Big strong predator that sucks at hunting so much that they need to lure the deer to stand directly in front of their gun.
At that point you're not even a hunter, you're a slob that might as well be ordering from a menu. Pathetic.
I live in Texas, land of the manly fella.
Lots of ‘canned hunts’ - animals fenced in behind ‘game fence’ with nowhere to go, really. Most hunts here you go to a deer lease, which is a big land area with lots of game, stay in someones ranch home, have someone wake you up, feed you, drive you to a deer blind with corn feeders, and let you go. They come back, pick you up later, and process (butcher) anything you may have shot. Typically you leave afterwards with Bambi wrapped up in 1lb chubbs, some backstrap tenderloin steaks, and whatever else is left of the poor trapped animal that you didnt blow to smithereens with your overpowered deer rifle.
None of what most rednecks refer to ‘hunting’ is an actual hunt. Its baiting and waiting.
This was literally an episode of King of the Hill. Even Bobby saw that it was total bullshit.
Bobby often calls things out that are bullshit. Hank may say "that boy ain't right" but in reality, he is right a lot of the time.
Lots of ‘canned hunts’ - animals fenced in behind ‘game fence’ with nowhere to go, really.
This is the toxic masculinity version of shooting fish in a barrel isn't it?
Except most people don't really put fish in a barrel then shoot them.
Im not sure what video i was watching. But I found it interesting that basically in Texas there is no 'public' shooting infrastructure. everything is private, so to shoot you need to have land or know someone with land and pay. Is this true in your experience?
Thats correct. Either private shooting range, or private land.
one of the funniest short exchanges in True Detective S1, where Rust just casually wipes his ass on Marty's affected and insecure masculinity, while they are tracking Dewall/Reggie into the low country. it's too crass to bring up in polite conversation, but it kills me to even be reminded of it.
"You ever been huntin', Marty?"
"Uh, yeah. Ten-point buck, year before last. Fifty yards."
"I'm not talkin about sittin' in a tree house, waitin' to ambush a buck come to sniff your gash bait. I'm talkin about trackin'."
"Jesus, you're a prick."the greater context is that Rustin's crazy survivalist/vietnam-vet father taught him bow-hunting in the Alaskan wilderness as a youth and Marty is the exact kind of weekend warrior bozo that trophy hunts in the easiest way possible, so now Rust can see the path taken by the killer and disable booby traps, while Marty is useless and needs to follow behind.
Tracking is incredibly satisfying. I'm no good at it, but wandering around looking at foot prints and putting on a serious face and saying "the tracks have soft edges so they might be old, but there was a freeze and a thaw in the last 24 hours that may have distorted them. At any rate, they pressed over these prints of our own boots from when we came to the park last week to pretend to be cool game stalkers, so that gives us a window"
That is one of my favorite shows ever! But only that season, the rest sucked IMO. Oh but the new one with Jodi Foster is good too. I just finished watching it last week.
You're not a real fisher if you use bait. Coax the fish to bite the bare hook.
You know what? No. Not good enough. Forget the hook. Get in there with your hands.
And this noodle that you refer to... It was your arm...?
Yep. Find a shady spot you know big catfish frequent, logs, brambles, submerged structures, which coincidentally are places alligator snapping turtles like to frequent, and stuck your arm in there. Kinda wave and waggle your fingers, and if something is there itll go for the lure (your hand). Grab its mouth, hold the fuck on, and go for broke.
Its even more fun when you're three sheets to the wind on Lone Star and Pabst beer.
What’s the process in figuring out if the hole has a fish or a turtle in it?
There is none because anything other than just shoving a hand down there is likely to scare off a potential catch. Luck of the draw i guess. Its probably why i was always a bit buzzed doing it- it takes a bit of liquid courage to get you to do this shit.
The dude who took me noodling my first time was missing part of his right ring finger, and pinkie finger after having them bitten off by a snapping turtle some years prior. Crazy fuck would go under water and seek out hollows and spots where they might be, and noodle them while submerged.
Chain mail gauntlets would be a noodle game changer.
Alternatively: “ I’m Johnny Knoxville and this is penis noodling”
Few things beat drinking in nature though, especially near water. I bet it’s a good time despite the danger.
They sell those for butchers. You cna get them real cheap off alibaba. I got a pair for giving cats a bath
It was a whole ton of fun, really. Bunch of half lit dumbasses trying to get catfish to swallow your hand so you can yank them out of the water and show them what everything looks like above the water line. was always fun rounding everyone up, buying a couple cases of Pabst or whatever was cheap, and heading out to just cut loose and accomplish nothing of consequence.
Havent done it in almost two decades, but id do it again if given a chance.
Pshh, you use an atlatl? Fucking scrub, just wish death upon the prey until the gods oblige
Catching fish with your hands isn't easy, but if you know how and you've got pre-industrial devastation fish stocks it's doable. Fishing spear or gig is easier though.
makes perfect sense if you're subsistence hunting. which most American hunters are no longer doing.
man i love this stuff. i can polish off a whole bag in 10 minutes if no one stops me.
using a gun is already cheating. you're not a real hunter unless you wrestle and strangle the deer with your bare hands
You're allowed a spear, but it has to be a spear you made yourself. Deer have had four hundred thousand years to invent spears, they're just being lazy asses growing them out of their heads instead.
Just wait until the deer start innovating and build their own Browning machine guns
It's just a matter of time. Co-evolving defenses against predation and all that.
What's your take on whaling with a knife while singing a 58 verse long song about how much you like killing ala the pilot whale hunters on the Faroe islands?
(I'm very opposed in case anyone is wondering)
yeah I was being somewhat facetious but it's truly funny to me how hunters pride themselves on being able to kill an animal while using an advanced piece of technology invented by somebody else hundreds of years ago that they just... bought at a store. like come on
With modern guns and optics you have to put in effort to not hit the target.
There are literally guns that have an auto-aim system called TrackingPoint (least creative name ever) and will help you line up your shot and tell you when to pull the trigger. It literally will not let you miss. At that point, what's the point?
One that costs hundreds if not thousands of dollars to buy, complete with a Name Brand (tm) computer designed and printed camouflage over everything and a matching Brand sticker for their emotional support truck
At least hunters in the past used whatever cheap surplus they had or even just a bow
I'm willing to make an exception for a flint-knapped biface tool (as long as you make it yourself, obviously)
You've gotta chase that deer for 10 miles until it drops dead of a heart attack or run it off of a cliff!
I don't think there is anything wrong with it. You are looking at hunting as a sport. I am looking at hunting as a means of obtaining food. I used to go hunting for rabbit and pheasant mostly, for food. It's way more humane than modern livestock for chicken, pork, cows, etc, and for deer, it keeps the population to a manageable level since most of the natural predators were unfortunately wiped out.
I think this is interesting. What is the specific thing that makes hunting inhumane? Some might say it's about the act of killing, but really it's about the act of suffering and dying that matters.
And then you have to compare that suffering and death to whatever the alternative is. The obvious answer is less suffering and death. But nobody is reducing that, or really planning on reducing that.
The nature of a wild animal is that they don't write wills and crawl into hospital beds and take morphine and kiss their grandchildren goodbye. Every time a deer dies, it's going out a few different ways or a combination of a few different ways. Those ways are all the worst things that can possibly happen to a sapient being.
Usually they'll break a leg, drag themselves around in constant pain for months, and then slowly wither away in the pure agony of starvation.
Or if there are wolves, coyotes, wild dogs etc, those animals will do heinous torture to the deer that barely any human has ever done to an animal, so badly that doing so would put you in the company of our most infamous sadists. It's slow and agonizing and outrageously disgusting. They ram their heads up the deer's ass to tear organs out as the deer watches, for hours.
The other main option for a deer is to be shot in the heart, sprint 100 yards and keel over. When hunters fuck up or take an unethical shot, they begin to approach the standard wild animal death but are very unlikely to get close.
So if you accept that it's not about the human, and it's really about the animal, nothing about the process of hunting is actually adding any suffering to what a wild animal experiences.
Your pet dog basically does get morphine and head pats and euthanasia, so none of that applies there. If deer were getting morphine and euthanasia in old age, it's pretty bad to shoot them. But if you have no intention of reducing animal suffering, I don't think the deer could, should, or even would give a shit about how "natural" a person thinks it is to be starving and devoured by wild dogs
Am I being trolled, is this some weird carnist realism bit? Eat vegetables. Some tofu maybe. Use your intelligence to realize you don’t have to kill sentient life to eat. Your point isn’t great anyway, each bullet to the heart robs the deer of years of life.
It doesn't really. Killing these large animals is an essential function of a natural or even a partially artificial ecosystem. They can't have their full lives. If wolves fail to torture them to death, and humans fail to shoot them, they literally kill most of the rest of the plants and animals in their environment. If humans became allergic to meat next year and only ate vegetables, we would keep shooting deer and use the meat as feed or fertilizer.
Long life is not on the table and never has been. One of the biggest failures of western forest management has actually been to let the deer live too long. So the difference really is the manner of death.
And that's just talking about deer and not the 30-50 wild hogs running through my back yard
That's why we need the BabyKiller Mark 7 fully automatic grenade launcher like our forefathers intended
source? Sounds more like game warden / hobby-hunter bullshit than ecology. Also, we don’t need to shoot deer for fertilizer if we stopped eating meet. If plants or ecosystems are imbalanced, it should be the work of ecologist not hunters
The ecologist would generally prefer to introduce wolves or, if they weren't allowed to, they would shoot the deer. In fact those are the 2 main things they are doing and encouraging in various out of wack, deer overpopulated ecosystems.
Funny, are you an ecologist? First article I found in google scholar concluded hunters should be reduced.
They should be reduced in various areas or replaced in all areas by natural predators. I assure you there are areas with not enough hunting because a) the bears and wolves were exterminated 100 years ago, b) livestock farmers lobby the local and state governments against introducing those predators and c) hunters either don't hunt enough or only try to trophy hunt
I think the people who think hunting is the only options should be reduced in various areas
The abstract:
Due to chronic high densities and preferential browsing, white-tailed deer have significant impacts on woody and herbaceous plants. These impacts have ramifications for animals that share resources and across trophic levels. High deer densities result from an absence of predators or high plant productivity, often due to human habitat modifications, and from the desires of stakeholders that set deer management goals based on cultural, rather than biological, carrying capacity. Success at maintaining forest ecosystems require regulating deer below biological carrying capacity, as measured by ecological impacts. Control methods limit reproduction through modifications in habitat productivity or increase mortality through increasing predators or hunting. Hunting is the primary deer management tool and relies on active participation of citizens. Hunters are capable of reducing deer densities but struggle with creating densities sufficiently low to ensure the persistence of rare species. Alternative management models may be necessary to achieve densities sufficiently below biological carrying capacity. Regardless of the population control adopted, success should be measured by ecological benchmarks and not solely by cultural acceptance.
As this ecologist notes, hunters are essential parts of maintaining healthy, biodiverse ecosystems.
Funny, are you an ecologist? First article I found in google scholar concluded hunters should be reduced.
"hunting is the primary population management tool" and "hunting should be reduced" are not mutually exclusive statements. You're not clever for demanding people have a degree in ecology to give you information.
Love that this person demands everyone else have a phd to argue with them about a subject they clearly understand less than a middle schooler
Yep, all killing is inhumane...
The
leastworst one can do is make it seem less so....“humane” is often a buzzword to clean up genocide. See also: humanitarian, humanitarian aid, etc
Oh...
Never really thought of that, though humane has different, often-slaughter house connotations from 'humanitarian' (unless I am to presume the latter has similar roots to words like vegetarian...)
I mean, I can see where you're coming from, considering the mention of 'humanitarian' to refer to aid to Ukraine, according to Mainstream Media, must consist also of missiles, bombs and drones...
Even going further back the nazis convinced themselves gassing people was a “humane” way to exterminate them. And there’s a big connection between animal agriculture and the nazis.
This is one of the logical conclusions of turning hunting into a lifestyle. Eventually some people will realize that the waiting and stalking isn't really different than baiting in outcome, but it makes things quicker.
This kind of thing is actually less contradictory and is in many ways more honest than Honorable Hunter Culture (TM) even though it's still gross (im vegan). Food is actually plentiful for these people due to industrialization and imperialism so hunting is just a form of entertainment for them. It's not for subsistence and it's not part of any culture that deserves respect. They just like to shoot and kill things and go through the process of butchering an animal and justifying having a chest freezer so they can eat meat they actually prefer to eat less than the stuff they can buy at the supermarket. 90% of what they claim to like about hunting is just camping, too. It also integrates with military/veteran culture in buying a bunch of camo shit and practicing surviving in "the wild" or "off grid" for a short period, something much easier to accomplish with a single $20 bag of beans, $10 of water, and $20 of fuel.
It's all aesthetics, it's a hobby, it's a LARP for subscribers to toxic masculinity.
there are probably still a few supplemental hunters who have an heirloom gun and live in a food desert but they aren't gonna be baiting with commercial shit like this.
Usually crackers and it's still cheaper to buy industrial agricultural foods unless you live in an incredibly remote place.
yeah the kind of appalacian poor i'm thinking of that we used to send highschool kids out to do structural home repairs for charity already have guns and might eat for months on a box of ammo. maybe wholesale can compete with the calories in an adult deer but when we're talking $2 or less for a bullet or shell it probably comes down to aim.
What, butcher paper and freezer electricity?
The poor who subsist on game and garden butcher their own animals. My stepfather's elk tag fed my family of 11 for six months of the year, and gave him his one personal break per year. Plus, we weren't eating meat drenched in chlorine or fed on trash. He never used shit like in the OP's pic, though.
To your point, he hunted on horseback so feed for the horse probably evened out the savings over time. I'm not saying you're entirely wrong, just that the argument around hunting is more nuanced than most of the conversation in the replies.
Transportation, skin, hang, age, butcher, freeze (including buying the freezer), dispose of or process the parts you're not eating. It's all part of a curated lifestyle, not a poverty decision.
I'm not sure what nuance you're referring to this is an actually simple topic.
Exactly how much do you think meat costs? Last time I looked just basic low-grade beef was nearly $10 a pound, and even historically cheap shit like ground turkey was $6 a pound. Because of that I switched to eating tofu ($2 a pound) and still have to ration that to a few ounces a day. If someone has a gun and can hunt, that's the cheapest source of meat they can possibly have. Hence venison being relatively common for the rural poor, whether it's their family procuring it or someone else in their community, while it's completely absent from everyone else's diet.
Guns and ammo costs hundreds of dollars and you still have to process the animal afterwards, requiring that you either pay someone to do all of that for you or you need to have dedicated semi-sterile space to hang a deer carcass for several days, a space and tools to butcher, and a big chest freezer. You also have to transport the animal, requiring some form of rigging. Most people use it as an excuse to overpay on a truck. The meme of tying an animal to the top of a car is exceptionally rare. They pay someone to move it or they buy the expensive vehicle.
There are also people that field-butcher. They are rare and they invest in a series of several hundred dollar equipment purchases to make this feasible, namely knives and specialized packs and a means by which to clean themselves.
It is almost never a way for the rural poor to save money, it is a lifestyle choice.
Pickups used to be small, cheap, and things that were actually used for a practical purpose. Like that's constantly brought up here as a point of how much modern light trucks are awful in every way compared to older, actually useful models or light trucks from other countries.
You've also got to remember that everything you're talking about is just productive capital, and very cheap productive capital at that, some of which can also be made from repurposed materials or is necessary anyways (like "a means to preserve food" is the most basic sort of "you absolutely need to have this" thing ever). Hundreds or even thousands of dollars worth of capital that remains in use for decades breaks down to a very low cost if enables a higher standard of living equivalent to spending hundreds or thousands of dollars a year extra on food, which is what regularly eating meat costs.
Pickups being cheap was over 20-30 years ago and even then unless you were getting a tiny Japanese one you were dropping $5-10k more than for a sedan.
Getting a big freezer to store ya entertainment meat is not a need-to-have food preservation system, it's a luxury that depends on fairly consistent electricity. Dry goods are what you need if you want security. To tie it together, this would apply to people that make jerky and smoked foods, i.e. what indigenous people did and still often do with meat. But very, very few people are in it for that, they're in it for the lifestyle their grandpappy taught them and so they can feel tough and cool and for some of them, just go camping without anyone calling them gay. It's inherited from a colonizer perspective on the "Wild West" that is even itself fairly synthetic and surprisingly recent and, of course, is self-applied by (nearly always white) people in Eastern New York same as someone in Montana same as someone in West Virginia.
If I lived in a place with abundant high quality protein walking around pinyata style I'd be tempted. I been broke enough to do worse before.
You have to drop hundreds on the gun and ammo first and then either pay someone to process the carcass or learn how to do it yourself. You also need to cart the thing out, usually meaning you have to buy a truck that costs tens of thousands or pay someone to do that as well.
Makes me recall a native friend of mines father telling us how him and his brothers were getting skunked hunting and as a last resort they decided to 'hunt like white boys'. Sit in their truck with rifles waiting for an animal to walk by.
i thought baiting deer was illegal? or in that case can this be sold because it's not specified to be used for hunting?
That's why it looks like dirt.
It's not illegal everywhere but this is meant to be something you can use discreetly.
It is in TN and they are pretty serious about it if you get caught. You are more likely to get your gun taken by a game warden than a cop. This country makes no sense
Looks like it's illegal in some states. Never knew this because I've seen people set up web cameras to watch the deer they feed, unless that's a different type of feed not used for hunting.
i shuold have known. those plasma people can do everything we vapors and gasses can't
So you're going to give the venison to hungry people, right?
Right?I’m just a deer bait dirtbag, baby,
I’m just a deer bait dirtbag baby,
eat me as dry molasses, maybe,
She doesn’t know what she’s missing
Hunting is the only time these people actually sit in nature.
Just be glad they aren't hunting literal zoo animals.
I didn't even realise this was for killing deer I just upvoted because DIRT BAG is funny and this site has broken my brain
It's about sitting in a tree for several hours getting drunk and shooting something that's less than 10 feet away.
