Good research. I didn't know about the animal caretaker contract thing with Ft. Detrick. Gargantuan, if factual.
Couple of things missed: There was an outbreak June 2019 next to Ft. Belvoir, Fairfax Virginia (40 miles away from Detrick)
https://i.imgur.com/oBP0ikH.png
https://i.imgur.com/e9ey2L9.png (sick for over 2 weeks lol)Multiple athletes also reported COVID symptoms after returning from the Wuhan military games. Perhaps seeded there?
Also, the March 2019 Spanish sewer samples. Probably the least important evidence, but still might be important.
The genetics of the virus suggest an East Asian origin but I do get a bit of a thrill from some of these facts. It's clear, at minimum, that shit was going down in the US and probably Europe at least a month before China recognized and reported it.
PS: a Maryland, localized entirely within your Fort Derrick!?
Re: manufacturing viruses generally: this is just scarless DNA editing and it's been around for over a decade. It's not unique to this situation at all, it's the modern bread-and-butter of molecular biology and related fields. It has been possible to produce lab strains without obvious signs of engineering for a long time. This isn't really a counterpoint to the idea of engineering a virus, just want to point out that it's not special or damning that they also started using these very standard techniques in their own work.
Re: the genome looking like it came from East Asia, this is because it has homologs from bat coronaviruses in caves in and near China. A lab-engineering theory would require that it specifically be made to look like it came from certain areas of China or that after realizing it had gotten out of hand, they used internally documented origins of the genome, which would've had to come from a library of bat viruses from those areas, to create a scapegoat.
It's possible, but it's multiplying the coincidences you'd need to have and that always damages theories. Though to be clear, I don't put the malice outside the capacity of the US MIC. I am more dubious about their competence, though.
Yes, SARS-CoV-2 has horseshoe bat coronavirus homologs. The closest-related ones have been found in China, Laos and Cambodia but trying to put together phylogenetic trees with limited data means it could be from any number of similar bat coronaviruses.
What is most notably against the idea of lab engineering is the ACE2-binding moieties and their genomic determinants. This would not be something engineered from scratch via bespoke design, it would require shotgun-ie strategies like serial passage, but the genome itself suggests otherwise: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7095063/
It's also important to note that scarless recombinant DNA techniques are ubiquitous and that any argument about the possibility of stitching together bat coronavirus DNA with something else applied to basically any lab working with coronaviruses - including imperialist lab-leak theories about the Wuhan Institute of Virology.
Finally, consider that we already had SARS and then MERS. Your hypothesis has to be better than the null one, which has to be the animal reservoir hypothesis - something that keeps happening over and over again and about which many scientific papers have been warning us for years and years. Coronaviruses have a lot of animal hosts and jump between them frequently, posing a continual danger
The genetics of the virus suggest an East Asian origin
not at all. Cambridge Coronavirus Study - shows variant of covid found in China is newer than ones found elsewhere https://web.archive.org/web/20200410111500/https://www.cam.ac.uk/research/news/covid-19-genetic-network-analysis-provides-snapshot-of-pandemic-origins
I’m once again asking to explain where are genetic variations in usa in march 2020, if it was there for 5 months
But I’m troubled with exactly this, say you have ten thousands cases with vape lung (covid0). For it to get into 1 variant in wuhan, then 2 with Italy and later usa, it has to pass some sort of bottle event (or what’s it called, when other variants all die out), so that thousands cases either all stopped mutating (very doubtful) or stopped spreading
Variant 1 was not from Wuhan. https://web.archive.org/web/20200410111500/https://www.cam.ac.uk/research/news/covid-19-genetic-network-analysis-provides-snapshot-of-pandemic-origins
You could call the one in Wuhan variant 2. 1 was in Europe or the US.
The vapes angle is interesting, I had forgotten about that. Did they just stop making bad vapes or did they stop reporting vape deaths? What's the official story?
IIRC the official cause of death was due to vitamin E in weed vape cartridges, which was used to make the fluid thicker.
Hmm. I'm down for a good conspiracy theory and the timing kind of works, but I would have to look into the sources more to believe it's covid and not vitamin E thickening..
True - though even if it wasn't a cover-up itself it'd follow that it's a more visible cause of respiratory illness, and so would probably get some press during an early wave of COVID-19.
Yeah I'm thinking that it was a very early wave that then mutated to become worse later on. It's just not extreme enough to be like the Covid that we saw in 2020.
Yeah this is probably the weakest point for the conspiracy. It would require that pathologists across the US failed to draw a connection between the "vape-lung" symptoms and a virus for something like 2700 cases and over 50 deaths. Likewise, the scale of conspiracy required for there to be rampant states-wide COVID, in the form of the variant found in Wuhan, and no epidemiologists picking up on it, borders on absurd.
That being said, that there were multiple outbreaks of a mysterious respiratory illness in close proximity to Fort Detrick can be damning enough. Like other posters said, it is substantial if there are legitimate competing origin theories that implicate the US.
Obviously, regardless of origin, that some nations adopted psychopathic public health policies, and others, not, is definitely primarily relevant. And the sources for a lot of OP's points need to be examined, because pushing this theory can be dangerous, given that it couples nicely with batshit-insane conspiracies like 'the great reset' that obfuscate real power relations and undermine a marxist analysis.
I just dont know - if we assume that all of OP's claims about the events do actually involve COVID, and that most of those events were caused by deliberate and malevolent actions, then why? What does a military or CIA intelligence operation stand to gain from a widespread, out-of-control epidemic? There are much simpler ways to drum up propaganda against China. And shock-doctrine style manufactured crises that benefit the elite really seem unnecessary when natural crises and global destabilization from climate change are already occurring more and more frequently. Maybe I'm missing something?
But conversely, if these events did involve COVID and were largely due to incompetence rather than deliberation, I just don't see it happening, for the aforementioned reasons that the sheer scale of incompetence would have had to have been tremendous. Maybe American medical and public health institutions are just that bad?
Maybe American medical and public health institutions are just that bad?
I read Nightmare Scenario in July. And I came away from that book genuinely shocked we can even call them "institutions".
Likewise, the scale of conspiracy required for there to be rampant states-wide COVID, in the form of the variant found in Wuhan, and no epidemiologists picking up on it, borders on absurd.
Why is it absurd? Are you saying US medical care is actually good? Better than China who is used to dealing with stuff like SARS?
It just kinda fizzled out, so AFAIK nobody is really sure
Here's my image dump. It was a US bioweapon that's been floating around since Summer 2019
https://imgur.com/a/CRwan3n (I deleted the old one, this one has captions added)
Okay heads up. I made a new image dump with captions to make the reading more convenient.
https://imgur.com/a/CRwan3n
It doesn't quite match up. Maybe the virus mutated once it reached Wuhan?
In light of all this, is there any reason to believe the mainstream US media story about the origin of COVID? It feels just as stupid as believing that lee Harvey Oswald acted alone but I don't know anything so maybe I'm wrong
I'm just going to be honest the Fort Detrick stuff is just recycled propaganda from the 80s when the USSR claimed that HIV/AIDS was created/spawned out of Fort Detrick. I'm just going to say, the USSR and GDR spreading AIDS misinformation is definitely one of the worst things that they did, it led to revolutionaries that they co operated with actually believing in many incorrect things about HIV that ended up causing a lot of harm. (See ANC officials weird stances on AIDS for example). That's not to say that they were uniquely evil or any red scare nonsense, the west was spreading even more harmful myths about AIDS back then. Like blaming it on gay people or POC. It's just that this literally the exact same thing, just replacing HIV with COVID 19.
It makes me worried that people seriously believe it. Is it a fun conspiracy theory? Yea, but it's just that, not anything with concrete evidence. We don't have any concrete evidence of where COVID 19 started in the first place, and recycling HIV/AIDS conspiracies from the 80s, but with COVID 19 this time, just because it's anti USA, is not a good thing to do seriously.
As someone that lives in a country where 1 in 5 people under fifty are HIV positive, and has seen the harm that HIV/AIDS does, I'm just very wary about old HIV/AIDS origin conspiracies being recycled.
Even pretending that this isn't plausible, who is harmed by this conspiracy theory? Only the US government. The only thing it would change is to further remove blame from China and, by proxy, reduce the amount of anti-Asian hate crimes being committed in the US and similar places.
Not really, because the Fort Detrick stuff is essentially saying that COVID 19 is man made or influenced, which opens up Pandora's box for a lot of conspiracy brained people.
"If COVID 19 is man made, why trust anything scientists in the west say, they made the virus? Why get vaccinated with a "western" vaccine, they made COVID 19 after all? Why wear masks? Why self isolate?"
That's the rabbit hole it can lead some folks down. It's harmless in spaces like Hexbear because both the mods and community itself have a very strong stance on being against COVID 19 misinformation. In the real world, this does not really exist much and conspiracies run wild. I've seen someone go down this path and believe that COVID 19, ebola and HIV were created by the USA. And refuses to get vaccinated, as all we have here are "western vaccines". And I don't think it's useful to contribute to that with yet another conspiracy and muddy the waters further.
Also, why would racists change their opinion based on facts in this hypothetical scenario anyway? Racism is of itself illogical, if it was proven that COVID 19 came from Fort Detrick they'd just change their position to say that China covered it up while the USA tried to alert the world, or some other brainwormed stuff. And then continue to be racist.
thoughts about this? https://www.betterworldbooks.com/product/detail/was-jonestown-a-cia-medical-experiment-a-review-of-the-evidence-0773408126
this feels really really out there
on the other hand Amerikkka has done way worse shit
commenting to add to what others have said about USA's long track record of biological warfare
the shooting that occured at FD is also very odd
https://taskandpurpose.com/news/military-record-fort-detrick-shooter/
Woldesenbet had been assigned to the Naval Medical Research Center at Fort Detrick since August 2019, according to his official record, which the Navy provided to Task & Purpose.
Re: US propensity for bioweapons, does anyone else remember stories suggesting swine flu outbreak in China was connected to like mysterious packages shipped with infectious material or something? Speculation that there was a deliberate attempt to disrupt their pork industry (biggest producers and consumers) or food security.
Searching but I can't find anything about mystery packages unfortunately
Oh yeah the US has done that a bunch, I swear there's a mega post around here somewhere with all of them listed but I can't find it
Pinning the deaths of five million people to a single country through speculation is dangerous business. Sure, American intelligence is shitty and evil for sitting on their early knowledge of an outbreak, but I do take issue with painting random scientists as nefarious perpetrators and I also take issue with the insinuation that there was an intentional coronavirus release.
I'm not versed on all of these contents, so I won't ramble on anything. Fort Detrick and American intelligence possessing the means of creating this coronavirus does not translate to also having the motive and intention. It doesn't translate to guilt, it doesn't translate to much at all besides "America knew coronaviruses could be stealthy bioweapons." It doesn't explain why they sat on their ass so much. They never could have fooled themselves into thinking that a virus released to the biggest trade partner of the United States would somehow only remain a problem for China.
One powerful shitposter on the internet is certainly not going to be key to unraveling any American conspiracy to sicken the world. I'm certain that if this idea had major merits, China would be far more vocal about it beyond their five minute CGTN clips about Detrick.
