I remember under Obama, when the 4chan-themed India-hate was hitting a fevered pitch. "Designated Shitting Streets" was just the thing you screamed at anyone who suggested Indians were other than subhuman. Also remember all sorts of "They treat their women so terribly!" horror stories bouncing around the liberal-sphere. Generally a sick disdain for all these people.
Now India's our best friend. Indians are respected international allies. Guys like Modi are greeted with open arms by American liberals and conservatives alike. Real heel turn, from a country full of people with absolute disgust for the country barely ten years ago.
Weirdly, it all sort of happened as we were transitioning from "India Bad / Pakistan Good" to "India Good / China Bad".
Absolutely crazy how our foreign policy seems to trickle down into the basic xenophobia that forms the undercurrent of the American Id.
We have always been at war with East Asia, Eurasia is our friend.
Also, I'm looking forward to the shocked Pikachu faces of Hindu Nationalists when the West inevitably stabs India in the back after failing to contain China.
The US does indeed stab in the back as a general geopolitical strategy, but what do you mean stab Japan in the back? The US was anti-Japanese from WWI-1949 , took a few years to re-calibrate during the Korean war, and has been pro-Japanese ever since, with some techno-Orientalist yellow peril overtones sprinkled in at various points, particularly in the '80s.
Stab in the back is still a bit strong for what was essentially capitalist one-upmanship, and in an era where every two bit manager was reading the Hagakure and applying dubiously historical maxims about samurai to business mergers.
Hindu Nat: "No you see, America has used and betrayed Japan and China, both pale skinned Asians. Never would America do anything to brown people like me."
I think there will be sizable ratfucking on all sides before US/India relations eventually deteriorate. We've been squandering friendships in the region for decades, and we don't have anything resembling the kind of pull with European institutions (whose colonial ties were critical to controlling the African/Asian coastline) that we used to.
In the end, I wouldn't be surprised if the Indians fuck us over far harder than we manage to fuck them. They're racing towards modern industrial powerhouse and they've got a population to make it work. We're hollowing ourselves out with grifts while we flounder around in the Graveyard of Empires.
Sino-Indian solidarity is a powerful idea and wells up every now and then. It happened just a few years back with Dangal.
The biggest stumbling block is a few territorial disputes, but more importantly the general terribleness of the ethnonationalist Hindhu Right.
Whatever your thoughts are on CPC and Muslims -- and please let's not go into that -- it's undeniable that the official approach of the CPC is one of assimilation/integration. In contrast, the Hindu right sees Islam as a foreign religion that is incompatible with an Indian ethnostate.
In contrast, the Hindu right sees Islam as a foreign religion that is incompatible with an Indian ethnostate.
The modern Indian state exists precisely because it couldn't coexist with Muslims to the east or west. Endless internal conflict made the old empire ripe for Imperial control, and every new Hindu-Nationalist leader seems to inevitably fall into the lap of Western capitalists.
Hopefully, the Chinese sphere of influence expands and provides a third way between reactionary nationalist oppression and another generation of balkinization.
the territorial disputes are still serious, India and China have had skirmishes for decades. After the Sino-Soviet split India was aligned with the USSR
I’m not saying you’re wrong, but is there something that fundamentally distinguishes the US proletariat from the colonial European and Japanese proletariats? Or that makes them “worse” than the collaborating bourgeoise in colonized countries?
Personally, I put the proletariat of settler colonies in a different category from (in your example) European and Japanese proletarians.
The genocide of native peoples underlies the existence of settler colonies in a way that it does not for proletarians living in bourgeois "homelands". In other words, you can remove colonialism and genocide from the histories of Europe and Japan, both places would still exist in a similar sense. Remove said crimes from American or Australian history and both would cease to exist in the same sense.
This makes the proletariat of settler colonies much more resistant to the idea of revolutionary justice because for true justice to be done, their countries must cease to exist.
We’ve been squandering friendships in the region for decades
I have not been "squandering friendships in the region" nor has zifnab25.
When I see the US government do something, I do not in any way feel I have a part in that even if I benefit from it. There is no part of me that has a shared headspace or agenda or anything with any person in the ruling class of this country. When they do something I see it as the American 'regime' doing something, not "we". If your goal is to end these institutions, they are not "we".
I remember under Obama, when the 4chan-themed India-hate was hitting a fevered pitch. "Designated Shitting Streets" was just the thing you screamed at anyone who suggested Indians were other than subhuman. Also remember all sorts of "They treat their women so terribly!" horror stories bouncing around the liberal-sphere. Generally a sick disdain for all these people.
Now India's our best friend. Indians are respected international allies. Guys like Modi are greeted with open arms by American liberals and conservatives alike. Real heel turn, from a country full of people with absolute disgust for the country barely ten years ago.
Weirdly, it all sort of happened as we were transitioning from "India Bad / Pakistan Good" to "India Good / China Bad".
Absolutely crazy how our foreign policy seems to trickle down into the basic xenophobia that forms the undercurrent of the American Id.
We have always been at war with East Asia, Eurasia is our friend.
Also, I'm looking forward to the shocked Pikachu faces of Hindu Nationalists when the West inevitably stabs India in the back after failing to contain China.
Hindu Nationalists: The US isn't going to stab us in the back like japan!
The US: stabs them in the back like Japan
Hindu Nationalists: :surprised-pika:
The US does indeed stab in the back as a general geopolitical strategy, but what do you mean stab Japan in the back? The US was anti-Japanese from WWI-1949 , took a few years to re-calibrate during the Korean war, and has been pro-Japanese ever since, with some techno-Orientalist yellow peril overtones sprinkled in at various points, particularly in the '80s.
Plaza Accords
That would be the 80s yellow peril part.
Stab in the back is still a bit strong for what was essentially capitalist one-upmanship, and in an era where every two bit manager was reading the Hagakure and applying dubiously historical maxims about samurai to business mergers.
Hindu Nat: "No you see, America has used and betrayed Japan and China, both pale skinned Asians. Never would America do anything to brown people like me."
I think there will be sizable ratfucking on all sides before US/India relations eventually deteriorate. We've been squandering friendships in the region for decades, and we don't have anything resembling the kind of pull with European institutions (whose colonial ties were critical to controlling the African/Asian coastline) that we used to.
In the end, I wouldn't be surprised if the Indians fuck us over far harder than we manage to fuck them. They're racing towards modern industrial powerhouse and they've got a population to make it work. We're hollowing ourselves out with grifts while we flounder around in the Graveyard of Empires.
Sino-Indian solidarity is a powerful idea and wells up every now and then. It happened just a few years back with Dangal.
The biggest stumbling block is a few territorial disputes, but more importantly the general terribleness of the ethnonationalist Hindhu Right.
Whatever your thoughts are on CPC and Muslims -- and please let's not go into that -- it's undeniable that the official approach of the CPC is one of assimilation/integration. In contrast, the Hindu right sees Islam as a foreign religion that is incompatible with an Indian ethnostate.
The modern Indian state exists precisely because it couldn't coexist with Muslims to the east or west. Endless internal conflict made the old empire ripe for Imperial control, and every new Hindu-Nationalist leader seems to inevitably fall into the lap of Western capitalists.
Hopefully, the Chinese sphere of influence expands and provides a third way between reactionary nationalist oppression and another generation of balkinization.
the territorial disputes are still serious, India and China have had skirmishes for decades. After the Sino-Soviet split India was aligned with the USSR
Please don't use the term "we" in that context :cringe:
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Proletarians didn’t do the things you’re describing, and that’s what he’s alluding to.
The American people bear some responsibility for America's crimes just as the German people bore some responsibility for Nazi crimes.
The sooner the American proletariat realize that, the sooner they can start to atone for their crimes.
I’m not saying you’re wrong, but is there something that fundamentally distinguishes the US proletariat from the colonial European and Japanese proletariats? Or that makes them “worse” than the collaborating bourgeoise in colonized countries?
Personally, I put the proletariat of settler colonies in a different category from (in your example) European and Japanese proletarians.
The genocide of native peoples underlies the existence of settler colonies in a way that it does not for proletarians living in bourgeois "homelands". In other words, you can remove colonialism and genocide from the histories of Europe and Japan, both places would still exist in a similar sense. Remove said crimes from American or Australian history and both would cease to exist in the same sense.
This makes the proletariat of settler colonies much more resistant to the idea of revolutionary justice because for true justice to be done, their countries must cease to exist.
I'm not the US government. I hate the US government and I will cherish its destruction tbh.
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Something they wrote:
I have not been "squandering friendships in the region" nor has zifnab25.
When I see the US government do something, I do not in any way feel I have a part in that even if I benefit from it. There is no part of me that has a shared headspace or agenda or anything with any person in the ruling class of this country. When they do something I see it as the American 'regime' doing something, not "we". If your goal is to end these institutions, they are not "we".
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literally :1984:
Go to a Youtube comment section and any mention of Indians is gonna be accompanied by "bobs vagene" jokes and references to telephone scams
God damn it I liked "show bobs," didn't know that was an indian joke :deeper-sadness:
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