinese communists don't do any analysis. Must feel great to spend your day raging about other countries you know nothing about on the internet, while you are doing nothing to change yours. Keep doing the bidding for Western imperialism. I suggest you to read the article I posted. Also, read Marx.

                              • leftcompride [none/use name]
                                ·
                                4 years ago

                                oh no im doing a heckin imperialism by stating basic facts. Imperialism isnt when people point out your capitalist state is capitalist.

                                • ItGoesItGoes [he/him]
                                  ·
                                  4 years ago

                                  Reminds me of the racists talking about black crime statistics in the US. According to them, they are also talking about "facts", nothing racist about it. This is similar but with imperialism.

                                  Honestly, you should consider the current cold war climate, and analyse if vehemently try to turn leftist against a country that — like it or not — is doing good to the world (offering free vaccines to African countries, investing in them, sharing knowledge...), and is opposing the biggest oppressor, and war criminals that has ever existed (the US), is appropriate or not. If you can't, I will tell you: you are being a tool.

                                  Btw, can't wait to see your incoming communist state, you surely will teach everyone how communism is done. Raging about other countries you know nothing about is sure helping, huh.

                                  • leftcompride [none/use name]
                                    ·
                                    4 years ago

                                    Reminds me of the racists talking about black crime statistics in the US. According to them, they are also talking about “facts”, nothing racist about it.

                                    Amazing logic.

                                    Honestly, you should consider the current cold war climate, and analyse if vehemently try to turn leftist against a country that — like it or not — is doing good to the world (offering free vaccines to African countries, investing in them, sharing knowledge…), and is opposing the biggest oppressor, and war criminals that has ever existed (the US), is appropriate or not. If you can’t, I will tell you: you are being a tool.

                                    Critizing China for not being socialist is imperialist and supporting USA? Just admit youre a Chinese nationalist who is hurt when people shittalk your country.

                                    Btw, can’t wait to see your incoming communist state, you surely will teach everyone how communism is done. Raging about other countries you know nothing about is sure helping, huh.

                                    Yep, this is pure nationalist bullshit. I don't even give a fuck about China, I just want to set the facts straight.

                                    • ItGoesItGoes [he/him]
                                      ·
                                      4 years ago

                                      Critizing China for not being socialist is imperialist and supporting USA?

                                      Love how you ignore everything I wrote. I will give you a simple example: someone is being unfairly targeted, and there are many lies being said about them; the intent of this is basically destroying that persons life. There is a group of people that don't think that person is bad, but are still influenced by what they hear about that person from others. Suddenly, someone in that group starts to talk shit about the person that was being targeted, thus adding more wood to the fire.

                                      This situation is the same, like or not you participating in imperialism. Moreover, your "criticism" comes from a position of ignorance, and knowing nothing about the country you are criticising. Not to mention, that by your definition, has any country truly been communist? Is there currently any? Also, you say I'm making excuses by saying that communism can't be achieved while the international bourgeoisie rules the world. Did you learned anything about the Paris commune at all?

                                      Chinese nationalist who is hurt when people shittalk your country.

                                      Oh yes, I'm a Spanish native, Chinese nationalist with Arab characteristics. If thinking I'm a butthurt Chinese national, instead of someone that knows more about China, and disagrees with you helps you sleep at night, you go.

                                      pure nationalist bullshit

                                      How does that has anything to do with nationalism? I wrote that because you are the one that is continuously showing that you know how to do communism right.

                                  • Praksis [any]
                                    ·
                                    4 years ago

                                    Saying China isn't socialist doesn't make someone racist, what an odd take.

                      • leftcompride [none/use name]
                        ·
                        4 years ago

                        Its not exploiting capitalism, jesus christ. It's the workers who are exploited. Nazi germany also dominated capital, to the point where they completely subjugated finance capital and forced the bourg to finance a suicidal war.

                        I’m still optimistic that we’ll see a more forward approach towards true socialism as economic dominance and security is achieved.

                        I'm optimistic that I can still grow taller at 30 and that Beyonce will leave Jay-Z for me.

                          • leftcompride [none/use name]
                            ·
                            4 years ago

                            Socialism is when you dominate capitalists (still an unfounded claim given that there more billionaires in China than USA). Critical support to AESC ofDemocratic Kampuchea