Holy shit. For reference, the CEO of Bechtel had precisely the same take before the invasion of Iraq. He literally said if you are against the war you're doing Saddam's work for him. Nice company you got there, Ilhan. Pathetic how the squad has just melted into mainstream democrats. Fuck em all, they're useless.
E: :reddit-logo: considers her one of the "radicals" that need to be reeled in after that "horrific" letter calling on Biden to start negotiations.
this is just how far the public scope has moved since then, pretty horrific
Funds Ukraine War:dean-malice:
Gets called out by anti war protestor:dean-neutral:
Claims they aren't anti-war for calling out the fact that she's funding a war:dean-smile:
The Squad is a joke. Without fail everyone of these libs will let you down because they're libs.
remembering that shooped group pic of The Squad where every face was Nancy Pelosi's
Op left out the follow up tweet she posted
I am amazed at the nerve that some people have to not be upset with the country literally waging war, but at the country defending itself and those helping them do that. I was even told by one of these people tonight, “it’s America that started the Russia war”, seriously wtf.
I love being lead in geopolitics by people whose understanding of it is based on inane idealism. Joe fucking Biden himself in the 90's commented that the only way Russia would be spurred into war is by NATO expansionism, we kept expanding NATO all around them, funded a govt insurrection to put right wing nutters in power in a country bordering them, and said country began shelling sovereign territory, so uhhh...
I ain't a fan of Russia, but I ain't a fan of revisionist horseshit either
YES WE STARTED THE WAR YOU FUCK. OSCE OBSERVERS DOCUMENTED IT, THE UKRONAZIS STARTED THE SHELLING ON FEBRUARY 16. Every single lib whose analysis doesn't include this basic easily verifiable fact is a fascist sympathizing denialist
Yes, my favorite resource on the conflict so far (so much so that I typed the url from memory without looking it up) was published in April by a Swiss Colonel and former NATO advisor who actually worked with the Ukrainian army in 2014. He provides important background on the progress of the civil war in the Donbass, the composition of the Ukrainian armed forces, the OSCE observations I alluded to, and more.
***Unfortunately it also contains disinformation about the Holodomor, but that isn't germane to the current situation.
He was interviewed by Aaron Mate on Pushback, which incenses me whenever I see Aaron ignoring this fact as well.
https://www.thepostil.com/the-military-situation-in-the-ukraine
Edit: I think it's important because the entire framing of this conflict in the western imaginarium has been that Putin is the aggressor. It hasn't been true at any step of the way. But to admit that the Ukrainians started the shooting in February would be to ask why all their forces were sitting on the contact line in the Donbass rather than in defensive positions along the Russian border. Why were they mounting an offensive? That would then ask us to explore the deeper roots of this conflict, like why the LDNR are trying to separate from the Kiev regime. Why are miners and factory workers organizing into militias and asking the big bad Russian army for assistance? Can it be that they didn't feel they were dignified by the "revolution of dignity" back in 2014? But if that revolution wasn't representative of all the Ukrainian people then who DID it represent?
I remember watching the intensifying attacks on the Donbas, in what seemed like an effort to provoke a Russian response. I thought that maybe there was an accusation of an attack on Russian territory.
https://www.osce.org/special-monitoring-mission-to-ukraine/512872
here you can see the data ,t the raw data
https://www.osce.org/ukraine-smm/reports?page=2
Follow up observation: I don't think it actually matters who shot first. Let me know if I'm way off base here, but Putin is bad for using right wing culture war and violence to redirect class resentment away from the rich (like a western politician), not because he intervened in a humanitarian crisis happening on the Russian border and disrupted NATO's ability to limit the autonomy of the people Russia.
I think that's what I was getting at. Putin is bad because he's a capitalist and boes capitalist things. That's essentially my definition of a "bad guy". However, regardless of his motivation, the intervention in Ukraine is probably for the best.
please consult this https://www.osce.org/ukraine-smm/reports?page=2
Well Russia is refusing to budge for Turkey when it comes to Armenia, so no wonder she is pissed
What a disgusting Nazi sympathizer. I'm so done with democrats. Literally supporting nazis in words and deeds.
"I spent years fighting against the propaganda done against me because we were fighting a war in the Middle East. Well good thing we stopped doing propaganda and this is totally a wholesome chungus heckin underfloofer war"
I'm glad we kept the receipt for that Gundam we were gonna give her
We did keep the receipt right?
This hand of mine is burning red! The spectre of Communism begs me to defeat you!
DIALECTIC FINGER!!!!
Damn, she was the only person in Congress I was okay with. We’re back to zero again.
people seems to forget that Ilhan Omar has some sus takes in regards to middle east politics in the past but people just brush it off because the squad is the BeSt wE hAvE.
They are million dollars wage politicians who people voted them in. Be a Karen about it for once
It's not at all surprising that the same liberal smugness is there every time someone defends imperialism
this sucks but the protestors are also larouchites so I say let them fight
Who cares they are never gonna hold power anyway and there are like max 1k of them all over america. But when the dozens of thousands of american "socialists" ,anarchists and communists fail to make their shitty socdems even a bit uncomfortable for their imperialism then as a non american i'll take the larouchites doing so as a net positive. Being toothless, worthless and non existant in your anti war action,rhetoric and pressure towards any politician at this historical momment makes most american leftists orders of magnitude more useless and damaging than this incoherent patsoc in the vid .
Being toothless, worthless and non existant in your anti war action,rhetoric and pressure towards any politician at this historical momment makes most american leftists orders of magnitude more useless and damaging than this incoherent patsoc in the vid .
It's really odd how people have a base understanding of the fact that Americans should not speak on other country's politics without knowledge of the situation on the ground yet non Americans have a free reign to speak on America like this.
There ARE left parties protesting the war. There ARE left parties protesting outside of government buildings, outside of politician's homes, etc. I know this because I've been a part of these protests. You don't see it because there's a media blackout on this shit, and it only gets attention when some easily discredited assholes like these people are the ones doing the protesting.
Then criticize the efficacy of our tactics, we take that into account and do our own self crit constantly. But to say we are not doing anything, or to say we are actively more harmful than some Tulsi stan jag offs who are doing nothing of actual impact, is fucking insulting to some of my comrades who have sacrificed a lot more than these people in the name of the anti war movement.
hey I'm fine with them making socdems uncomfortable but when they are absolute clowns it's an easy dunk and even if they weren't this isn't meaningfully pressuring her so I'm content to just laugh at how stupid the whole situation is.
Lyndon LaRouche was far right. He was far right even by far right standards.
The "Anti-war position" is not "taken up" by nazbols rather than the left unless you view socdem politicians as the left. Many socialist orgs have had generally good anti-war takes on the situation in Ukraine, including even DSA.
Now obviously the question that follows are what are any of them actually doing about it and the answer is nothing particularly effective that I am aware of, and while I don't think they are any less effective than these larouchites, I also don't really know what ought they be doing. Feels like all there is to do is make the anti-imperialist case and then do regular socialist organizing so that next time hopefully the left will be strong enough to do something about it.
I mean that's not for a lack of trying. There have been socialist organized anti-war protests about Ukraine, I've even attended one, I know people who organized protests outside of some congressional reps offices. Many of these things get like a turnout of a few dozen activists. If you think you have a way for such protests to be more successful, I'm all ears.
You're right, it's not like it was in 2003. I think part of the reason it's not probably has to do with how it's a lot easier to justify giving weapons to a country being invaded then it is to justify invading another country, even if both are the result of US imperialism and will only hurt the respective regions. Probably also doesn't help with anti-war libs that it's Biden doing it.
Lenin is figure of world historic importance resulting from him having a grasp on the conditions at the time better than anyone else. Who knows what he'd do if he was around today with a similar grasp on today's conditions. But he didn't exploit the situation in Russia alone, there was a well organized party and a massive socialist base that does not exist here today.
this is a sincere question, who are larouchites/what is larouchism?
Ancient trot who founded a homophobic and racist “left”party that use nunchuks to beat other leftists.
Later became a reagan administration org.
Tldr imagine the MEK but american
I don't adore the source, but here you go https://cosmonaut.blog/2019/03/19/larouche-a-warning-for-us-all/
in addition to what other commenters have said, :trueanon: did a pretty good episode about larouche if you want to go down the rabbit hole.
