I made the decision that I'm not voting for Biden a long time ago, but been getting a lot of grief from my liberal friends and family.
No, I don't agree with his policies. No, I don't agree with his track record. No, I don't think his "climate change plan" is convincing or nearly goes as far as is needed. No, I don't think Obama did a good job. Not on a boat, not on a train... this election crap is driving me insane.
Been getting iced out a lot because they're all like "but Biden needs overwhelming support to overcome Trump's blatant election f*ckery threats." How can you not do it? Then they look at me like I've been kicking puppies. Not my problem. He's not entitled to my vote as the "lesser of two evils."
And if there's going to be election shenanigans... what difference does voting even really make? Political referees will hop in and call a politics fowl? I don't think they're gonna handle me saying that electoral politics altogether is a waste of time too well.
Anyways, any advice how to handle without ruining relationships?
The dude said he's gonna coup Venezuela and go to war with China lol he can fuck all the way off death to amerika
One of my go-tos has been that Trump has a record of talking mad nonsense with very little follow-through. Biden stands a better chance of actually getting his awful policies done.
Remember when he was sabre rattling with Iran? Remember Venezuela? Remember when he said he'd throw Hillary Clinton in jail? His saving grace is that he's lazy and loves squashing his cabinet subordinates.
Of course, he's an "existential threat to democracy" but I dunno how voting Biden would change that.
Trump is very confusing. He praised Maduro at one time, wtf was that even about? He met with Kim, something Biden would never do. Its fucking weird but it seems like Trump doesnt care as much about the whole empire building shit that neoliberals and neocons are so fucking obsessed over.
If he just adopted M4A and Green New Deal most of the Bernie crowd would come around to him. But nope. They can't give us anything. They'd rather lose than give progressives even one piece of policy.
Biden has a credibility problem, not a policy problem. Bernie has spent his whole career fighting for stuff like M4A, so it's easy to believe he will fight for it. Biden literally shat on Bernie just the other day. He could say he's going to nationalize the banks on Day 1, I still wouldn't believe him.
who dat is gonna make me eat a bullet? who dat?
:this-is-fine:
Their owner should also stop helping the Catholic church cover for pediphile priests.
What if their boss is their dad, lol? Send help, I'm surrounded by petite bourgeoisie.
Tell them that Biden would have followed through with supporting the coups in Venezuela and Bolivia, while Trump got bored and forgot about them. A vote for Biden isn't a vote against fascism, it's a vote to outsource it.
Getting into why U.S. foreign policy is bad is probably more productive than talking about Biden.
Y'all ever consider just not talking about this stuff? I don't talk politics with my GOP family for a reason.
You could just write someone in or vote third party, and just tell them you voted Biden. We have secret ballots for this reason.
I can't tell you whether or not it's a good idea for you to stand up to your parents. That's going to depend on your situation and how they're likely to react. So, having said that, if you decide that standing up to them at this point is not in your best interests, here's some advice:
Nobody knows what's on your ballot. You should be able to look at all the options that will be on your ballot online ahead of time, and check if there are any measures up for a vote (these can be very important locally and affect things like schools, so it pays to read about them ahead of time) and see if there are other down ballot things you care about. Vote about what you want, leave blank what you want, and turn the thing in. If you leave the whole thing blank, your parents will never know.
I'll just write my response and see if it helps:
Well look, I would happily vote Biden over Trump if we had something like ranked choice voting. But the democrats and republicans alike would rather have a system where my vote is wasted than to allow third party challengers. The only reason we're in this situation where I'm supposed to vote for the "lesser evil" is by design, because the two parties want to stifle democracy. I'd be willing to hold my nose and vote for a csndidate I didn't like if it meant that they would change the system such that I wouldn't have to do it again. But you're asking me to support the people who are keeping me disenfranchised, and to keep voting for them my entire life. And if I have kids, they'll be expected to do the same. That's completely unacceptable, and I won't do it. If Biden wants my vote, he can have it the moment he endorses election reform so that I'm never in this position again.
I refuse to buy into the logic of lesser-evilism and I will not vote for a candidate who isn't qualified to be president, period. And there are plenty of reason why Biden is not fit to be president. I felt the cost of the War on Terror personally, due to my brother's trauma and the trauma he put my family through - but this was only a small taste of the horrors that the people living in the Middle East went through. Biden's role in that is unforgivable. He's also one of the architects of mass incarceration, and as VP did nothing about the immigrant camps. He has been given opportunity after opportunity to do better, but instead has had a hand in basically every major problem that we face.
Fundamentally, it is the responsibility of politicians to win over voters, not the responsibility of voters to vote for a candidate. Even with what I've said, there are plenty of ways that Joe could have won my vote. Instead he has made it overwhelmingly clear that he doesn't want my vote. He has done virtually everything he could to alienate the left, from directly telling people not to vote for him, to saying he has, "no empathy" for the struggles of young people, and most importantly by far, to rejecting all sorts of popular and essential progressive policies, such as M4A and the GND and codemning protesters and trying to out-jingo Trump on China and I can go on and on.
At the end of the day, my vote is my voice. And I believe that it's my responsibility to use my voice to speak for the victims of US imperialism, because they aren't given a voice in our elections despite the fact that their lives are often affected more by our policy than even we are. These are the people who lost friends and relatives to Obama's drone strikes, where we have no idea how many civilians were killed because they just classified any male in a certain age range as terrorists, the same way they did it back in Vietnam. I don't believe that these people would want me to vote for Biden.
That is my decision, and the only one who could possibly change my mind is Biden himself, and he's shown no inclination that he's willing to throw me a bone.
Tell them you're supposed to vote for candidates that you actualkly like, respect and want to have in power, and that Biden fulfills none of those things for you.
If they go "B-but Trump", tell them that the Democrats should've picked a better candidate then.
That's the thing. In this whole Biden argument with libs, we're just supposed to ignore this whole idea that you should vote for the person who aligns with your values and beliefs?
Lmao I live in California. Most of us do? I'm voting for PSL lol. Who cares who I vote for. It doesn't matter after the prinary its fuckin sick lol, literally it stopped mattering super tuesday, remmember that fuck
Not gonna vote for a rapist (if gloria raped tell me please I'll do a write-in) and if you live in California and vote Biden you areshit, fuck you, if you live in corn country where votes matter then your vote still doesn't matter, voting is fake, it doesn't count when you vote its just a stupid distraction shell game, fuck America, God Damn America, Death to dogshit america
I agree with everyone who said not to talk about politics with them. My mother is an avid AfD (pretty much germany's nazi party.) supporter, and when we talk about some topics it only turns into a shitshow.
For real? Even Germany has fascists again?
You'd think of all the places to have learned the lesson on that one...
Oh how "peculiar" and "not fitting with everything we know and understand about modern day capitalist states"
As a German could you enlighten me as to why AfD support is so high in former DDR regions?
Everyone is giving you a book to throw at them as if that's how these conversations work.
You need a short, direct reply like "Do you honestly believe Joe Biden will do anything about climate change, healthcare, cops murdering people, the economy sucking for many people, etc.?"
They don't -- libs know he sucks. And if they try to claim he'll actually do something you can bring up where he said he wouldn't, or where he's done the opposite.
Voting takes like, a half hour every 4 years and does nothing. If they care a shit-load, try to get them to do something worthwhile in return then go vote for whoever. "Yeah I'll vote but only if you [insert praxis] with me".
Yeah this is a good idea. I'm gonna vote for Biden (the horror!) because it's important to Black people and women in my life who I love and who participate in radical politics; Black communists who I have worked with for almost a decade. Whatever, it doesn't cost me anything, my communism isn't being revoked, and it's not like the vote means anything at all anyways.
For the libs in my family, I can use it to get them to go to an action at some point. "I voted for Biden and I hate that motherfucker. Can't you come throw a brick at a cop with me?"
I sold my vote for dinner at my favorite Indian restaurant in 2016. This is a much better idea.
