“wow hexbear’s most annoying user returns and the site immediately starts to implode. really makes you think!” -a brave but fallen commenter
It’s an honor to be y’all’s most annoying user. I have been back for all of 3 days and I’m already catching strays, hell yeah.
To start out this classic “TC69 takes the reigns” post, I want everyone to take a moment to read this “I’m leaving” post I made during the Great Pronoun Wars and it’s slew of bloody battles before we move on as a refresher for where things were when I left. I want everyone in this chat to take a big step back and look at the overall reaction to this struggle session with my leaving post in mind. I want everyone to consider if there is still work to be done in the community.
Over the years while completely detached from the community for mental health reasons, I’ve heard whispers on the wind about the state of Hexbear – telling me that while things have massively improved for trans people, there is still work to be done in the chauvinism, misogyny, and overall toxicity departments. Wild that I managed to catch some strays, but I hope that “really makes you think”, I guess.
To cool everyone’s jets, you will be getting your slop back, but it’s definitely not going to come without some changes to the community as a whole. I’m talkin’ constitutional amendments. We will be updating the COC in the coming week-ish to explicitly disallow misogynistic and chauvinistic language/sentiments – what will be explicitly said, I don’t yet know but I do have some ideas having reviewed the COC for the first time in 3 years last night.
Having just come back outta the blue, I didn’t have much of a stake in this struggle session nor much context for the circumstances that led to this decision being made but from what I can make sense of, it sounds like we’re combing for the aforementioned issues with too fine of a comb. My view of the situation is this:
- I will provide an example to start. There are three overlapping communities that I remember receiving heavy pushback to have separated: Politics, Electoralism, and News. Each of these communities may have the same posts on average, but the way in which users discuss the content is distinctly different. I view this attempt at community changes in a similar light. Before the next point, I will say that from what I’ve gathered, I view the dunk_tank in more of a "here is some general stinky shit regarding politics, lib brain rot, electoral copium, etc., etc. Let’s all point, laugh, crack jokes, regurgitate the lukewarm takes we saw on Twitter yesterday” way.
- With point #1 in mind, I agree with the overall sentiment of a counterpropaganda community as well as see a healthy appetite amongst users for a more educational approach to “dunking”. However, I don’t think taking out the holy centrist middle ground and asking for more effortful posts was the best step. Perhaps all we want to do is point and laugh, perhaps a baby leftist sees something Not Good TM somewhere else on the internet, and while they do not have all the context or education on the matter to make an effort post of why said thing is Not Good TM, they do have the ability to identify it as Not Good TM and can post it to let other people tear it apart. There is value in that, but we need to work on the shadowboxing and cut down on the aforementioned chauvinistic, misogynistic and overall toxic tendencies, folks.
- There is equally value in seeing chud shit online and wanting to go in-depth for new leftists about why something is reactionary, but I don’t think everyone is meant to be a poster – not that I don’t believe in y’all’s posting power, but it’s true. 353K posts, 4.75M comments. Some people just live for the comment sections and that’s okay, I love you all the same. Commenters are still braver than any troop.
I feel like the overall sentiment is that we don’t have a problem with dunk-esque content, just the means by which it’s discussed – particularly involving, again, the aforementioned issues and conversations devolving into shadowboxing.
So here’s what we’re gonna do. COC Update, then run a slop channel naming competition for a new contained community. I’m going to make a megathread for the community to decide the name of our new slop trough. Most upvoted comment after a week decides the name (some restrictions may apply, I’m not going to let this turn into the Mountain Dew naming competition, obviously).
That’s it, that’s the post. I apologize for the rustiness in making community announcements, it has been a while. Love you all.
Original post here: https://hexbear.net/post/3856299?scrollToComments=false
EDIT: Look, I just got back from a 3 year hiatus 3 days ago. I'm definitely not privy to everything that has been said or done with regards to this issue while I've been slowly walking down the pool stairs and adjusting to the temperature of the water. From what I've read, some outta pocket shit was definitely said, and I apologize on behalf of the team for the defensiveness and botched communication on this rollout. For now, I'm working on addressing things that are immediately within my control and power as per usual with these types of "TC69 picks up the pieces" posts.
We aren't some turbo transphobic cabal, as I said 3 years ago in the exact same way, we're just volunteers trying to continually better the community and navigate taking action against certain types of behaviors/sentiments (something literally no other social media platform gives a fuck about doing, if they aren't actively encouraging negative behaviors to begin with). While what was said did not come from me, I can guarantee it was made under immense stress and pressure, per usual. That does not excuse it, but there is certainly a reason why the running joke is "wow TC69 is literally Stalin with her 5 attempted resignations" - see Carcosa's attempted resignation last night. I love y'all, but this is getting outta hand.
Please be patient as we work through these issues and navigate taking steps to improve. And for the love of G O D please let me catch up some more before our next struggle session.
EDIT 2: I said it 3 years ago, I'll say it again today. I'm not going to sit here and post every little example of things we're describing as an issue when the modlog is publicly available. It's accessible from any page on the site at the very bottom and in the sidebar of all comms. Please let your keyboard breath and spend like 15 minutes reviewing the modlog, lmao.
EDIT 3: Sangria was Alaskaball. Banning themself was a bit. Furthermore, they were unaware that fella was a gendered term, as was I. Yes, they did effectively misgender themselves if you consider fella to be a gendered term. They don't consider it to be. Therefore, non-issue on this point.
EDIT 4: I'm locking the thread. I tried my best to give some decent paths forward amidst the chaos. Someone else can deal with this.
which one of you did this please
This smug condescension is exactly the kind of shit that pissed me off about the anonymous mod post. Its not like they were even shitposting they were contributing to the conversation constructively
E: and its from TC69??? Disappointing to say the least
Cool, it appears @morte was banned for this comment...
All I can say is that for me it is not disappointing. In order to be disappointed one needs to have expectations to begin with, and as apparently one of the very few people who remembers what TC69 was actually like as an admin, I am not disappointed in the least.
I haven't had this much pure anxiety being on this forum for years. It's the only real sense of community I have in this hellworld and this rampaging 'le spork of DOOM' character is handing out bans for annoying her with a random spinner like we're not even fucking people with real feelings. It's horrible. I fucking hate this. But it's a joke to her and the rest of the mods and apparently that's what the real website is. Not us.
Editing to reflect that I discovered that apparently those random bans were a bit that people volunteered to take part in.
Edit AGAIN to reflect that they're ALSO banning people who AREN'T volunteering for the bit (e.g. https://hexbear.net/u/usa_suxxx who's just another example of "banned for being mad")!
Yeah the other day I was so annoyed by this shit that I literally had to just walk away and go clean my room to force reset my brain and remember that this is a funny pig poop beanis forum, because otherwise these fuckers were gonna drive me insane
It's just a relief to see that so many people are calling it out. I think for a long time the usual response to overstepping admins/mods has just been head down, pretend it doesn't exist, move on. Toxic, negative peace. It's good that we're actually talking about it now, and that the arbitrary bs "stop disagreeing with me" bans are only fuelling the fire more.
same. I'm trying to build something irl, but it's fucking hard. our son is a senior in high school, we barely stay afloat every month, I don't have the spoons to make plans and hang out and do cool shit.
most days, I barely have the spoons to get done the crucial shit. this place has been such a comfort to visit, with so many people who understand exactly what I'm going through.
it is horrible to watch and I hate it too.
CW: discussions of suicide, self-harm, transphobia
I do remember. I remember the sub being banned. I remember the wack ass discord. I remember the first few months of the site. I remember TC69 stepping up, organizing, cleansing the site of the transphobes, the chasers, and the bigots. Even though i didnt consider myself a part of it at the time i felt so much safer as I watched the burgeoning trans community here blossom. I never posted about it, but i was always always there.
This place became my refuge. Its laughable, I know, because its just a reddit clone, but it was, and it was all i had. As i grappled with my own identity and neurodivergency, isolated, alone, unmedicated for the numerous undiagnosed mental disorders i had, going to therapists who told me to wear emotional masks and act manly as i watched my body start to age from testosterone, tearing my body apart to feel anything beyond this emptiness. I stayed out of every major struggle session the site had because in the end i just... couldnt deal with the idea of the site breaking apart.
When i accepted my identity, put on womens clothing for the first time, confirmed that I was, indeed, trans - i was so happy. So purely happy. One of the first things I did was change my pronouns here, and i laughed and laughed and laughed. If this place hadnt been there for me i dont know how long it would have taken for me to come to terms with this part of me. Maybe i never would have. And even if i had I may not have survived regardless. I nearly didnt. I'm still quite mentally ill, after all. As I watched my state become dramatically more hostile to transfolk; as the nation began to single us out as a punching bag; as I faced the cruelty and verbal abuse from people close to me after coming out; throughout it all you were there. I found solace in your embrace and meaning in our shared struggle. I connected with other queer and trans people, found support in my city, friends at times and lovers at others. Fucked things up with some people but reconnected with people dear to me, too.
Things started to go wrong again recently. Lost my job, fell out with my parents, got fucked over by new anti trans legislation. Then the election cycle started to ramp up and we all got to watch as americans voted for an antichrist embodying some of the worst excesses of the system we live in while the people who are supposed to be our allies did nothing to defend us and perpetuated war and genocide. Nearly lost my mind again. Fell back into self harm, stopped trying to find a job, blew my savings on rent and cheap comforts and drugs. So when trump won, i did what i always do - i came back here.
It was, as always, refuge. Some hope in a hopeless world. Even better, the people that made this site a safe place for those like me had returned after nearly 3 years. I made it through yet another crisis by the skin of my teeth, avoiding a hospital visit without insurance that would almost definitely have wiped out the rest of my savings and trapped me in this state for the forseeable future.
When the decision to close the tank comms was announced, i was just sad more than anything. But not super sad. Thats how things go sometimes, yknow. This site wouldnt be what it currently is if it werent for focused, concerted efforts to change site culture that at times ignored pushback from users. Theres always always been at least some amount of chauvinism, misogyny, and other generally shitty behavior, ever since the days of the sub. Thats just a fact, although from my perspective I thought its always been handled pretty well as the site got older. So I decided to share my opinion anyway because i didnt really think of it as a strugglesesh at that point and, well, i am pro-slop as it were.
But that anonymous post was like a gut punch. I was fucking furious and sad and anxious when i woke up to it this morning. I dont pass. I never have. I get misgendered every day - its probably more like 8 or 9/10 times when im not with ppl close to me. My body is covered in scars and the lines of my body imply the years of testosterone driven aging. I want to be pretty, but i dress masc to hide the scarring and most days im too tired to wear makeup. I dont voice train consistently. Even after 10 laser sessions the hair on my face is noticeable, even through concealer. Ive never organized due to my fears and various neurodivergencies, although one day I hope to do so. Ive read some theory, but find it hard to pick up books consistently, especially after losing my medication. Im not a particularly good communist. Im not particularly good at being trans. Im barely even a person at all. But i thought i didnt have to be. Lying in the sweat and silence as the blood seeped from my wounds into my sheets and scabbed into my sheets as the days melted together and the drugs burned a hole through my skull. As long as the fire within me never flickered out. Just a worm, writhing, wriggling in the mud and the decay, surviving. Praying for the rising of a red star.
But. Because of my rage? Because of my desire to see the bourgeoisie torn into shreds and fed to the hounds? For my longing for just a tiny bit of catharsis and fun on a stupid website thats given me many laughs and much kindness over the years and that i am far, far too attached to? I get told i give off cishet man vibes, by a mod team that is supermajority trans people, scolded for being an internet communist turn off, dismissed, patronized, and paternalized as self harming by doing what? Posting a meow-knife emoji under a bigoted tweet from some dipshit with 20 followers?
So yeah i was angry and hurt and sad and very very fucking scared cause the site i love did something shitty and the response has been unsatisfactory for no reason?? I didnt expect an immediate resolution or for the mods responsible to be dragged out into the streets but good lord i just want something, anything more than an edit saying that some out of pocket shit had been said under stress and a third rank post saying to log off cause its being looked into with no real acknowledgement of the fucked-upness of the post, and other trans users i have looked up to for a long long time being dismissive about it and saying its missing context. And i just dont want to be treated as a child for speaking up about it
But im sorry if ive come across as rude, or disrespectful, and im sorry that i let my anger and sadness get the best of me when i said i was disappointed, and im sorry that i ban evaded to write this post because i get emotional and this is the only thing keeping me from ugly crying even more than i already have which i know is very very silly. Im very sorry if ive contributed to the stress of any admins, particularly @CARCOSA@hexbear.net (who really didnt deserve any shit) and @TransComrade69@hexbear.net because i know this shit isnt easy and youve only been back for a few days and i hope you can get this sorted out because you really did make this a very good place to be and i want it to stay that way.
Anyway I LOVE MY TRANS COMRADES and you can permaban this account. Sorry for the rant
Keep on speaking from the heart, sister. I've got nothing of value to add but I just want you to know I love you and all my trans comrades.
TC69, the original wrecker
The condescension will continue until moral improves.
Christ, the next ban was "none of you are capable of realizing when you need a break"
Mods are absolutely not beating the allegations. Irritating, patronizing bullshit tbh
Edit: and from what I can tell, @Chair was banned for this comment with the mod note "Break Time"
absolutely wild lmao, love too be infantilized on my serious commieposting forum
It gets worse
what the fuck lol who is doing these
I think alaskaball is the only mod on mainI am incorrect, alaskaball is just main enby of main
Sangria (the new admin who joked in the first one of these threads about how arrogant they looked) banned them, and called them a fella.
https://hexbear.net/comment/5618797
We really need to make mod actions public
And just like that one of the most universally supported and appreciated site rules just becomes a selectively enforced pretext to ban people who complain about this drama they created out of nowhere
The mods seem to have it in their heads that this site is supposed to be more of an org than a forum... can we start with a vote of no confidence in the leadership? Maybe once they give out enough "duration of the shock doctrine" tempbans to people who need to
because they're upset at being lied to and treated like children.
Yea this is problematic right here, REgon can make their own damn decisions.
Want to edit before I dip for a few days: TC69 owned up to it, regardless of whether or not I think the ban was warranted my biggest issue was with the anyonymity in the face of a mod/admin team with rogue transphobic and toxic elements, so she deserves props for what I believe is a good step.
Again, logging out, I hope to see this a happier and healthier place in a few days after the energy has subsided, I really love this place and can understand that the good mods and admins have a lot on their hands right now. Love y'all, see you again soon enough
No need for temp bans when mods can instead just advise a user to take some time off
Y'all gotta get this shit sorted now
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Thank you for the past anti-transphobia stuff, but in nearly every other way you're super annoying, melodramatic and seem to think very highly of yourself to a smug liberal degree. Your posts are so self-important and self-aggrandizing.
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Genuine question, despite appearances. If you hate the people here so much why even return?
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We're getting conspiratorial because yesterday you all made fundamental decisions about the site behind closed doors and then lied about your reasoning.
e: And the only fallout from that seems to be falling on the users and not the mods
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There's no sense in acting like we're being unreasonable. You complained about the users being conspiratorial. We are completely justified in this attitude. All I did was remind you why. You're acting like you checked every box such that we're not allowed to feel or act that way anymore. It's condescending.
Especially in the context of whatever plans you had to change the site rolling right along regardless. Is this site the user's or the mod's? Are we extras in your social club?
Welcome back from your 3 year not being a part of this community, by the way. Please don't ban me.
And they keep proving us right.
+REgon, they made very good points around this.
the best thing to do in a tense and stressful situation with emotions running high is to dig the heels in and quadruple down
I think people are rightly concerned about mods demonstrating pretty awful opinions & transphobia and it not being addressed directly. Banning the people who brought this to attention without directly talking about it is the problem that started all this - opaque mod decisions.
I echo this sentiment. While I do think more people should
for a few days (myself 100% included), in the context of shaking faith in a mod team that it is acknowledged includes mods that have harrassed users and expressed transphobic views, this can backfire.
That being said, TC69 did own up to it, which is a good thing as it removes that suspicion, I support this wholeheartedly as a good-faith step towards healing that user/admin relationship.
Alright, see y'all later, I actually mean it this time. I'm gonna finally shut the fuck up like my annoying ass has known I should do for a while now and come back in a few days when I don't have some awful personal shit going on. I know the good mods and admins are going through a ton of shit right now as well (aren't we all?).
Love y'all, hope I come back to a healthier and happier Hexbear.
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neither of those edits address the thing people are mad at tho?
okay. I think what I'm saying isn't being heard - I've watched the modlogs and it doesn't answer it. I'm gonna let this blow over as I'm getting tired of explaining it though - here's hoping it's fixed whenever I get back
could you point out the aggressive elements of my comment please
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why did you threaten me specifically with a ban then
you are not a cop-doctor; you do not need to telepathically sense when someone has posting fatigue and prescribe a medicinal ban, you do not need to deal out revenge timeouts when the mod team's honour is impinged on. Your duties stop at banning actual racist homophobe etc. shit so that it can't take root and noone has to see it. Saying an admin is 'detached' is unbelievably soft and you should be embarrassed if you banned someone for that.
I don't believe many of your 'quotes' were actually posted verbatim by anyone to be honest, but if they were I would include those in the ban notes instead of your current HR epic quips to save on confusion. I wouldn't have brought it up at all if the screenshotted user had been noted to have called you a tankie derogatively.