i cannot believe how comically apropos and ironic and terrible the entire thing was
ok, get this
first off they came in on a sat night and reserved like half of our fucking tables, like a 30-top so we had to rearrange the entire place for their meetup. they show up huddled outside the restaurant like boy scouts waiting to be lead by their troop leader, but like, 34 year old men (who look EXACTLY like you would expect these fucking dorks to look like; seriously, not even gonna describe them, just picture an effective altruist and yes, thats exactly what they ALL looked like, it was surreal)
ok anyway then they are directed by their troop leader to be seated and that there's a one drink minimum tonight (the leaders have t shirts that say effective altruism on them.....uggghhh), they all proceed to order one drink
literally the rest of the night they do not order a single god damn fucking thing. one of them ordered like 2 sides of fries for the entire group and 2 pizzas for the entire group of 30 people. these pizzas feed 2 people a piece... like, maybe
they proceeded to complain that we arent filling their waters enough. as i refilled their waters, i had to listen to the most insufferable fucking dialogue i have ever heard in my entire adult life. oh my god i was trying so hard not to burst out laughing and/or murder them every time i walked by, like "i was thinking the other day, is it ethical to even exist??? bro, i dont know, sopheclese says" blah blah fucking blah and prenatalism vs promortalism and holy fucking mother of god dude we get it you listen to the sam harris podcast shut up shut up shut the fuck up before i take that pizza tray and beat your ass to death with it oh my god
they then tried to split the check 30 ways, I AM NOT MAKING THIS SHIT UP. YOU CANT, I DARE YOU
we were so staffed up (it was a fucking SATURDAY NIGHT) and we made zero fucking money collectively because these fucking pretentious adult children do not understand the most basic fucking etique, norms or standards that pertain to regular fucking civil society, we must have collectively lost $500 in tips for the entire staff because of the people we physically could not seat because of them.
they stayed until an hour after closing and we had to physically start removing their tables to get them to leave. i will never forget this night
the tip was a pittance obviously, even broke college students tip better, anyway, had to share!
they then tried to split the check 30 ways
No jury would convict you.
Okay I've never worked a restaurant before. You can't just beep boop it into the computer and scan 30 cards? Why would that be rude?
You have to scan all 30 cards, then print out receipts for all of them, then assemble each card with its corresponding receipt, then prep 30 pens + card holders for that, then hand them out to the right people, then input all of their tips afterwards, and hope nobody fucks anything up else you're dragging a manager over for the worst night of your life.
It's actual hell dealing with more than 3 cards per table.
Oh yeah, in the US they’re still using paper signatures and click-clack machines from 1982.
These people suck and should be put in the contraption but it is baffling as an Australian that people in other countries just don't tap their credit card oncw the machine one and it's done.
I'd definitely prefer electronic menu ordering if 30 people are going to pay individually. Have had to do it before when everyone at a large gathering is broke af and no one can afford the float even if everyone can afford their meals >.> EAs have money though, at least one of them can afford to be 1k poorer for a night while their friends get back to them
Thank you for the explanation. I'll try to keep it in mind in case I'm ever organizing a large group
What @DefinitelyNotAPhone@hexbear.net says and on top of that you also have to retroactively figure out who ordered what, which takes fucking ages because people have no idea what they've ordered so you gotta sit and wait for them all to discuss and work out who ordered what "yeah but you ended up eating a bunch of my fries!" and how they split everything and it's just... ugh.
If you're more than 4 (and even that is pushing it) just have one of you shell out and then figure out the bill amongst yourselves afterwards.
Mao and Lenin (and the millions of party members who fought and died for a better future for their people) are unironically the most effective altruists in history, evidenced by the life expectancy charts showing immediate spikes even as the revolution was ongoing in Mao's case.
Such a weird concept. Do they think everybody besides themselves tries to help people without ever giving a thought to how?
What do they think charities do all day? Do they think they just sorta dig wells in random spots and never think about the science of it?
The purpose of effective altruism is to provide a justification to not be altruistic. To them their decision to not tip, to work for an evil tech company, and to support reactionary politics can all be excused as necessary to support the greater good.
For effective altruists, the most altruistic course of action possible is to amass as much money as possible, so that it can be donated to prevent an evil all-powerful ai (the devil), from causing the singularity (rapture), and imprisoning human consciousness for an eternity in virtual torture chambers (hell). Conversely by paying tithes to create a good ai (god), we can create a transhuman paradise on Earth (heaven), and bring the dead back to life to live forever.
They have reinvented Christianity to such an extent that they're even managing to steal the crown from the post-Church crowd as the worst people in a restaurant.
They have reinvented Christianity to such an extent that they're even managing to steal the crown from the post-Church crowd as the worst people in a restaurant.
perfect. That brought back some flashbacks to sunday lunch shiftsmy parents are those people and it is mortifying to be out with them, I would rather cook a giant meal myself for them than do it
if I forget to bring cash to make up for their shitty tip, I have to sneak away and pull the server aside, give them my debit card, and ask them to please order me a small dessert etc so I could tip them, while apologizing profusely for my parents' attitude
they weren't like that 15-20 years ago, idk what happened – both of them had difficult, public-facing, service-oriented jobs that they were good at, and they used to be really kind to other working people
To them their decision to not tip, to work for an evil tech company, and to support reactionary politics can all be excused as necessary to support the greater good.
I came in to ask what effective altruists are but this sounds about right.
"I don't give homeless people money or food because it just encourages that kind of behavior"-type people
Some of these people believe homeless people are actually middle class and pretending because it pays better than getting a job. I had one tell me he honestly believes they go home, wash up, and then go engage in upper middle class pastimes once they get enough money standing on the side of the road.
I'm not sure how you even argue with that.
The unfortunate truth is there are panhandlers that are not homeless. I have personally seen people picked up in Audis after holding a homeless sign near me.
It is usually women with children, but I don’t know their situation. They could be being trafficked or taken advantage of, but it does happen.
Unfortunate for the people out there that need help.
I've been dropped off at my local welfare office in my dad's Jag and then Tesla. Wealthy-ish parents who did not believe in trickle down but did invite me over for dinner time to time. Weird. No idea what people's circumstances are (also, being homeless with a car, if its an Audi or a 1993 Toyota Corolla, is a lot nicer than being homeless and having no car).
there was a guy who became locally infamous in my area for making a good living panhandling
he had a spot near the off-ramp everywhere that qualifies as a city, but because there are a lot of genuinely kind people here who had tried talking to him to get him plugged into public and private assistance and he was strangely honest with them, and because he was foolish enough to park his well-maintained new-ish vehicle very close by every spot, and because these are small cities with a lot of overlapping traffic and social circles, people eventually figured it out
(there was even a stink in the local newspaper, the archives of which are hard to search because it was eaten 10+ years ago by a big conglomerate that will only let me look at a handful of articles a month)
I remember it so clearly because we were so fucking broke at the time – Medicaid, SNAP, WIC, HEAP, etc, and still barely getting by – and I had given that dude money a few times. I still give money when I have it, but that incident makes me wonder sometimes how foolish I should feel about it – some people have his vibe, unfortunately.
then there's someone like the lady with kids I gave a $20 to a couple months ago; she almost cried and seemed genuinely super happy and grateful, so either she is an incredibly talented actor or she really needed that $20 more than I did 🤷 idk, maybe both, maybe she has realized that a big reaction to gifts makes others more inclined to give them, but also nobody wants to sit with their kids for hours next to a busy intersection with only an umbrella for shelter on a clear 90F day with 85% humidity
I think the origin of effective altruism was more "it's better to take a high-paying finance job and donate the excess money to charity than get a job at said charity" but I don't think many of them are actually donating half their incomes every year.
Do they think they just sorta dig wells in random spots and never think about the science of it?
I mean yeah, kinda. The Three Cups of Tea guy built a bunch of schools that are being used for storage sheds because he didn't have any idea of what it would take to run a school in Afghanistan. Peace Corps is basically make-work projects for idealistic college grads with no real world experience. The Gates Foundation built high tech toilets for rural areas that were stripped for metals pretty much immediately. Tons of nonprofit money is wasted because anyone can raise money thinking the solutions are simple and then discover that the reality is a lot more difficult.
Effective Altruism had the kernel of a good idea in that it initially proposed that interventions be evidence-based and actually help the most people. But then they got bit by a radioactive Utilitarian or got lots of money from someone who knew that the real purpose of philanthropy is reputation laundering and suddenly it was all about kajillion simulated space consciousnesses and flimsy justifications for protecting the incomes of software engineers at Facebook.
Effective Altruism had the kernel of a good idea in that it initially proposed that interventions be evidence-based and actually help the most people.
You are giving these deeply ignorant people too much credit. Development and Change has been published since 1970. Just because they're ignorant of the field, doesn't mean they pioneered it.
man, the money over value delivered is so fucking real across the entire non-profit world, at least in my experience.
to give, solicit, and receive massive grants for projects is the only thing the organizations care about, as it is the only metric the organizations reward with raises and promotions. if you dedicate yourself to actually delivering on the promises made, your career will go nowhere as the people who made the promises and told the story of how work was done will absolutely take credit for being The Brain behind your effort, creativity, and labor.
it's explicit in CVs and professional introductions, "so and so won a grant for 4 million dollars" etc. the organization takes their indirect / administrative cut, and then proceeds to give zero shits about what happens after so long as some reports are submitted which are completely churched up so as to be borderline fraudulent. but ultimately, it seems like funders don't even care most of the time.
when it comes to philanthropy, it doesn't even matter because rich people get the tax dodge for their charitable donations. but if regular ass people with common sense ever got into a position to audit public funding organizations to see "what the fuck actually happened" with many if not most of public funds, heads would roll. i swear, if you want to shit in the punchbowl of a non profit, next time some well remunerated asshole brags about a big grant they brought in, starting asking about the outcomes, detailed deliverables, and evaluations and to see the survey data they used to come to their conclusions.
if you dedicate yourself to actually delivering on the promises made, your career will go nowhere as the people who made the promises and told the story of how work was done will absolutely take credit for being The Brain behind your effort, creativity, and labor.
Not all that different from any other capitalist enterprise in that regard, really.
if they understood even something so basic as tipping politely, they wouldn't be spending so much of their time having shower thoughts about "effective" altruism at each other. like, it's moron children going through baby's first existential crisis, poorly, together, with literally no material reality to ground them it seems.
I can tell this is slightly dated because there's no mention of treat printer tech/LLMs.
I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:
I honestly believe these thickheads are thinking shutterstock
they proceeded to complain that we arent filling their waters enough. as i refilled their waters, i had to listen to the most insufferable fucking dialogue i have ever heard in my entire adult life. oh my god i was trying so hard not to burst out laughing and/or murder them every time i walked by, like "i was thinking the other day, is it ethical to even exist??? bro, i dont know, sopheclese says" blah blah fucking blah and prenatalism vs promortalism and holy fucking mother of god dude we get it you listen to the sam harris podcast shut up shut up shut the fuck up before i take that pizza tray and beat your ass to death with it oh my god
10/10
It's the strategy of naming your cult "The Being Good and Correct Movement" in order to mask your unhinged beliefs as sensible.
Daniel Dennett (or maybe it was Dawkins?) tried to have the New Atheists be called "the Brights"
you see they'd love to tip like normal decent human beings but pushes up glasses by operating as-if they are selfish narcissistic assholes, they can eventually use all the money they saved by not being decent normal people to cure all of society's ails
this is not an exaggeration in any way btw, they actually believe this
Cook here: I have never ever contaminated food but I would have everyone on staff spit in their food the second I knew what they were there for. Honestly I'd probably refuse to cook for them and tell the manager why not later and risk the consequences.
The most infamous of the bunch is SBF of the FTX fraud fame. Essentially their entire schtick is that they have to become ultra wealthy so they can donate more money and thus be more effective with their altruism. They usually end up working finance and arguing that since they make a lot of money and their donations are bigger they're better off than if they were doing a more useful job and not giving even a small portion of what they were.
If they're not funding communist guerrillas then they fuck off with their "altruism" bullshit
Actually, funding Harry potter fanfic will get us to a kardashev 1 civilisation faster.
