"it sucks that a subculture which is about going green and reconnecting with nature, which was first pushed by young queer women especially, is now being adopted and overrun by ecofascists. (older people may recall that this is not dissimilar from a problem in the punk subculture.)"
Tbh I kinda hate that I'm Jesse here :') I don't wanna be down with the kids
Hot take: anti-modernist stances like "reconnecting with nature" always have an intrinsic reactionary value.
You can see the same pattern in the 20th century with German romanticism paving the way for German ultranationalism and naziism.
I think no German goverment put as much ecological legislation out as the government of Adolf Hitler.
The whole "reject modernity" is a right wing point.
There's a huge movement in indigenous spaces of reconnecting with nature as a means of reclaiming and reinvigorating indigenous culture though. "Returning to tradition" means something very different for the colonisers vs the colonised.
This is my main gripe with the left values test too. Nationalism is just defined as being proud of your culture and where you come from, which is VERY different depending on if you come from an imperialist culture vs if you come from one where your culture is currently being colonized. Sometimes it's just about survival and not dominance.
I don't wanna reject our anarcho-primitivist comrades :(
Tbh I find a lot of the nature rhetoric off-putting as well. Maybe it's different depending on what country you're in. Over here I associate stuff like cutesie plates with geese on them with rural reactionaries, yknow, the grandchildren of those who voted for the Anschluss and feel no shame about it. On the other hand I think it's worth fighting for "reconnecting with nature" to not be associated with fascist shit. Actually putting your phone down and taking walks in the countryside is pretty dope lol.
Edit: Less about aesthetics and more about serious political stuff - I'm convinced that Austria is gonna slide happily into ecofascism in the next few decades, as will a lot of Europe, and I'm not looking forward to it.
nah, access to nature is a genuine part of a healthy society and if i could give everyone in the world more opportunities to spend time in it i would. you can't call me reactionary because i like to climb into a canoe occasionally lmao
This isn't really true. Rural Maine, New Hampshire, and Vermont have had the "reconnect with nature and go off grid" libertarians and racists for decades, if not centuries. There's a reason those sections are deep red on the electoral map. The current fad is being popularized by young queer women, for sure, but it's been a thing racist white flight folks have been doing seemingly forever.
peasants fleeing to the land to escape urban repression has an even older tradition than that, and i think the back to the land movements of a few decades ago are reflection of that
the main thing is that nowadays land is expensive, so people who have a desire for a lot of space to themselves, and the ones that can live that way, are probably going to be more reactionary because of their material conditions. most that i meet though are the hippie type with decent politics
I think people wanting to reconnect with nature has been a thing since at least the Industrial Revolution at least. Like we can say Marie Antoinette, with her fake farm, was kinda cottagecore. In fact her thing of frolicking with sheep and servants dressed up as farmers and then going home to a palace at the end of the day is arguably closer to the current cottagecore trend than whatever libertarians in Vermont are up to.
I find cottagecore interesting because my initial reaction to it was that it's extremely off-putting for the same reasons others have mentioned, but at the same time I can see where the appeal comes from. I don't think it's from the same place as the off-the-grid apocalypse dudes.
"it sucks that a subculture which is about going green and reconnecting with nature, which was first pushed by young queer women especially, is now being adopted and overrun by ecofascists. (older people may recall that this is not dissimilar from a problem in the punk subculture.)"
Tbh I kinda hate that I'm Jesse here :') I don't wanna be down with the kids
Hot take: anti-modernist stances like "reconnecting with nature" always have an intrinsic reactionary value. You can see the same pattern in the 20th century with German romanticism paving the way for German ultranationalism and naziism. I think no German goverment put as much ecological legislation out as the government of Adolf Hitler. The whole "reject modernity" is a right wing point.
There's a huge movement in indigenous spaces of reconnecting with nature as a means of reclaiming and reinvigorating indigenous culture though. "Returning to tradition" means something very different for the colonisers vs the colonised.
This is my main gripe with the left values test too. Nationalism is just defined as being proud of your culture and where you come from, which is VERY different depending on if you come from an imperialist culture vs if you come from one where your culture is currently being colonized. Sometimes it's just about survival and not dominance.
I don't wanna reject our anarcho-primitivist comrades :(
Tbh I find a lot of the nature rhetoric off-putting as well. Maybe it's different depending on what country you're in. Over here I associate stuff like cutesie plates with geese on them with rural reactionaries, yknow, the grandchildren of those who voted for the Anschluss and feel no shame about it. On the other hand I think it's worth fighting for "reconnecting with nature" to not be associated with fascist shit. Actually putting your phone down and taking walks in the countryside is pretty dope lol.
Edit: Less about aesthetics and more about serious political stuff - I'm convinced that Austria is gonna slide happily into ecofascism in the next few decades, as will a lot of Europe, and I'm not looking forward to it.
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Redditors identity more with the friends of Jeffrey Epstein than indigenous people, can you think of a reason why?
nah, access to nature is a genuine part of a healthy society and if i could give everyone in the world more opportunities to spend time in it i would. you can't call me reactionary because i like to climb into a canoe occasionally lmao
This isn't really true. Rural Maine, New Hampshire, and Vermont have had the "reconnect with nature and go off grid" libertarians and racists for decades, if not centuries. There's a reason those sections are deep red on the electoral map. The current fad is being popularized by young queer women, for sure, but it's been a thing racist white flight folks have been doing seemingly forever.
peasants fleeing to the land to escape urban repression has an even older tradition than that, and i think the back to the land movements of a few decades ago are reflection of that
the main thing is that nowadays land is expensive, so people who have a desire for a lot of space to themselves, and the ones that can live that way, are probably going to be more reactionary because of their material conditions. most that i meet though are the hippie type with decent politics
I think people wanting to reconnect with nature has been a thing since at least the Industrial Revolution at least. Like we can say Marie Antoinette, with her fake farm, was kinda cottagecore. In fact her thing of frolicking with sheep and servants dressed up as farmers and then going home to a palace at the end of the day is arguably closer to the current cottagecore trend than whatever libertarians in Vermont are up to.
I find cottagecore interesting because my initial reaction to it was that it's extremely off-putting for the same reasons others have mentioned, but at the same time I can see where the appeal comes from. I don't think it's from the same place as the off-the-grid apocalypse dudes.
radlib greenwashed capitalism is being ruined by fascists who are honest about what they actually support
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