Permanently Deleted
Having a space program to advance our species and civilization: I Sleep.
Having a space program to win a dick measuring contest against your geopolitical rival: Real Shit.
US is setting itself up for another massive L I see. Framing this in term of US having to beat China to the moon will only make it more humiliating when that doesn't happen.
Love to stake my national pride on something I have a real chance of losing, for no reason.
Like, the propaganda notion that the US "won the space race" is so deeply ingrained in western, or even worldwide liberal historical understanding that it's basically unassailable. So why would you put it up for grabs again?? Just declining empire things I guess.
Haha right, there's zero benefit for US to play this up as a new space race. They could've framed it as China catching up to what US did decades ago, but clearly there's just too much insecurity at play here.
If China does beat them to the moon this time, the US will just insist it "doesn't count" because "we got there first anyway." There isn't as much danger to their national pride from losing this as you might think, Americans are masters of moving the goalposts.
They are going to use this as an excuse to just throw more money at Musk and Bezos and then that money will just disappear.
Honestly with capitalist enshittification and how all the new fancy tanks and planes have all turned out to be glorified planned obsolescence $6000 flathead screwdriver plastic iPhone live action Disney Cocomelon dogshit like everything else this country produces, I wouldn't be surprised if all their efforts end in literal flames just like all the dogshit space dildos Elon Musk has detonated on the tarmac the last decade. I say go for it, why not accelerate the decline of this bastard country with a few trillion in glorified bottle rockets. Man these rulers are such jokers.
This might be a hot take here, but for all of Elon's overhyped flops like the Hyperloop and car tunnels, the Falcon 9 does have the lowest launch cost per kg out of any rocket and is the only family of orbital rockets with a demonstrated reusable propulsive landing system. That's not to say they'll have the lead forever since there's a fundamental limitation of private enterprise, but currently they're ahead in several important ways.
I'm convinced that the Falcon rockets are so success (in part) because Musk was too busy fucking around with Tesla, Starship, etc. to fuck around with the Falcons.
What you won't find a lot of people talking about his how Falcon 9 got its wings, and how it's stayed ahead since. It's one of the most impressive rockets in history, don't get me wrong, but it was paid for by the state, just like other impressive rockets like the Saturn V and Soyuz.
SpaceX got its start with CIA venture capital money (In-Q-Tel). That same CIA connection, Michael Griffin, then became NASA administrator and magically made the first contract with SpaceX happen, saving the company and Musk from otherwise certain bankruptcy. Griffin, in a Trump administration position, would later award Musk a contract for the military use of Starlink satellites as well.
I think the main things SpaceX has brought to spaceflight is the lean manufacturing and lean development model, and related to that the risk acceptance to even attempt propulsive landing and the type of reusability Falcon has achieved. All of which could have been done by public institutions as well, but weren't because the Soviet institutions were gutted after the coup and the US has only ever done spaceflight as a MIC affiliated public-private for-profit partnership.
Yeah for sure, almost all of the US' most impressive accomplishments were state funded. Privatize the profits, socialize the costs.
I remember Fidel Castro comparing USA to USSR in 1961: USSR did space travel, USA did mercenary invasion.
why? is something special there that we have to get to first?
I understand why we should go there, just not why being first matters so much. we’ve already been there, so, it’s not like it’s really the first time.
We left our phone up there and if we don't go get it China will find it and read our embarrassing texts out loud at lunch
Beijing can see my furry batch. I’m proud I don’t shave. They can also read my sad text that I am struggling with losing weight. I’m sure Pooh bear will be riveted with that thrilling journey. 
Depend for whom. For US it's a dick measuring contest. The fact they stopped back then and then proceeded to forgot the rocket science is a clear indicator of it.
For China, country that can plan for decades ahead, it's logical scientific endeavour - Moon is the closest stellar body and its exploration, even if completely worthless otherwise, is very important step in developing space technology. And as they said they aren't racing, since USA motives are so clearly not even competing in the same meaning.
OK, I didn’t make my comment absent of thinking what you just explained, and I get that China thinks this and that the US is being gamed into thinking this, too, but again I ask what is the realistic end game of this? Is it all political Brinksmanship? Because the realistic goal of this is kind of stupid. I mean you see this right?
This is silly. Isn’t it? Am I wrong with this? 
I’m not trying to waste your time here, and I’m just trying to figure out if this is more than just a bunch of dick waving.
I think you answered my question. Thank you for your time.
he3 maybe for fusion but that would require some long term planning that the west would never do and it's not concentrated anywhere it's trapped in crystals mostly on the far side
concentrations of water ice for rocket fuel. there's also a few primo spots in craters that would allow nearly 24/7 solar power and also have water ice in shadows under the regolith
i could see china planning for space industrialization way down the line and the U.S. haphazardly chasing behind them throwing dumb money and elon at it
No, I get that. But it’s not anything they could realistically mine now, nor is it anything we don’t know is there too. They’re just going there to say, “hey we’re in the moon!” I say, good for them. So, what is the realistic point of landing a lunar lander there? Is it just a publicity stunt? Are they just trolling us? And what is the usefulness of that?
I guess it’s just a propaganda stunt, and I guess I understand that from a Chinese perspective. 
It's for shovelling public money into the hands of a few useless corporations, like everything the US does.
If they tried to get there again, I hope they didn't neglected to put toilet facilities onto their spacecraft this time.
I'm all for a new space race imo, just one that's a little more well planned out by the comunists, instead of bleeding money that should be spent elsewhere.
Modern For All Mankind plotline? Can we get some global communist community too?
China should build a giant neon hammer with a solar powered lithium battery up there, so that on a crescent moon the night sky lights up with a hammer and sickle.
We might start by passing a budget, just a thought!:-P
Spaceships don't grow on trees you know!:-D
NASA is an integral part of the US MIC. It is the moral duty of every leftist to oppose NASA in all of its endeavors.
Unlimited Apollo 1s on the American space program.
The furthering of science is an endeavor that all of humanity should support. Do you think NASA sits around all day dreaming about shooting rockets and that’s all they do?
Would you rather the money be given to NASA? Or the US Navy? I’d rather have space missions then another US carrier.
Calling for astronauts to be burned alive is also disgusting.
The furthering of science is an endeavor that all of humanity should support. Do you think nasa sits around all day dreaming about shoot rockets and that’s all they do?
Furthering of science is good in the abstract but not if those scientific advancements fall first and foremost into the hands of the most vicious and violent empire of our time. The fact that they actually do make launches is the problem - NASA provides much of the lift capacity for America's military satellite fleet and develops many of the technologies that allow the US to militarize space and the upper atmosphere.
Like yeah, cool, NASA's latest probe showed us what the inside of an asteroid is made up of. Let me just share that fun science fact with the Palestinian orphan whose parents were blown up by a GPS bomb guided by satellites NASA helped launch.
NASA is more then just “shoot rocket”. That’s not what I mean by “furthering science”, and like I mentioned, launching and creating military centered satellites falls to the airforce, not NASA.
NASA are a bunch of nerds sitting around computers analyzing atmospheric data and long range telescopes in the middle of the godforsaken wilderness a hundred miles from the closest person.
And I would rather have more goofy space nerds then US weapons of war.
Further, who cares that the US discovers something first? There is nothing they can discover that would “tip the scales” and be some sort of world changing event that would lead to more US terror. What they find can be utilized by others instead of having duplicate efforts simply wasting time, manpower, and effort. Science should not have borders. Just because some will try to use it for war doesn’t mean that it’s now horrible.
If NASA was able to be completely decoupled from the military industrial complex, you might have a point. But as it stands, whatever they discover, especially if it turns out to be tactically advantageous, will immediately be classified and used only for secret military shit.
Goofy space nerds are no longer incompatible with US weapons of war, we have a space force now.
The Space Force are not Star Wars stormtroopers. They are compsci nerds doing institutionally backed hacking. It’s just the Airforce v2 for propaganda sake. Plus it’s abysmally tiny because you don’t need hundreds of thousands of compsci nerds.
It’s just a different name for a US hacking military outfit. They aren’t doing research into nebulas and space rocks.
If the US government can weaponize vaccination programs, foreign aid and infrastructure loans, I have zero faith that our space military won't be used for doing space nazi shit. Besides, there's no way the data gained from genuinely innocent NASA launches hasn't been collected and used to model preemptive nuclear strikes or some other shit. It doesn't matter how small-intentioned or militarily inconsequential they may be now, anything under the purview of imperial power, even just it's knowledge, will eventually be turned towards Imperial ends.
We've already been weaponizing our military space program by hiding the location of Starlink satellites iirc. Orbital minefield lmao
Technically a Kepler field, which just fucks everyone over.
A wonderful reason why capitalists should be entrusted to chose the most ethical options : )
Yes, that’s why we should urge funding to be spent not on scientists collecting data that could be used for preemptive nuclear strikes, and instead on building more nuclear missiles, submarines, and weapons of war. That is the better path forward.
I want money to be spent on something that could have military applications, but furthers the global community and humanity in our understanding of the cosmos. I do not want that same money spent on Gerald Ford Carriers, M4’s, and F-35’s.
Those things are just a tiny bit more useful to the imperial war machine in waging war then rock samples and atmospheric data.
NASA isn't just "goofy space nerds," though. Their legacy dates back to "Nazi rocketry nerds," and from there it's "progressed" to simply being "genocidal imperialist rocketry/satellite nerds."
The current US rhetoric (which is nothing new- now it's Biden, just a few years ago it was Trump with "Space Force," before that it was the now-defunct "Star Wars" program, etc) and the close collaborations with the MIC are all examples of what US aerospace development seeks to offer the world- death, destruction, and hegemony.
Like it or not- science may not have borders, but the industries that further it absolutely do- and the US (and the west in general) has never hesitated to exploit these issues, and use them to sabotage, threaten, or destroy other nations. NASA is "less bad" than the US simply investing all it has in doomsday weapons or actual military operations, sure, but I don't wish them any luck- rather the opposite- all the same.
NASA blows, they collaborate with weapons manufacturers all the time
https://www.nasa.gov/news-release/nasa-lockheed-martin-reveal-x-59-quiet-supersonic-aircraft/
"Instead of actually putting money into feeding and housing our citizens, we are instead going to focus on sending people to a floating, barren rock in space once more."
