The Biden administration is asking Congress to provide more than $13 billion in emergency defense aid to Ukraine and an additional $8 billion for humanitarian support through the end of the year.
It's kind of funny seeing these kind of comments on Lemmy and playing the "alt-right or tankie" game before you see someones instance.
What we as the west get from helping Ukriane, is soft power in that it sends a message to other dictators around the world that we won't just sit back and let them plough into another country, and while we might not start WW3 over it, we will support them to make it hard as possible for you.
Yeah, invasions are out of fashion. All the West does is make a country's development contingent on their willingness to let the West exploit their natural resources and labor and then cut said development if they fund a social program or coup them if the "locals" are uncooperative. All after gutting these countries for hundreds of years via colonialism. You don't need to do an invasion when you can just put a noose around the neck of a country.
Oh and the West still does invasions look at Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan, and Syria. And UK special forces have been in Syria, the Sudan, Nigeria, and others as recently as last year.
Hey, Space Neoliberalist. If you ever touch some real theory (instead of reading Harry Potter and The Washington Post), like Lenin. You would know that this is an inter-capitalist conflict (you know what that means?). If you think that USA is helping in good faith (and not in the interest of colonialism exploitation in the long run), you are an idiot.
“fashy past grievances reasons”
So denouncing the crimes of the west is fascist now?
-“Hey USA shouldn't have supported dictatorships in Latin America with their Plan Cóndor, or helped in the coup against the democratic elected Salvador Allende. Or dropped two atomic bombs in two civilian cities, or having the highest incarcerated population doing slave labor, or burn with napalm villages, or puting children in cages in the border, or….”. I could be all night talking about USA crimes. A whole month with the Nato members crimes.
-”Shut up fascist.”
Is always projetion with you liberals. Scrath a liberal, and a bloodthirsty nafo fascist bleeds.
The problem with "both sides" arguments is you tacitly admitting your side is wrong when you do that.
Yeah sure the US shouldn't have done those things in the past. But these are past grievances, which is the cornerstone of fascist thinking. "Our present day horrible actions are justified because of the horrible things others have done in the past!"
Whatever US and any other NATO members did wrong in the past doesn't make what Russia is doing today right.
Also, why should Ukrainians suffer so that Russia can expand their empire?
I have no doubt about the ability of fascists to go on and on about past grievances. But what grievance do you have with Ukraine specifically?
You clearly didn't read the Lenin book I linked and, by seeing your activity in here, you are close to the ban.
So I just want to say that is so fucking funny that you think that the passing of time exonerates USA from their crimes. I mean, how much time has to pass? They are still putting children in cages, invading countries, having the highest incarcerated population, making coups in foreign countries, etc.
But let's follow your logic, and let's wait a few years. That way all the Russian crimes will be just past grievances.
Whatever US and any other NATO members did wrong in the past doesn't make what Russia is doing today right.
It was wrong for the US to coup Ukraine's government, but also wrong for Russia to intervene to stop the coup government from killing civilians after like 8 years, got it.
The people of Ukraine got tired of being a Russian puppet state and removed Putin's crony. The instant they did that Russia started taking territory from Ukraine.
You're weird little narrative only works if you believe that Ukrainians don't have a right to self determination and believe they shouldn't have sovereignty over their land. This is simply Russian neocolonialism, Russian imperialism, and Russian Fascism.
The people of Ukraine got tired of being a Russian puppet state
the pre-maidan government was not a puppet. europe and russia were both courting ukraine for her resources and president what's his ass took the better deal that putin offered. if that makes it a puppet government, what does that make the coup government where the US picked high ranking officials?
You're weird little narrative only works if you believe that Ukrainians don't have a right to self determination and believe they shouldn't have sovereignty over their land.
Your weird little narrative only works if you believe the denizens of Crimea and Donbas don't have a right to self determination and sovereignty over their own land.
This is simply Russian neocolonialism,
Neocolonialism isn't just "colonialism happening today". Neocolonialism is what the west is doing having Ukraine sell off its land and industries in bulk to foreign capitalists via privatization.
Bud I'm begging you read one serious academic text analyzing the rise and system of fascism, before you do something embarrassing like call indigenous people complaining about what the US has done to them fascists for airing past grievances.
Also 'we haven't invaded anywhere in the very immediate past (though the genocidal war criminals who perpetrated our last invasion are still important and celebrated public figures)' is a pretty fucking weak justification from a country insisting on being world police.
Don’t worry, it’s not like half the people in Scotland want to leave the UK. That could never possibly happen! Imagine! Voting to leave a huge unpopular imperialist neoliberal organization! Utterly preposterous! Could never happen in a million years!
One that they were happily part of for several hundred years don't forgot. They had a referendum and decided to stay, you can't keep running them every few years until you get the result you like. Besides Scotland leaving the UK and the resulting chaos of negotiations will make Brexit look like a walk in the park, the SNP aren't honest with their voters about that.
Only white countries though, when it comes to black people and brown people you don't give a rats ass, there's still dictators all over the world that none of you even give a s*** about
That's fine but why are they banning socialist parties, integrating fascist paramilitaries into the army, and privatizing land? That all seems a little familiar.
Yeah we've really cultivated a lot of prestiege on this one, the west definitely hasn't absolutely embarrassed itself and unified large swathes of the world against it. And hey, it only took like three rounds of sabotaged peace talks and and multiple generations of Ukranians fed into a big novelty Northrop-Grumman branded meat grinder.
it sends a message to other dictators around the world that we won't just sit back and let them plough into another country,
You mean like the collective west did to Yugoslavia, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya? Who's supposed to send the message to our dictators when it's time to stop?
It's kind of funny seeing these kind of comments on Lemmy and playing the "alt-right or tankie" game before you see someones instance.
What we as the west get from helping Ukriane, is soft power in that it sends a message to other dictators around the world that we won't just sit back and let them plough into another country, and while we might not start WW3 over it, we will support them to make it hard as possible for you.
Maybe you should stop plowing into other countries yourselves, you bloodthirsty psychos.
The UK hasn't invaded anywhere in almost two decades, what are you waffling about.
Yeah, invasions are out of fashion. All the West does is make a country's development contingent on their willingness to let the West exploit their natural resources and labor and then cut said development if they fund a social program or coup them if the "locals" are uncooperative. All after gutting these countries for hundreds of years via colonialism. You don't need to do an invasion when you can just put a noose around the neck of a country.
Oh and the West still does invasions look at Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan, and Syria. And UK special forces have been in Syria, the Sudan, Nigeria, and others as recently as last year.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/may/23/uk-special-forces-have-operated-secretly-in-19-countries-since-2011
Average neoliberal Pirate. Your bloodthirsty country should return all the gold and art that was stolen from all around the world.
PD: Read about neocolonialism.
Yeah neocolonialism the thing Russia is attempting right now. If you oppose neocolonialism you should oppose Russia.
Or do you just hate western countries for fashy past grievances reasons?
Hey, Space Neoliberalist. If you ever touch some real theory (instead of reading Harry Potter and The Washington Post), like Lenin. You would know that this is an inter-capitalist conflict (you know what that means?). If you think that USA is helping in good faith (and not in the interest of colonialism exploitation in the long run), you are an idiot.
So denouncing the crimes of the west is fascist now?
-“Hey USA shouldn't have supported dictatorships in Latin America with their Plan Cóndor, or helped in the coup against the democratic elected Salvador Allende. Or dropped two atomic bombs in two civilian cities, or having the highest incarcerated population doing slave labor, or burn with napalm villages, or puting children in cages in the border, or….”. I could be all night talking about USA crimes. A whole month with the Nato members crimes.
-”Shut up fascist.”
Is always projetion with you liberals. Scrath a liberal, and a bloodthirsty nafo fascist bleeds.
The problem with "both sides" arguments is you tacitly admitting your side is wrong when you do that.
Yeah sure the US shouldn't have done those things in the past. But these are past grievances, which is the cornerstone of fascist thinking. "Our present day horrible actions are justified because of the horrible things others have done in the past!"
Whatever US and any other NATO members did wrong in the past doesn't make what Russia is doing today right.
Also, why should Ukrainians suffer so that Russia can expand their empire?
I have no doubt about the ability of fascists to go on and on about past grievances. But what grievance do you have with Ukraine specifically?
The
are strong in this one.
You clearly didn't read the Lenin book I linked and, by seeing your activity in here, you are close to the ban.
So I just want to say that is so fucking funny that you think that the passing of time exonerates USA from their crimes. I mean, how much time has to pass? They are still putting children in cages, invading countries, having the highest incarcerated population, making coups in foreign countries, etc.
But let's follow your logic, and let's wait a few years. That way all the Russian crimes will be just past grievances.
Let's just do that.
Fascist pig
Why should ukranians suffer so that the us can expand its empire?
It was wrong for the US to coup Ukraine's government, but also wrong for Russia to intervene to stop the coup government from killing civilians after like 8 years, got it.
The people of Ukraine got tired of being a Russian puppet state and removed Putin's crony. The instant they did that Russia started taking territory from Ukraine.
You're weird little narrative only works if you believe that Ukrainians don't have a right to self determination and believe they shouldn't have sovereignty over their land. This is simply Russian neocolonialism, Russian imperialism, and Russian Fascism.
the pre-maidan government was not a puppet. europe and russia were both courting ukraine for her resources and president what's his ass took the better deal that putin offered. if that makes it a puppet government, what does that make the coup government where the US picked high ranking officials?
Your weird little narrative only works if you believe the denizens of Crimea and Donbas don't have a right to self determination and sovereignty over their own land.
Neocolonialism isn't just "colonialism happening today". Neocolonialism is what the west is doing having Ukraine sell off its land and industries in bulk to foreign capitalists via privatization.
Bud I'm begging you read one serious academic text analyzing the rise and system of fascism, before you do something embarrassing like call indigenous people complaining about what the US has done to them fascists for airing past grievances.
Holy shit at least look the fucking word up in a dictionary before you try to turn it around on someone else you buffoon
Even if you were going to butcher the term 'colonialism' THAT'S the one that's relevant if a country is being occupied militarily.
WHY DO YOU SPEAK AT ALL. YOU NEED SO MUCH READING AND LISTENING BEFORE YOU STOP SPEAKING NONSENSE. INVESTIGATE WHAT YOU SAY AAAAAAAA
Neocolonialism understander has logged on
Nah, I'm good cheers.
How dare you call me a murderer? I haven't killed anyone in almost two years!
Except that in this case they are saying that while killing someone.
AKSHULLY right now I'm just repeatedly stabbing a man. We can't know for certain if he's actually dead until I'm done.
Tell that to Yemen.
Also 'we haven't invaded anywhere in the very immediate past (though the genocidal war criminals who perpetrated our last invasion are still important and celebrated public figures)' is a pretty fucking weak justification from a country insisting on being world police.
Absolute brain worms claiming this as a talking point
Have you heard of scotland/wales/northern ireland?
Scotland were willing participants in an act of union what formed Britain you absolute melt.
Don’t worry, it’s not like half the people in Scotland want to leave the UK. That could never possibly happen! Imagine! Voting to leave a huge unpopular imperialist neoliberal organization! Utterly preposterous! Could never happen in a million years!
One that they were happily part of for several hundred years don't forgot. They had a referendum and decided to stay, you can't keep running them every few years until you get the result you like. Besides Scotland leaving the UK and the resulting chaos of negotiations will make Brexit look like a walk in the park, the SNP aren't honest with their voters about that.
That’s where you’re wrong 😉
That's literally democracy. Why do you hate democracy?
It's a form of democracy, but how many systems practice full direct democracy on every issue all the time?
National self-determination is an important issue, so if many people support secession, you should hold frequent votes on it
Haha self-determination goes brrr
Noticing you didn't defend the other two instances
We were literally in Libya bombing civilians and training al quaeda cells just 12 years ago
They were in Afghanistan until 2014
https://www.nam.ac.uk/explore/war-afghanistan
huh, i see comments like yours and i think "lib moron" and then i don't give it another thought.
No the message to other dictators is ‘be useful to us, or else’
yeah exactly
This would be a great emoji
Probably a two part emoji or it's too small.
https://hexbear.net/post/310898
What message is America sending to the dictators that we bankroll while they perform genocide using US equipment and training?
Those are the other dictators. There's also our dictators - those are the good ones!
Do you think the west has a genuine interest in consistently enforcing this or do you just not care when people you like do it?
Only white countries though, when it comes to black people and brown people you don't give a rats ass, there's still dictators all over the world that none of you even give a s*** about
That's fine but why are they banning socialist parties, integrating fascist paramilitaries into the army, and privatizing land? That all seems a little familiar.
Yeah we've really cultivated a lot of prestiege on this one, the west definitely hasn't absolutely embarrassed itself and unified large swathes of the world against it. And hey, it only took like three rounds of sabotaged peace talks and and multiple generations of Ukranians fed into a big novelty Northrop-Grumman branded meat grinder.
You mean like the collective west did to Yugoslavia, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya? Who's supposed to send the message to our dictators when it's time to stop?
only WE plough into other countries USA! USA! USA!
You could say the same thing but with putin sending the message and it would be more acurate.
This is giving "the UN is an effective international governance body" energy.