I've been seeing a huge amount of anti-Chinese sentiment online, from obvious places like reddit, to even misinformed friends on social media falling victim to viral posts filled with misinformation.

What are we to make of this? Is this the slow march to war, by portraying them as pure evil, à la the fake story of Iraqi soldiers killing Kuwaiti babies to help get the public on board with our military response? It seems disadvantageous for the US and their allies to fight China, as we are incredibly reliant upon them economically and don't stand to gain much from the conflict.

Are these the irrational decisions of a dying empire? Or is there something else at play?

  • Jorick [he/him]
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    4 years ago

    Hey, I'm relatively neutral on all this China stuff, if not a bit wary, but I have a few questions since a lot of news on China are simply biased from the get-go :

    • What do you think of China's buying sprees all accross the globe, and seizure of assets when these countries find themselves unable to pay ? (ex : Sri Lankan port). I know the US does way fucking worse, but China doesn't appear to be exactly benevolent. I know they financed projects in Ethiopia for their oil and signed contracts with them, but the contracts always seem to disfavour the countries that sign them.
    • What do you think about the South China sea tensions ?
    • What do you think about surveillance, social credit, and other "totalitarian" measures implemented or to be implemented ? A lot of it is sentionalized bullshit by western media, but there is some truth to it from what I know.
    • Speaking of sentionalized stuff, what do you think about China's involvement in Tibet and Xinjiang ?
    • What's your take on racism in China, like for white monkey jobs, the way blacks are seen there, or the apparent Xenophobia ?
    • Do you think China will, as some tankies say, allow for a greater control of the means of productions by the working class and democratize ?
    • Lastly, even if it's less serious, how do Chinese people view Europe ? And France in my case ? I know it's a big country, but what is the general vibe people have about these ?

    Anyway, hope you can answer these for me comrade.

    • yeahhhhhhhhhboiii [none/use name]
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      4 years ago

      That's a lot of questions, and I am not an expert on all things politics, but here are some of my attempts: Once again, I don't speak for all Chinese people.

      1. I'll say this video answers a lot of your worries about "debt traps" etc. Keep in mind that China regularly waives debts from poorer countries as well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBgbYQ5QAM0

      Yanis Varoufakis is straight up not a fan of China either, so you don't have to worry about bias here. Another thing to keep in mind is that these countries can think for themselves. If they believe that the contract is a shitty one, they can decide not to sign it. Again, there are other places to borrow money. These other places may be less than ideal however, and I'm sure these countries have thought for themselves and chose China.

      1. South China seas. I'll be honest, I have no idea what to think about it. Maybe have a look at r/sino for some far more educated thoughts. Here's one of their links, judge for yourself:

      https://isdp.eu/publication/understanding-chinas-position-south-china-sea-disputes/#_ftn2

      1. Think of the social credit as your normal credit. Again, I'm going to post some links etc for you to judge yourself:

      https://www.chinalawtranslate.com/en/futher-regulating-social-credit/

      Or if you like twitter threads: https://nitter.net/chinalawtransl8/status/1288196385637052418

      And here is some context for why this is used instead of the credit system in the west:

      "Many of you have probably heard about the “Social Credit” system being developed in China particularly from western media. However, “Social Credit” is a product of bad translation between Mandarin an English as “Social Credit” in English sounds like a credit score on your social media or social interactions, however, this is not the case. The Mandarin meaning of the phrase is more closely related to Socialism. A “Socialism Credit” but that doesn’t make much sense in English. It is a Credit Worthiness rating system very similar to that of the ones in the West. Think “Credit rating with Socialist Characteristics”. Here is one list of relevant documents on the planning of the social credit system. A reader of this will note that the focus is not on controlling dissent or influencing your social media like western articles have suggested, but rather towards building a regulatory framework around financial activities and legal compliance.

      So, you may be wondering, if it's just a Financial Credit Worthiness Rating system, why not just use one identical to the rest of the world. Well that is because only 30+ years ago China was a poor country with no financial industry or credit systems. As China grew Chinese culture ingrained in the people to save, save, save and never live past your means, like take on debt. In 2016 China had a Household Savings Rate of 36.1%. Which is one of the highest in the world.

      For comparison, here are some other 2016 world economies Household Savings Rate:

      South Korea: 7.2% Japan: 2.4% United States: 4.9% Australia: 8.9% Germany: 9.6% Switzerland: 17.8%

      Because of this extraordinarily high savings rate, and the advent of digital payment systems in 2004 with Alipay and then WeChat pay in 2011 Credit Cards while still used and commonly accepted are not commonly used and never caught on with the majority of the public in China. By 2012, only 25% of Chinese consumers had a credit card. By 2015 50% of consumer payment transactions were being done from mobile payment platforms. Because of this, most Chinese consumers don’t have a credit history to build a traditional credit score on. However, I would like to point out that in recent years there has been a rapid increase in credit card/consumer debt usage. So the government’s idea to solve the gap in determining people’s creditworthiness was to create a creditworthiness rating that takes in factors such as other governmental public data like rent payment, delayed payment to common reserve fund, defrauding/cheating the healthcare fund, common reserve fund, wages, embezzlement charges as well as on top of your financial credit history. In around 2016/2017 the Chinese government gave a number of private corporations licenses to create their own Social Credit scoring systems with whatever available data they had to test out the idea. "

      Source and more details: https://www.reddit.com/r/Sino/wiki/faq/social-credit-system

      1. Xinjiang has oil and rare earths. Lol need I say more.

      Here's something interesting about the terrorist attacks in Xinjiang: "Throughout the 1990s, hundreds of Uyghurs were transported to Afghanistan by the CIA for training in guerrilla warfare by the mujahideen. When they returned to Xinjiang, they formed the East Turkistan Islamic Movement and came under Çatlı's expert direction. Graham Fuller, CIA superspy, offered this explanation for radicalizing the Chinese Muslims: The policy of guiding the evolution of Islam and of helping them [Muslims] against our adversaries worked marvelously well in Afghanistan against the Red Army. The same doctrines can still be used to destabilize what remains of Russian power, and especially to counter the Chinese influence in Central Asia. This policy of destabilization was devised by Bernard Lewis, an Oxford University specialist on Islamic studies, who called for the creation of an “Arc of Crisis” around the southern borders of the Soviet Union by empowering Muslim radicals to rebel against their Communist overlords."

      Quote from Operation Gladio: The Unholy Alliance between the Vatican, the CIA, and the Mafia by Paul L. Williams. He's a Evangelical Christian type nutcase which hates islam so take this quote with a lot of salt.

      Despite all the terrorist attacks in Xinjiang, national news do not report on it very much. To do so would stir up tensions between the Han and the Uyghurs, when cooperation and unity is needed.

      The BRI also goes through Xinjiang, and for trouble to start there of all places, especially after China announced BRI, is doubly suspicious.

      You know anyone can travel to Xinjiang right? If they had some shady shit to hide, why let people travel there?

      Okay, some context for Tibet. Tibet in the past really was not this happy go lucky, all about peace and meditation, Buddhist and holy place. That is an purposefully cultivated, orientalist view of Tibet. Back then, serfs were a thing. Those in the upper echelons of Tibetan society can do anything to those on the bottom, and this was usually violent abuse. See Michael Parenti's essay on Tibet, it's very comprehensive: http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html

      And some history of Tibet: https://nitter.net/i/status/1270468493016576000

      Carl Zha is really good at long af threads about geopolitics, but some sentences can be difficult to parse.

      1. Racism in China

      Hmmm, "white monkey" jobs may exist, not sure how common it is though, especially nowadays. You do see them occasionally in ads, posing awkwardly haha. I'll say that it manifests from 崇洋媚外, where some Chinese people adore all things Western and foreign, and hate all things Chinese. It's a really shitty self-hating attitude, but you do see them in some people. This manifests in many ways, one of which may be using white people to promote products.

      As for racism against black people, I would say that it may exist, but generally it isn't violent and systemic. It stems from ignorance, because they simply don't see many black people in China. What they do see may come from Western media (which they have access to, because VPNs). Using black people as slaves was not a thing in China, nor was colonising Africa in Chinese history. Thus, the things a select few Chinese people say or do may seem racist or at least insensitive in American eyes, comes from not knowing better. This sort of history is not exactly well known to all Americans/Westerners either, how many can explain why watermelon is a racist trope used against black people? It was because slave-owners wanted to depict black people as simple minded and easily kept happy, with foods such as watermelon.

      As Mao says, it doesn't matter if it is a white or a black cat, as long as it catches rats.

      1. Seizing the means of production

      Mate I have no clue. All I know is that capitalism is really state controlled, and not the other way round. The rich really have to be careful now, and there are quite a few cases of billionaires being executed. Not sure if you saw this news, but essentially this billionaire's financial empire had been seized and redistributed: https://www.scmp.com/business/companies/article/3093663/chinas-regulator-seizes-control-six-insurers-trust-firms-mass

      1. Views on Europe and France I do not speak for all Chinese people, here's the vibe I personally get from my relatives etc in China

      Europe and France is generally viewed as much better than America, but even then, not all dislike America. The positive views Chinese people have on these countries is reflected in the names Chinese people have for these countries. America, 美国, translates as "beautiful country". England, 英国, translates as "brave country". France, 法国, translates as "Just/lawful country". I'm not joking, these are really what these names translate to. I don't mean that they literally think France is lawful, but it is positively viewed. I'm pretty sure most Chinese people think of Paris when they think of France, and they think of a very romanticised life with wine and the Eiffel tower in the background. As well as expensive fashion lol. Those who actually go there may or may not get Paris syndrome, but I think that may be more of a Japanese phenomenon. Hmmm, not sure what else to say here. Those who are into geopolitics may want Europe to stand up against the US more? And they hope Germany sets the trend in doing so.

      I hope that answers some of your questions?