I gave you examples and all you said was you didn't give a shit since I said wikipedia.
You're not one to talk about arguing in good faith. I've been pretty civil with you given some of your stupid replies to my other comments in this thread.
Again, if you want to tell me that what I've read is wrong then feel free to explain it to me. And not from very outdated books from the 30s or the CIA document from the 50s, neither of which say that I'm wrong btw.
I did in a different comment jn this thread. This person told me to read alternate sources such as Blackshirts and Reds. I did. It just backed up what I was reading on Wikipedia.
They don't think that Blackshirts and Reds was backing up what you read in Wikipedia when you (allegedly) would have been reading quotes like the following, and didn't even comment on them. You didn't even have to actually read the book to see these, they're right here on WikiQuote.
During the Cold War, the anti-communist ideological framework could transform any data about existing communist societies into hostile evidence. If the Soviets refused to negotiate a point, they were intransigent and belligerent; if they appeared willing to make concessions, this was but a skillful ploy to put us off our guard. By opposing arms limitations, they would have demonstrated their aggressive intent; but when in fact they supported most armament treaties, it was because they were mendacious and manipulative. If the churches in the USSR were empty, this demonstrated that religion was suppressed; but if the churches were full, this meant the people were rejecting the regime’s atheistic ideology. If the workers went on strike (as happened on infrequent occasions), this was evidence of their alienation from the collectivist system; if they didn’t go on strike, this was because they were intimidated and lacked freedom. A scarcity of consumer goods demonstrated the failure of the economic system; an improvement in consumer supplies meant only that the leaders were attempting to placate a restive population and so maintain a firmer hold over them. If communists in the United States played an important role struggling for the rights of workers, the poor, African-Americans, women, and others, this was only their guileful way of gathering support among disfranchised groups and gaining power for themselves. How one gained power by fighting for the rights of powerless groups was never explained. What we are dealing with is a nonfalsifiable orthodoxy, so assiduously marketed by the ruling interests that it affected people across the entire political spectrum.
During the years of Stalin's reign, the Soviet nation made dramatic gains in literacy, industrial wages, health care, and women's rights. These accomplishments usually go unmentioned when the Stalinist era is discussed. To say that "socialism didn't work" is to ignore that it did. In Eastern Europe, Russia, China, Mongolia, North Korea, and Cuba, revolutionary communism created a life for the mass of people that was far better than the wretched existence they had endured under feudal lords, military bosses, foreign colonizers, and Western capitalists. The end result was a dramatic improvement in the living conditions for hundreds of millions of people on a scale never before or since witnessed in history.
If anything, the breakup of the communist states has brought a colossal victory for global capitalism and imperialism, with its correlative increase in human misery, and a historic setback for revolutionary liberation struggles everywhere. There will be harder times ahead for even modestly reformist national governments, as the fate of Panama and Iraq have indicated. The breakup also means a net loss of global pluralism and more intensive socio-economic inequality throughout the world.
Now, I'll freely admit I haven't read it, but since you say you have, and the full text is right here for all of us to see whether you're being honest about it, would you be so kind as to point out a specific quote that supports your claims?
I gave you examples and all you said was you didn't give a shit since I said wikipedia.
"Hey I think this"
Okay, on what basis?
"Wikipedia"
Okay, then I don't really care
"Wow I gave you so many examples"
You're not one to talk about arguing in good faith. I've been pretty civil with you given some of your stupid replies to my other comments in this thread.
Oh no muh civility! Yeah dude civility is exclusively tied to the words you use and not your behaviour or actions.
Again, if you want to tell me that what I've read is wrong then feel free to explain it to me.
Okay, wikipedia is a site run by nazis and frequently misrepresents information.
And not from very outdated books from the 30s or the CIA document from the 50s, neither of which say that I'm wrong btw.
So you don't want first hand sources, but rather editorialized online articles edited by nazis? Neat.
Kinda convenient that you then still ignore this brief breakdown that is now being shared with you for the fourth time.
I gave you examples and all you said was you didn't give a shit since I said wikipedia.
You're not one to talk about arguing in good faith. I've been pretty civil with you given some of your stupid replies to my other comments in this thread.
Again, if you want to tell me that what I've read is wrong then feel free to explain it to me. And not from very outdated books from the 30s or the CIA document from the 50s, neither of which say that I'm wrong btw.
Not a reliable source that is why. You could at least link to some of the sources cited on the wiki
I did in a different comment jn this thread. This person told me to read alternate sources such as Blackshirts and Reds. I did. It just backed up what I was reading on Wikipedia.
this is complete bullshit
What is?
They don't think that Blackshirts and Reds was backing up what you read in Wikipedia when you (allegedly) would have been reading quotes like the following, and didn't even comment on them. You didn't even have to actually read the book to see these, they're right here on WikiQuote.
Now, I'll freely admit I haven't read it, but since you say you have, and the full text is right here for all of us to see whether you're being honest about it, would you be so kind as to point out a specific quote that supports your claims?
They say chapter five uses "the same numbers" as the ones they've quoted, which is funny since they haven't quoted any numbers.
"Hey I think this"
Okay, on what basis?
"Wikipedia"
Okay, then I don't really care
"Wow I gave you so many examples"
Oh no muh civility! Yeah dude civility is exclusively tied to the words you use and not your behaviour or actions.
Okay, wikipedia is a site run by nazis and frequently misrepresents information.
So you don't want first hand sources, but rather editorialized online articles edited by nazis? Neat.
Kinda convenient that you then still ignore this brief breakdown that is now being shared with you for the fourth time.