B&R is Bread and Roses, a Marxist caucus in DSA. R&R is Reform and Revolution, another Marxist Caucus in DSA. B&R is the one of the largest and well organized caucuses, with 15 percent of the delegates at the last YDSA convention. No clue about what neo-kautskyite failures they are talking about. R&R and B&R have a lot of member (or at least supporter) overlap, and both really like Rosa Luxemburg.
B&R is a broadly DemSoc (with Marxist leanings) caucus if I recall, who still hold out that an electorial path is possible. Their Allende-like approach is probably what is being called Kautskyite here.
It directly identifies as a caucus of strictly Marxist organizers. They also iirc don't hold out that an electoral path is possible, but that a simultaneous investment in elections combined with militant radical rank and file labor organizing is necessary. I know there are revolutionary socialists on their national leadership. Yeah looking at their docs, they outright say winning elections is not taking power, merely a necessary step along the way to power. They're coy with it, but they clearly endorse a mass militant labor movement as a final protective step but yeah that endorsement of elections in a pretty direct way is what they're most likely calling Kautskyite.
That makes sense. It is still kind of silly that the DSA has like 6 different Marxist Caucuses. Like why is R&R and B&R even separate if they are both revolutionary?
I'm aware, I've read kautsky (including lars lih work on Lenin and kautsky). I read the call. I just disagree on calling those things neo-kautskyite. I'd also say I disagree with the characterization of B&R trying to control what the revolution is, rather I see it as setting up as many favorable conditions as possible than an endorsement to one view of it.
I should also say here while I'm not a member of B&R, I have attended their trainings, and am friends with multiple members that have written for the call.
Yes, they constantly are trying to get members into jobs to form radical unions, or into positions to take over and radicalized existing ones. Read anything they publish about those efforts. Oh you're talking about r and r, no clue. I mainly follow b and r.
R&R name is definitely a play on Rosa's text, playing up that both have to occur though.
B&R is Bread and Roses, a Marxist caucus in DSA. R&R is Reform and Revolution, another Marxist Caucus in DSA. B&R is the one of the largest and well organized caucuses, with 15 percent of the delegates at the last YDSA convention. No clue about what neo-kautskyite failures they are talking about. R&R and B&R have a lot of member (or at least supporter) overlap, and both really like Rosa Luxemburg.
B&R is a broadly DemSoc (with Marxist leanings) caucus if I recall, who still hold out that an electorial path is possible. Their Allende-like approach is probably what is being called Kautskyite here.
R&R is more explicitly revolutionary.
It directly identifies as a caucus of strictly Marxist organizers. They also iirc don't hold out that an electoral path is possible, but that a simultaneous investment in elections combined with militant radical rank and file labor organizing is necessary. I know there are revolutionary socialists on their national leadership. Yeah looking at their docs, they outright say winning elections is not taking power, merely a necessary step along the way to power. They're coy with it, but they clearly endorse a mass militant labor movement as a final protective step but yeah that endorsement of elections in a pretty direct way is what they're most likely calling Kautskyite.
That makes sense. It is still kind of silly that the DSA has like 6 different Marxist Caucuses. Like why is R&R and B&R even separate if they are both revolutionary?
They're leftists
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Wow there's no lobster emotes, or leftist infighting emotes, this will not stand.
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I'm aware, I've read kautsky (including lars lih work on Lenin and kautsky). I read the call. I just disagree on calling those things neo-kautskyite. I'd also say I disagree with the characterization of B&R trying to control what the revolution is, rather I see it as setting up as many favorable conditions as possible than an endorsement to one view of it.
I should also say here while I'm not a member of B&R, I have attended their trainings, and am friends with multiple members that have written for the call.
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Yes, they constantly are trying to get members into jobs to form radical unions, or into positions to take over and radicalized existing ones. Read anything they publish about those efforts. Oh you're talking about r and r, no clue. I mainly follow b and r.
R&R name is definitely a play on Rosa's text, playing up that both have to occur though.
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