Half of this site, apparently. Every time there is talk on here about radicalizing people, it shifts to "let's radicalize libs" and you get down-voted into oblivion for pointing out that they come from the upper class and can't relate to any of our struggles.
The majority of libs Marxists should want to radicalize are either a) clearly working-class, b) under 30, or c) marginalized by some combination of sexism, racism, LGBT-phobias, ableism, etc. The libs ripest for radicalization are those who've been made to see what's behind the kayfabe as a result of either political experience or having a shitty life (especially where the boss/landlord/insurance company/etc. is obviously culpable), those who've at least begun to draw or intuit correct Marxist or revolutionary conclusions and are still looking for answers and ways to actually fight back and organize.
In the current moment this might include disillusioned Bernie supporters who were misled by the DSA Dem-entryist tactic for 3 years, or young participants in the revitalized BLM movement (or the youth climate movement, or the women's marches, and so on) who've witnessed firsthand the Dems' and NGOs' sabotage of their movement and the slowing of their momentum in favor of getting out the vote for fucking Joe Biden. To the extent that these people are libs, they're already progressive and are hardly true believers in a reformist or even social-democratic approach anymore.
Of course since a lot of the working class is still either apolitical (and therefore liberal by default rather than invested in liberalism), or under the influence of opportunist saboteurs encouraging them to devote their political energy to helping the Democrats, unless socialists can successfully forge organic grassroots relationships with their co-workers, their communities, their local unions, etc. through united-front struggles and interventions, many of the people who'll be quickest to radicalize are necessarily going to frequently have some lumpen or PMC-failchild characteristics, e.g. students with petty-bourgie or PMC parents, or downwardly-mobile people who had to learn the hard way that meritocracy is bullshit, or underemployed and hyper-oppressed people who've directly experienced state violence in some form and were never invested in the system to begin with.
The enthusiastic and smug K-Hive and Donut Twitter people on the other are the true believers among the PMC and the cynics who've fully embraced the fuck-you-got-mine-except-woke mindset, the people ignorant or ghoulish enough to actually think Biden and Harris are good candidates and to shit on progressive libs for daring to add caveats and criticisms of Biden to their explicitly lesser-evilist and harm-reductionist Biden endorsements.
There are tons of disenfranchised POC across the country who don't vote, are they libs? Most of them are poor and it fits the statistic of lower income households not voting at all. Over 40% of the country don't vote. The left will never accomplish jack shit in this country as long as we keep dividing ourselves with ID-POL, instead of uniting under the banner of working class and acknowledging that the class war is real.
Most POC are also working-class. OhWell has a point, even if the phrasing might read as erring too close to class-reductionist: successful organization of the US working class has to emphasize workers' common material interests and avoid the opportunist pressures from liberal identity politics (emphasis on liberal, not identity politics!) while remaining firmly anti-racist and anti-imperialist, organizing and arguing for workers' liberation as a necessary component of organizing for liberation from racism.
Some workers new to socialism start off having still internalized awful and reactionary ideas but through common struggle with POC and other specially-oppressed groups will necessarily learn to expunge any vestigial racist or otherwise bigoted notions or attitudes from their thinking and from their organizing. For example, a white socialist still recovering from reactionary baggage marching with his comrades for the BLM cause will necessarily be forced to confront their unconscious or semi-conscious racism (e.g. thinking they can ask their Black friend for the N-word pass) in order to become a better comrade, if they give a shit about seeing the workers' movement and eventual revolution succeed and aren't just in it for the healthcare. A US-American socialist organizing with foreign or Indigenous comrades will have to set aside and expunge their unconscious imperialist/settler biases to effectively organize internationally, correctly answering the national question in each context and refusing to buckle to opportunist pressure to endorse social-imperialists like Bernie Sanders.
Most POC get it but don't know theory, and so give up on poltitics entirely. Most don't even bother watching the news because it's so depressing when you don't think there is any way to change anything. That's been my experience with everyone I've talked to, at least.
Yeah I mean I get that for sure I just meant like most people who opine on politics at all are ostensibly liberal because it's the hegemonic alternative to overt racism.
These are the smug mother fuckers that half of this site thinks it's not only possible to radicalize, but totally worth it.
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Half of this site, apparently. Every time there is talk on here about radicalizing people, it shifts to "let's radicalize libs" and you get down-voted into oblivion for pointing out that they come from the upper class and can't relate to any of our struggles.
The majority of libs Marxists should want to radicalize are either a) clearly working-class, b) under 30, or c) marginalized by some combination of sexism, racism, LGBT-phobias, ableism, etc. The libs ripest for radicalization are those who've been made to see what's behind the kayfabe as a result of either political experience or having a shitty life (especially where the boss/landlord/insurance company/etc. is obviously culpable), those who've at least begun to draw or intuit correct Marxist or revolutionary conclusions and are still looking for answers and ways to actually fight back and organize.
In the current moment this might include disillusioned Bernie supporters who were misled by the DSA Dem-entryist tactic for 3 years, or young participants in the revitalized BLM movement (or the youth climate movement, or the women's marches, and so on) who've witnessed firsthand the Dems' and NGOs' sabotage of their movement and the slowing of their momentum in favor of getting out the vote for fucking Joe Biden. To the extent that these people are libs, they're already progressive and are hardly true believers in a reformist or even social-democratic approach anymore.
Of course since a lot of the working class is still either apolitical (and therefore liberal by default rather than invested in liberalism), or under the influence of opportunist saboteurs encouraging them to devote their political energy to helping the Democrats, unless socialists can successfully forge organic grassroots relationships with their co-workers, their communities, their local unions, etc. through united-front struggles and interventions, many of the people who'll be quickest to radicalize are necessarily going to frequently have some lumpen or PMC-failchild characteristics, e.g. students with petty-bourgie or PMC parents, or downwardly-mobile people who had to learn the hard way that meritocracy is bullshit, or underemployed and hyper-oppressed people who've directly experienced state violence in some form and were never invested in the system to begin with.
The enthusiastic and smug K-Hive and Donut Twitter people on the other are the true believers among the PMC and the cynics who've fully embraced the fuck-you-got-mine-except-woke mindset, the people ignorant or ghoulish enough to actually think Biden and Harris are good candidates and to shit on progressive libs for daring to add caveats and criticisms of Biden to their explicitly lesser-evilist and harm-reductionist Biden endorsements.
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Most POC are libs
There are tons of disenfranchised POC across the country who don't vote, are they libs? Most of them are poor and it fits the statistic of lower income households not voting at all. Over 40% of the country don't vote. The left will never accomplish jack shit in this country as long as we keep dividing ourselves with ID-POL, instead of uniting under the banner of working class and acknowledging that the class war is real.
Oh I see, you're a stupidpol guy.
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Most POC are also working-class. OhWell has a point, even if the phrasing might read as erring too close to class-reductionist: successful organization of the US working class has to emphasize workers' common material interests and avoid the opportunist pressures from liberal identity politics (emphasis on liberal, not identity politics!) while remaining firmly anti-racist and anti-imperialist, organizing and arguing for workers' liberation as a necessary component of organizing for liberation from racism.
Some workers new to socialism start off having still internalized awful and reactionary ideas but through common struggle with POC and other specially-oppressed groups will necessarily learn to expunge any vestigial racist or otherwise bigoted notions or attitudes from their thinking and from their organizing. For example, a white socialist still recovering from reactionary baggage marching with his comrades for the BLM cause will necessarily be forced to confront their unconscious or semi-conscious racism (e.g. thinking they can ask their Black friend for the N-word pass) in order to become a better comrade, if they give a shit about seeing the workers' movement and eventual revolution succeed and aren't just in it for the healthcare. A US-American socialist organizing with foreign or Indigenous comrades will have to set aside and expunge their unconscious imperialist/settler biases to effectively organize internationally, correctly answering the national question in each context and refusing to buckle to opportunist pressure to endorse social-imperialists like Bernie Sanders.
Most POC get it but don't know theory, and so give up on poltitics entirely. Most don't even bother watching the news because it's so depressing when you don't think there is any way to change anything. That's been my experience with everyone I've talked to, at least.
Yeah I mean I get that for sure I just meant like most people who opine on politics at all are ostensibly liberal because it's the hegemonic alternative to overt racism.
He's clearly Radicalized.