Hi, so I'm in my last year of a CS degree, I worked in a few tech jobs before I went back to school, and I have a job offer for when I graduate. But I'm also a zoomer at the start of my career, so take this with a grain of salt.

I don't think that tech jobs are disappearing, but maybe they're becoming more like you're average Bachelor's degree job. The way I think about it is that you have the top range of PMC jobs, that take many years of education, lots of support, and maybe a little intelligence to get. Stuff like, doctor, lawyer, professor. Then, there's like the B tier of PMC jobs. Stuff like generic office, lower level teacher, nurse, average engineer. Sometimes, a B tier field gets really in demand due to our inherently unstable economy. That's been tech for the last decade. You could get some basic programming skills at like a bootcamp, and then get a 6 figure job at a venture-capital filled bubble company. Now it's is more like the average office job. You need some education to get started, and your pay won't be that exceptional, but its still a solid middle class lifestyle.

The last thing I want to do is discourage you. I totally think you should go get a CS degree! But, data science is one of the harder difficult choices for tech subfield because you need to know both the computer stuff and the statistic stuff at the same time. Usually, you need a master's degree, and the field is changing really fast. There are a lot of other little tech areas tho. Embedded development, web development, cyber security, sysadmin/cloud guy, SRE, are all not going anywhere.

Also, definitely be careful about taking what "everyone online" says about tech seriously. Sites like or 🟧 are full of 1st year CS majors, guys who listen to 97 hours of Joe Rogan a week, and immigrants who are terrified of losing their visas. There are literally like a million people out there who work boring normie tech jobs for standard midsize companies writing Java, or fixing AD, or configuring GCP or something, and going home to their families after a normal day at the office. They didn't lose their jobs during the dotcom bubble, and they won't lose their jobs now. I hope this will be me!

it's still fine but unless you turn out to be spectacularly talented at some specific thing you will probably end up going into a less trendy, lower paying (but still pretty good compared to many other careers) specialization like sysadmin or enterprise software

entry level tech job market is pretty deep in despair judging from experiences of my friends and acquaintances that got laid off/just graduated

But if you're going to graduate 3-5 years later, who knows what the job market will look like then? A lot of the layoffs/decreased hiring is also purposeful class warfare on the high coding salaries from employers

Do you already have a computer background? I would just be wary of going back for an overpriced degree is all. Frankly, if you're looking for useful skills I'd lean heavy towards AI and security. The combination of the two will be very useful in our cyberpunk dystopia.

Those doomers that say CS is dead are just straight up wrong. They're either not in Tech at all or expect the big boi Companies to be representative of all Tech.

Truth is, every single Company needs CS people nowadays. Most commonly Sysadmins and Consultants/Help Desk people. Those companies might not pay out 7 digits for doing shitall all day, but they exist, they're reliable and most of the time working conditions are significantly better than in any other field of work.

Now idk if it's like that in other countries, but here in Germany we have an apprenticeship system set up so that people can get into the CS field exactly how they'd get into a trade field - they apply to be an apprentice at a company (with 0 experience, straight out of high school in some cases) and then the company is responsible for giving them appropriate and supervised work 2-3 days a week while they go to a specialized trade school the rest of the time. (You do get paid a small, but mostly livable wage) After 2-3 Years you're done, get a certificate that you're qualified to work in CS on almost the same level as people who went to college for it and most of the time the company you did the apprenticeship with will pick you up as a Junior. The plan after that should be to stay with them until you get a good footing in the field and then hop over to another company - the fact that you have worked in a real environment will put you higher on other companies radars and make hopping much easier than getting an entry-level position right away.

It is the absolutely easiest way to get into CS imo and if there is an equivalent to that in your country I highly recommend it!

Data science and computer science are two definitely different things. In computer science, they're not gonna teach you how to use the tools you'll use in a programming career, more than they'll teach you how those tools were built. In data science you're basically a DBA with a statistics background. Either piece of paper you get, and sometimes with neither, your outcome will mostly depend on how self-motivated you are to git gud at the bullet points and buzz words employers are looking for. And in this market you gotta be ready to work the job boards with every bit of tech and sso savvy you get, you're gonna be sending off a hundred applications unless you "know a guy". Employers are leery to hire juniors because they're worried they can't recoup their education investment before you leave 1 year in for higher pay. If you're self-motivated and have a github that shows it, you can generally find your way. Big companies are more likely to hire any warm body with a degree. Maybe not in this specific market, I know seniors who have been jobless and looking for a year. But this is just a blip, by the time you're educated it'll be a different market, still hard to get in probably. Point is, being interested in the thing is the real advantage.

It's absolutely worth it. People are still getting hired out of boot camps.

Entry level is like 4x the salary of retail.

Dude (or dudette/non-dudenary), are you me?

Probably my exact plans for the future right now: Go back and finish my CS degree and get out of "permanent retail hell", and unfuck my life.

Take this comment with a grain of salt, but every job market prospect shows that CS probably isn't slowing down any time soon. If you want extra reassurance, you can look into master's programs in a more specialized field that some employers are willing to pay for. Right now, If I were to master I would go for robotics.

I would say only saddle yourself with the debt if you're passionate about it. Else, do a coding bootcamp.

I was able to get a great FAANG position just on what I was self taught, fwiw. But that's because I'm super passionate about a number of aspects of tech.

Hey I can see a lot of people are recommending sysadmin roles, but reading your comments you seem like you're more interested in software development. They're two very different fields and software Dev pays a lot more on average.

It's hard to transition from sysadmin to dev, I've worked in IT as a system administrator for over a decade and I don't know anyone personally whose done it. I wouldn't count on moving into software development from IT.

Either of these positions are immeasurably better than retail :)

Source: former systems admin, now a software engineer. I went back into education for a degree in CS.

i've heard the sweet gig is a programming job at a non-tech company like a bank, but that was like 5-10 years ago.

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Have a clear picture of what role you want in the end. Is there a specific company you want to work for? A specific technology you want to use?

To talk about my career, instead of going into CS, I ended up going into engineering, but after working I technically? ended up doing CS simply because I did coding on the side throughout uni. During my first year working after grad, after I saw what the industry is like, I painted an idea of what I want to do, got back in touch and talked to a bunch of my professors, and specialized in a CS-adjacent (technically it is CS according to my country, but I don't agree) field, which is where I am at currently.

So when you say you want to study data science it sounds very general. There are RA jobs in universities, planning roles in manufacturing/O&G plants, forecasting for businesses, bog standard accountant roles, engineering R&D, and that's just off the top of my head for data science, but your CS knowledge would offer you an even wider gamut of roles to choose from - though employers look for specializations first and foremost. Have a look around online regarding what roles you can get, research those in depth, and if the vibes are vibing then you can work towards that in uni, choose electives and major courses you want that interest you. Don't be afraid to refine your trajectory during your studies, especially since you'll get to know some faculty that can guide you as you learn about what's possible. If you specialize you will not have any issue at all getting a job with such a degree, and the fact that you vibe with whatever you specialized in will help you a lot.