Bernie voted to bomb yugoslavia, he simped for hillary clinton and biden after they stole the primary from him. he called maduro and fidel tyrants, etc... he has also done more to further leftist ideology in this country than everyone on this site combined
I've heard a great deal about you, Bernard Sanders. You stole your father's armor, ran away from home, impersonated a soldier, deceived your commanding officer, dishonored the Chinese Army, destroyed my palace! And you have saved us all.
Bernie has been a liberal for basically his whole life. He has helped the US war machine kill countless people. No occasional good thing could ever counterbalance that.
If a lib is helping maintain a strike fund using their infrastructure, they're alright. Bernie is part of the system, but at least he's capable of occasionally showing solidarity with workers and not just photographing the homeless and drinking wine while the world burns.
murdering imperialist
they're alright
You can only pick one. Maintaining a strike fund doesn't make him good. It just means he did a good thing - in the global north, and not in the global south where the damage of his actions has been concentrated.
He might not drink wine while the world burns, but he's just fine helping the people doing the burning along.
Agreed lmao, I'm 100% on your side on this one. Just want to say that this is actually good and we should be contributing to strike funds more often. If this is how his campaign infrastructure is gonna be utilized over the next 4 years I'm all for it.
Yeah, I don't mean to get aggro at you or anything. I agree with you that this is a good initiative, 100%. It's also a much better use of his campaign funds than most of the other things he'd be using them for.
Isn't there a quote from Deng where he analyzes Mao as 70% good, 30% bad, then Stalin as 60/40, then himself as 50/50?
My point being you have to take the good with the bad. Yeah it sucks that Bernie is a liberal who is part of the imperialist death machine, but even if he's only 10% good to 90% bad the good should be commended and the bad condemned.
Gotta be able to see correct action when it occurs and find a way to replicate it basically.
ok so have you by working in the US and paying taxes
Yes, every American is as guilty as a politician who votes to go to war. :centrist: And maybe don't assume everyone here is American.
Also, are the American people partially guilty for the actions of their government? :yes-comm: Of course they are.
Seriously, this looks like a :very-intelligent:-tier reply. What's your point?
the original comment is a :very-intelligent: comment so I reply using the same logic
and you seem to literally agree with the point of it lol
and you seem to literally agree with the point of it lol
I literally do not, lmao. Americans bear some guilt for the actions of their government, but not nearly as much guilt as members of the government who vote to go to war.
Unbelievable that this needs to be spelled out.
i dont see the difference between 432 yay to 0 nay vs 431 yay to 1 nay, when you will be attacked and discredited for the no vote. I'd rather someone not sacrifice their position over literally nothing.
He has voted nay in some cases. Others have voted nay in some cases. Having principles doesn't magically make politicians disappear.
Just imagine if he won and all his future outreach was for stuff like this instead of supporting generic libs
Yeah, I've gotten a bunch of these. There are a few that feel a bit scammy, but this one's legit.
Bernie is a stealthy predator. He waits in the tall grass for his moment. And then waits. And then he keeps waits. And like, he’ll strike eventually but you gotta give him some time
unleashed an evil you could never have anticipated. This wicked fate would be wrought by someone, it just happened to be you.
I'm not saying you're wrong, but what exactly can any of us do to help the average Palestinian? Would not supporting the John Deere strike somehow free up revolutionary resources that could be spent helping non-western workers?
Pointing out that the western left spends more time helping western workers who are massively privileged on a global scale is a completely banal and meaningless point. Building up a "western left" (which, let's be clear, does not fucking exist outside of fringe forums like this one) will require building leftist politics off the back of western issues, and the process of doing that will improve the lot of western workers before it improves the lot of anybody else.
What happens if the US collapses under its own contradictions and there isn't a labor movement that can take on whatever hyperreaction comes from the ashes?
Not talking about Bernie, I'm talking about those working class Americans we're not supposed to care about.
Oh, yeah. Obviously an American labor movement is important, no doubt. Caring about the global south doesn't exclude that.
I just thought you were talking about Bernie since that's the subject of the controversy in this thread.
I think they're two different conversations, but given that until communism wins there are going to be senators anyway, I think we should take the Menshevik Bernie over whatever psycho libertarian would come out of Vermont in his stead.
It is true that people focus on things happening where they live
Succdems are a net positive, though. They're not enough, not by a fucking longshot, but they're obviously a net positive. Standing up to domestic capital is better than not standing up to capital at all. Succdems having more power would have positive material benefits, even if it wouldn't solve the unfathomable suffering caused by imperialism. For example, it would be better to have universal healthcare but otherwise the status quo than just the status fucking quo. There's nothing westerncentric about recognizing that and simultaneously continuing to demand an end to capitalism and imperialism entirely.
Yes, in this case they specifically do. Cause every job they dont offshore to exploit forign workers is one we fot here
His a us senator. What do you want him to do? Advocate for the citizens of Peru?
I mean, it would help to be consistently against imperialism and imperialists, but then he couldnt "work within the system" or whatever so I guess electoralists can have a little imperialist simping as a treat.
For a time, I really thought people here had purged themselves of succdem-supporting tendencies. Now I'm not so sure.
its hard to have any hope at all living in this shit hole :amerikkka: i would say if this makes ppl happy let em b happy u kno i have absolutely nothing positive happening in my life and my friends are all dead bc this shithole gvmt doesnt give a fuck sbout us addicts aka poors 1 million dead over 10 years just from opioid s alone i was hit by a car on my bicycle earlier this year right around my birthday, and the year before that was rhe year i lost my best friend (he was 26 and worked with autistic children for fucks sake)
so ill feel at least a little happier tonight than my baseline of like -76 (0 being neutral mood) seeing this, personally i wouldnt say being happy about something relatively good (as an amerikan) makes someone a succdem or means they have succdem tendencies. i am basically 97% against them due to their imperialist views and actions and the remaining 3% is just support for things like that, in the OP.
i am basically 97% against them due to their imperialist views and actions and the remaining 3% is just support for things like that, in the OP.
Yeah, agreed. Shit like in the OP is good, and I agree about being happy about it. There are definitely still some people on here who think this type of thing makes succdems OK though, or good, or something along those lines. It's why we have the occasional arguments over the squad, etc. I don't mean everyone who thinks this is good is a succdem-supporter, however.
Sorry to hear about your friend, and about you getting hit. :amerikkka: Solidarity, and good luck.
