A sheriff in Michigan is defending some of the men accused of plotting to kidnap Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer, questioning whether the men were planning a “felony arrest” in comments that drew condemnation from the state’s attorney general.
Thinking of the Bourgeoisie and it's apparatuses as monolithic is fallacious. There is a bigger schism in the bourgeoisie now than there has been since the first civil war. The FBI is seen as a bunch of deep state liberals by chuds and they're kind of right. The FBI is whole hog in for finance capital and the cosmopolitan bourgeoisie while local PDs are loyal to small capital and by extension (through political alignment) heavy industry and extractive capital. If there is a conflict surrounding the election, it will be a conflict between these Bourgeois factions and their hired guns.
Didn't Mueller announce the reopening of the investigation into Hilary Clinton the night before the election because his own guys in NY were going to leak a bunch of shit if he didn't?
It's known that the NY Office was all a bunch of Guliani fanboys that eventually turned into Trump fanboys. That's not exactly how it is around the rest of the country though.
Leftists aren't going to be a factor in this at all. It's going to be the reactionary National Bourgeoisie vs the liberal Cosmopolitan Bourgeoisie. The former has influence in police, some federal agencies and with private right wing militias, while the latter has more money and arguably the military leadership, intelligence community and certain federal agencies.
I think nationalism is their ideological tool in the recent past but they're really best characterized by their physical holdings/land: agriculture, energy, manufacturing, etc.. and they have plenty of support in the military - enough that it will definitely split when this conflict boils over.
There is no animosity. FBI are mostly ex-local cops, and FBI is america’s political police
I think you're underestimating how hard they get when they get to exert dominance, though. They're institutionally on top and guard that very jealously, even if that means stomping on their own allies to do it. Police departments attempting coups are a direct affront to the feds' authority, and they'd almost certainly come down on it hard to preserve their own status and power. Hell, they'd probably do it if it was other feds trying to do a coup too, if for no other reason than eliminating their own personal competition, since surely cracking down on "those traitors in [whatever branch]" would be a notable accomplishment when they're trying to suck up to their boss while golfing at the country club.
As I said, you're underestimating their elitism. They're not gonna sit idly by and watch some dumbass cops rise up against their state, nor would they tolerate open rebellion in their own ranks. Like if J. Chudly from the Pedo-Honeypot task force joined an armed rebellion, G. Ammon in Major Crimes isn't thinking "well gee he makes a good point" he's thinking "if I clap him in handcuffs maybe I can get his office and take his spot golfing with Director Ghoulhart."
They're vile, criminal ghouls, but they're interested in preserving the status quo and the institutions of the state because that's where their power comes from. Open, armed rebellion is a direct threat to their power and their cushy lives. That's kind of the key division in the American right that's been there forever: there's the established bourgeoisie-aristocrats and their lackeys that fill the highest echelon's of the state's violent enforcement branches, and there's the resentful fascist petit bourgeoisie who lack the social connections to really be on top and their cronies who fill out local police departments (this is how America existed as a fascist apartheid state and the number one global sponsor of fascism over most of the 20th century while also having a lively, violent fascist resistance against them domestically). They both have vested interests against the left, but they also have their own power struggles to consider: the upper class fascists want to preserve their power and gain more, which requires preserving the system they already control; the vulgar fascists want to seize a bigger share of the pie for themselves and feel that the established system is their enemy because it doesn't provide that to them.
That's why the feds routinely step in to fuck with local pigs and fascist militias when they step too far out of line: they accurately see the role of the police and of fascist paramilitary groups as beings weapons of terror against the working class and left, but when they threaten the rich or the state itself they'll step in and make an example of them to try to keep the others in line.
There were NY FBI agents leaking stuff about Hillary Clinton to hell trump win before the 2016 election. The FBI has plenty of the vulgar fascists in it. And trump has installed more of them in the leadership roles at the top of agencies such as DHS etc. it’s not as clear but as you think it is any more. All the local cops have to do is make some BS up about voter fraud after the election and start arresting Democrat politicians who they don’t like. And the FBI would mostly go along with it i think.
They're absolutely on the same side and will band together when needed, but there's a history of them stepping on each other's toes and fucking up each others' work
So let me get this straight. In the event of a constitutional crisis where different Bourgeois factions are vying for power, one represented by extractive capital, heavy industry and small capital and the other represented by international finance capital, tech and the service sector, you think all enforcement branches of the state will unite....to attack people with zero power. I honestly don't see how it would make sense for people in the midst of a power struggle would be uniting to go after people without power.
No offense man but it kinda sounds like you have a very surface level analysis of the situation and make a lot of assumptions purely because they're the worst outcome and not because they're based in reality
I’d also like to add a piece of evidence from reality: the FBI is not investigating the US marshals/prison guards/local cops/sheriffs who gunned down Michael Reinhoel in an obvious extrajudicial assassination. They’re just ignoring it, like they will ignore much much much more violence by the nationalist bourgeoisie faction as they attack their perceived enemies, likely including attacks on some democrats or local election results they don’t like, etc.
The FBI won’t arrest cops.
The san diego PD was flying a trump 2020 flag at their police HQ on the flagpole.
CIVIL WAR! CIVIL WAR! Put the right wings pigs in fucking gulags!!!
Thinking of the Bourgeoisie and it's apparatuses as monolithic is fallacious. There is a bigger schism in the bourgeoisie now than there has been since the first civil war. The FBI is seen as a bunch of deep state liberals by chuds and they're kind of right. The FBI is whole hog in for finance capital and the cosmopolitan bourgeoisie while local PDs are loyal to small capital and by extension (through political alignment) heavy industry and extractive capital. If there is a conflict surrounding the election, it will be a conflict between these Bourgeois factions and their hired guns.
You overestimate the fealty of the FBI to the cosmopolitan bourgeoise.
Didn't Mueller announce the reopening of the investigation into Hilary Clinton the night before the election because his own guys in NY were going to leak a bunch of shit if he didn't?
are you confusing the political class for the bourgeoisie?
It's known that the NY Office was all a bunch of Guliani fanboys that eventually turned into Trump fanboys. That's not exactly how it is around the rest of the country though.
The animosity between cops and the FBI is deeper and older than Trump, though
There is no animosity. FBI are mostly ex-local cops, and FBI is america’s political police (a real version of what americans think the KGB was like).
They will happily watch cops murder leftists on the streets.
Leftists aren't going to be a factor in this at all. It's going to be the reactionary National Bourgeoisie vs the liberal Cosmopolitan Bourgeoisie. The former has influence in police, some federal agencies and with private right wing militias, while the latter has more money and arguably the military leadership, intelligence community and certain federal agencies.
Accurate.
I think nationalism is their ideological tool in the recent past but they're really best characterized by their physical holdings/land: agriculture, energy, manufacturing, etc.. and they have plenty of support in the military - enough that it will definitely split when this conflict boils over.
Well yeah but National Bourgeoisie is a common term for these people
I think you're underestimating how hard they get when they get to exert dominance, though. They're institutionally on top and guard that very jealously, even if that means stomping on their own allies to do it. Police departments attempting coups are a direct affront to the feds' authority, and they'd almost certainly come down on it hard to preserve their own status and power. Hell, they'd probably do it if it was other feds trying to do a coup too, if for no other reason than eliminating their own personal competition, since surely cracking down on "those traitors in [whatever branch]" would be a notable accomplishment when they're trying to suck up to their boss while golfing at the country club.
They’re mostly trump supporters. The FBI sees the left as the traitors, not overly zealous trump supporters/cops.
As I said, you're underestimating their elitism. They're not gonna sit idly by and watch some dumbass cops rise up against their state, nor would they tolerate open rebellion in their own ranks. Like if J. Chudly from the Pedo-Honeypot task force joined an armed rebellion, G. Ammon in Major Crimes isn't thinking "well gee he makes a good point" he's thinking "if I clap him in handcuffs maybe I can get his office and take his spot golfing with Director Ghoulhart."
They're vile, criminal ghouls, but they're interested in preserving the status quo and the institutions of the state because that's where their power comes from. Open, armed rebellion is a direct threat to their power and their cushy lives. That's kind of the key division in the American right that's been there forever: there's the established bourgeoisie-aristocrats and their lackeys that fill the highest echelon's of the state's violent enforcement branches, and there's the resentful fascist petit bourgeoisie who lack the social connections to really be on top and their cronies who fill out local police departments (this is how America existed as a fascist apartheid state and the number one global sponsor of fascism over most of the 20th century while also having a lively, violent fascist resistance against them domestically). They both have vested interests against the left, but they also have their own power struggles to consider: the upper class fascists want to preserve their power and gain more, which requires preserving the system they already control; the vulgar fascists want to seize a bigger share of the pie for themselves and feel that the established system is their enemy because it doesn't provide that to them.
That's why the feds routinely step in to fuck with local pigs and fascist militias when they step too far out of line: they accurately see the role of the police and of fascist paramilitary groups as beings weapons of terror against the working class and left, but when they threaten the rich or the state itself they'll step in and make an example of them to try to keep the others in line.
There were NY FBI agents leaking stuff about Hillary Clinton to hell trump win before the 2016 election. The FBI has plenty of the vulgar fascists in it. And trump has installed more of them in the leadership roles at the top of agencies such as DHS etc. it’s not as clear but as you think it is any more. All the local cops have to do is make some BS up about voter fraud after the election and start arresting Democrat politicians who they don’t like. And the FBI would mostly go along with it i think.
They're absolutely on the same side and will band together when needed, but there's a history of them stepping on each other's toes and fucking up each others' work
Only over minor stuff. They’ll unite against leftists for sure.
Idk why you think leftists are going to matter in violence surrounding the election
Because that’s who the right wing likes to attack.
So let me get this straight. In the event of a constitutional crisis where different Bourgeois factions are vying for power, one represented by extractive capital, heavy industry and small capital and the other represented by international finance capital, tech and the service sector, you think all enforcement branches of the state will unite....to attack people with zero power. I honestly don't see how it would make sense for people in the midst of a power struggle would be uniting to go after people without power.
Because one side thinks the left works for the other side.
No offense man but it kinda sounds like you have a very surface level analysis of the situation and make a lot of assumptions purely because they're the worst outcome and not because they're based in reality
I’d also like to add a piece of evidence from reality: the FBI is not investigating the US marshals/prison guards/local cops/sheriffs who gunned down Michael Reinhoel in an obvious extrajudicial assassination. They’re just ignoring it, like they will ignore much much much more violence by the nationalist bourgeoisie faction as they attack their perceived enemies, likely including attacks on some democrats or local election results they don’t like, etc.
Anti-fascists, BLM people, and leftists have already been getting murdered by trump supporters.