Oathtaking and oathbreaking used to be something of a big deal. How y'all feel about going back on shit you say? Does the involvement of a holy book change your answer?

I think preoccupation with truthfulness and propriety is probably good, but what is expedient very often does not align with that. So my word probably is not bond lol

  • theother2020 [comrade/them, she/her]
    ·
    3 years ago

    I think our word is important for the trust and stability of the community that provides the greater good. But there are also noble lies or lies told for safety. I think most of Abrahamic religions specifically address this - not that that necessarily means much, but it's interesting. See Taqiya

    When considering lying, I think as leftists most of us would consider the power dynamic - it's okay to lie to your boss/landlord/etc when they hold the strings on your livelihood and shelter.

  • hollowmines [he/him]
    ·
    3 years ago

    My word is generally bond....but lie to your boss as much as possible

  • CapsaicinAddict [they/them]
    ·
    3 years ago

    My ideals are that one should always be as honest as possible and appropriate within the context. Kant can fuck off, I’m not telling the killer where the person is hiding. Depending on the context that may mean lying, a weaselly answer that’s not a lie, or simply not answering.

    That being said I also lie a lot because the personal cost of being truly honest all the time is very high in a society which accepts a certain level of dishonesty. I called in sick yesterday, I was hungover from my uncles birthday. If I worked in a coop rather than retail I would have been honest because the stakes are different.

    I guess we might have to differentiate between “lies that are valid under capitalism” and “lying as whole”.

    I don’t break oaths though.

  • GreenTeaRedFlag [any]
    ·
    3 years ago

    There's a difference between saying you'll doing something, giving your word, and swearing on it. Whenever I give my word on something, I execute it fully and honestly. However, I can just cancel or bail on things I just say "yeah, I'll do it" on. I try to avoid lying in general, but make exceptions for certain cases.

    • eduardog3000 [he/him]
      ·
      3 years ago

      Damn, I might try that to not fuckin forget to do something two minutes after I'm asked to do it.

      • GreenTeaRedFlag [any]
        ·
        3 years ago

        I find it helps to try to write things down. I keep a notebook on hand and put anything important I need to do down in it.

        • eduardog3000 [he/him]
          ·
          3 years ago

          I mean like I hung up the phone call where I was asked to bring something, finished getting the dog on a leash to go, and that made me forget the thing I was just asked to bring. Not even enough time to write it down before its gone.

          • GreenTeaRedFlag [any]
            ·
            3 years ago

            If it's something important or someone you don't want to let down, repeat it back to make sure you heard it right. This puts it more solidly in your head and lets them know you are really listening. Then immediately write it down before starting another task.

    • AlexandairBabeuf [they/them]
      ·
      3 years ago

      whats the difference between saying youll do something and giving your word? like promising? is a promise different from a swear?

      • GreenTeaRedFlag [any]
        ·
        3 years ago

        If someone says "hey, can you do this?" and I respond "yeah, later." I see that as just saying I'll do it. If they talk to me and say "this is important for reasons X,Y,Z, can I count on you(or something like that)" and I say "Yes, I will make sure it gets done in this fashion." I see the first as just kind of acknowledging that they spoke to me and trying to keep it in mind, but the second as actually me consciously agreeing to it. A promise could be more like my giving my word or swearing to it depending in the context. My view is my word means I am binding myself to an action and will see it done, but I could theoretically try to back out(by talking to them about it) if something else comes up or the circumstance changes. If I swear to something, I have to see it done, come hell or high water. I can come off as overdramatic about this sort of thing. This is because I am both religious and practice a code of honor, which heavily influences what I place value in.

  • WhatAnOddUsername [any]
    ·
    3 years ago

    My word is bond. JAMES bond.

    I think ItalianMessiah's post pretty much summarizes my attitude towards when it's okay to lie.