thinking about a friend from high school who i said a lot of eggy shit to and they said a lot back at me. wonder how they're doing?
Honestly the whole "prime directive" thing kinda pisses me off. I wish someone had leveled with me when I started wondering "Why do I always crush on lesbians? Why do lesbians in media make me feel funny? Why do I feel so indignant when I'm shut out of women's spaces because I'm a guy?" in college. I had like one person I told and they were like "eh that kinda sounds transy" and it was left at that.
Also imagine that concept being used in the context of any other condition: "Damn that stuff they're complaining about sounds exactly like my sleep apnea symptoms. Ah well, not my place! They can suffer for a few more years until they figure it out."
Speaking as someone who had another person tell me directly that I was almost certainly trans while I was still in denial, I think it made me go further into denial rather than help me at all.
I do think that saying literally nothing isn't super helpful either though, leading statements work best imo, as well as offering small sites and stuff when they ask for it.
Yeah, as much as i'd love to have an egg cracker, i don't think it works like that. I also think it would've helped if i had had more unbiased info about transness when i was an egg, but getting cracked was a long process with a ton of steps, i basically had to overcome all of my intenralized transphobia first and then see convincing examples of trans joy to crack me.
People are closeted for a reason, and that reason is that we've all been raised in a crushingly transphobic society where even in the best cases, our existences are almost always exclusively portrayed as tragic tales of martyrdom. As a horrible faith that sadly can't be helped because
spoiler
the very, very few real actual true transsexuals are cursed with this overwhelming desire to live as the opposite sex
(just typing that makes my skin crawl, i'm gonna spoiler it for transmedicalism).
When you're in denial, you will actively run away from that when somebody says to you "hey, you could also lead a live of crushing gender dysphoria and being afraid of transphobic hate crimes". The only way to crack people is to make them realize that transitioning is a desirable and realistic goal for them, that all the struggles are worth it, that they're a fight for a better, more dignified and more fulfilling life. And you can't do that by just saying "hey btw you're very obviously trans".
Pretty much agree with all this, especially the part on media portrayals being too overwhelmingly martyr-y. I think in general trans media from my experience falls either into that camp or the feel good 'everyone has already transitioned and is accepted by their community' camp. I think both are valuable but I feel like there needs to be more stories that go into the realisation process and how it gradually makes your life better. There are a few that exist but they're so rare that it's hard to find them if you're not already trans and active in the community. The only thing that comes close outside the main trans community that I can think of is Bridget, who is actually weirdly decent for this considering how messy her story is overall. But a fighting game arcade mode just isn't a great medium for such a narrative to go in-depth.
That's very fair. I'm normally a stubborn person who will reject things if they're phrased too adversarially (e.g. TC69 thought ¯\_(ツ)_/¯)
Looking back I was more seeking permission and encouragement from someone else to look inward which I never really got, but if I'd been in denial it wouldn't have helped. The second comment in the OP seems like a great middle ground
Seeking encouragement and permission I definitely get, that's why I think leading comments and sending resources is much better than being direct. The same woman who told me I was trans directly later sent me a short infomanga about bottom surgery "just so I know my options" and it had a much more positive impact on my realising since it made me think "oh, this is normal, I could do this"
It did also scare me away from bottom surgery but that's due to my squeamishness
yeah, you gotta at least make some leading comments. i get not wanting to pressure people but i would have absolutely cracked years before i did if a trans person had looked at me and said "i think you might be like me" and i really don think the possibility that they're actually cis is a problem there. if they are than some people made weird comments to them and maybe they experienced a tiny fraction of the pressure we feel from society to be different. they'll live
the fun thing about calling it the "prime directive" is that they routinely went against that shit all the time in star trek. it practically existed to be defied!
personally i say fuck it, if something pings my radar i'm just like "oh have you considered that you might be trans?"
Damnit Picard!! This planet hasn't even invented totally ironic crossdressing as a joke yet!
I'm absolutely with you on that. I'll never say it outright like "Hey friend, you're trans" but I've had the conversation multiple times where I've said something along the lines of "Hey that was a super not-cis thing to say/do, do we maybe wanna unpack that?"
The prime dirEGGtive was meant to be broken, but it should be broken tactfully.
prime dirEGGtive
but also yes, exactly. tact is vital; i think it's telling that a lot of the concerns about violating the PD in trans-positive spaces boil down to "but what if it forces them further into denial/otherwise makes it worse?" and of course no one wants to be (or even just feel!) responsible for that. so i do think it's important to treat the issue with care and caution when we're dealing with people who aren't initiated into the mysteries.basically "be gentle, but No Trans Left Behind"
I agree, you don't wanna railroad people into a specific identity, but gender is inextricably social. This "prime directive" shit treats gender like some atomized, wholly internal, thing. It's based on this idea that mentioning transness at all might corrupt some pure, internal process of gender discovery.
And frankly, that's some fucking lib shit. Instead of this "prime directive" nonsense, you can just present the option to people, and be a supportive friend. That's millions of times more helpful then this coy, anxious, silence.
Yeah honestly. There's a focus on Letting People Figure It Out For Themselves that like, I understand, but I think it goes too far at times.
Plus, it matters who it comes from. I find that a lot of repetition of the "prime directive" and anger at egg jokes etc from cis people comes from a place not of not pressuring someone, but of "how dare you, this person is NORMAL and you shouldn't insult them by insinuating they're like you"
i broke my friend's egg because she would always play girls in video games so i jokingly said "You know you can be a girl in real life too right?"
she accepted she was trans a few weeks later
this is the power we could be wielding, if not for fear! comrade spectre leads the way
ive cracked maybe 10 eggs via our lgbt center. its really interesting how many 'twinks' end up transfem.
i totally recommend volunteering at your local lgbt spot, its very rewarding
Incredible posting, huge fan, love it. IIRC there's gonna be a novel about this sometime.
wait really? i'll read that, do you have any info about it?
read the article i link in the post too if you haven't it's really good
I will, ty! Also my info is that Imogen Binnie said she was writing it in an interview like last year. It could maybe have been a bit or sarcastic or double speak or something, but I didn"t take it that way, so I dunno.
googling imogen binnie kurt cobain reveals a couple of interviews where she talks about working on various projects about kurt cobain being trans, so probably legit
actually in one of them she says nevada (which i haven't read but want to) is kind of about that
That was batshit, I have read Nevada and I don't think it's really about that. I guess kinda, but not really? Weird ass.
- Show
i did also find the interview you were talking about, and i went back and reread the thing i was talking about and it turns out i misread it and she was talking about her next novel, which she's been working on since nevada
Yeah that's the one! I 'member. I'm fucking dying to read it, I first read Nevada in highschool so the release of her next thing will be a big moment!
yeah, i've been meaning to read nevada for a while myself, so i'd definitely read her new novel whenever it comes out
i'd also love to read the zine she apparently prepared about 15-20 years ago about the topic, that seems interesting
I’m really curious, what sort of things would be considered ‘egg-like’? Forgive me if that’s an inappropriate question, I’m a cishet person without a lot of exposure to trans culture.
Egg shit I (an ftm egg) did, off the top of my head:
Ask people if they would still like me if I was a guy.
Make jokes about having a dick.
Have panic attacks when guys I was dating/fucking grabbed my tits or were obsessive about them.
Lament about how much nicer men's clothing is and how much easier it would be to be even slightly stylish as a guy.
Etc.
Lament about how much nicer men's clothing is and how much easier it would be to be even slightly stylish as a guy.
Hah, I'm constantly doing this except reverse the genders.
there's a lot of things that could be defined as egg behavior. in my case i would constantly be bringing up trans issues and stuff, just because that stuff's really fascinating and they're so brave and can you imagine doing that? that's so crazy. i remember caitlyn jenner coming out and i kept talking to people about her. i would also ask people if they'd thought about what it was like as the other sex, complain about my voice being too deep because it made singing harder (and in choir i insisted i was a bass when i very much was not because my voice sounded so deep to me and it really bothered me), play as female characters in games and stuff. i made a lot of comments like "i wish i was a girl because..." and then say some kind of joke or way i thought life would be easier and everyone would give me weird looks
other things i did included that were less public: reading stories where boys would turn into girls magically and try and replicate them. i spent probably 2 hours trying to kiss my elbow when i saw that work in a book i read. i thought some fairly mid webcomics and manga were really good because they had magic gender changes in them. i would read tg porn just out of fascination with it, because i couldn't find openly trans writing to obsess over instead. i would shave way more often than was necessary even though i hated doing it. i was fascinated by queerness and gravitated towards it though i couldn't explain why. a little after i came out as trans my mom told me she'd thought i was gay because if that. i mean, i am, but not like she meant
my experience was obviously not universal though, and there's a wide range of egg behavior out there. if anyone else has things they want to share, whether they're close to my own experience or not, please do
Ah, okay. So it could be as straightforward as making statements about wanting to be a different gender, but it could also be how someone engages with news or media, how they talk about their physical or behavioral characteristics, how they relate to gender or queerness, etc. I could totally see being on the other side of that journey/realization and being able to spot when other people are telegraphing their own dysphoria without realizing it.
yeah. i didn't even touch on all the small stuff i remember from my childhood, from the way i stopped swimming basically as soon as i turned 10 to the clothes i wore to my body language to the way i spoke and a million other tiny things that once you recognize in yourself you can recognize in others
Prime direggtive
edit: DAMMIT SOMEONE ALREADY MADE THE JOKE
then we will make it so
