Penn State researchers found that the maximum wet-bulb temperature humans can endure is lower than previously thought — about 31°C wet-bulb or 87°F at 100% humidity — even for young, healthy subjects. The temperature for older populations, who are more vulnerable to heat, is likely even lower.
Okay, honest question: People live in the Sahara today. they also live in the jungles of central America and Africa today. Clearly people can survive in these temperatures...what is this supposed to tell me exactly?
I mean, obviously both of these examples are textbook extreme climate and these people take measures for their own survival and if climate change continues these places in particular may become factually unlivable, but there will not come a point in which all of the earth is too hot to live on, but still isn't saying 'oh if it's over 31c and wet out we will all die' just wrong?
Am I just jaded to think that climate change can't kill all of us, just most of us?
so wet bulb is a 'perfect' condition between humidity and heat, we use water to cool our bodies and if humidity is high enough it nullifies the ability for sweat to cool you faster than surroundings heat you up
sahara is dry as a bone so itd need to get way hotter for your sweat to not work, or wetter. idk why wetbulbs dont seem to happen so often in jungles tho... seems ideal
Probably because it's cooler. Lots of shade, and the people that live there must know a thing or two about heat stroke or exhaustion. We have reached 35 degree wet bulbs on earth, but currently only actually on and around the Persian Gulf. Coastal areas are more at risk because of the water.
I think they say you can survive 140 degree surface temperature? if you're otherwise well hydrated and in the shade and the humidity is low. Evaporative cooling works really well if your surroundings are dry and you don't dehydrate or let your electrolyte balance go out of wack.
In jungles the humidity comes from all the plants evaporating water to do photosynthesis. That evaporation brings cooling, so jungles get pretty warm but not deadly hot. You can almost think of it that plants have to sweat to photosynthesize.
Coastal and swampy areas near the equator at the most at risk, because there’s so much water just sitting around.
Wet bulb will kill most of us, then there's excess CO2 in the air which start to affect the brain at about 600ppm (office buildings already sometimes get as high as 2000ppm at current 460ish levels), there's famine, flooding, fire, pandemics, etc. People who think we're gonna survive this are being very optimistic.
I agree, I think humans are a bit too adaptable to have complete human extinction, but it could totally be like a few hundred people living in absolute hellish conditions
A lot of it is a cumulative effect too, you can survive stretches of high temp/humidity but in the future when it becomes a months long season that will be increasingly difficult. Also FWIW for several years at this point subsistence farmers in central America have been dying early from renal failure brought on by years of hard labor in ever hotter conditions.
The jungle people only make it by hiding underneath the fauna that the rainforests provide. People having to do manual labor in them drop dead all the time. I live in one of the hottest regions of Central America. There was one point when it got up to 112 degrees Farenheit. It was very dry and my head felt like it was spinning if I was out for too long. There's going to be a point where I'll have to move and I'm still not sure where that will be.
The study? That a couple dozen random Americans from the northeast suddenly thrust into high temperatures suffer horribly much sooner than expected based on existing research. People adapt to the temperature they live in long term, so someone used to carefully climate controlled environments struggles to handle heat.
Also people who live in the most extreme climates have developed various ways of mitigating that, whether in things like clothes that reflect sunlight and whisk away sweat while remaining breathable or in architecture that helps keep living and working spaces cool by doing things like channeling wind through cisterns or cellars and building cities to create strong, shaded breezes, along with behavioral things like just not doing heavy work during the hottest times of day.
For the Sahara, I found that one of the hottest areas is Ouargla, Algeria. The highest forecasted temperature will be 47 degC with rel. humidity of 6%. This is equivalent to a wet bulb temp of 20 degC (< 31 degC limit).
For jungles, Belmopan, Belize has forecasted temps for this week up to 33 degC with 56% rel. humidty (wet bulb temp = 26 degC).
you can use this calculator with values from different cities
Okay, honest question: People live in the Sahara today. they also live in the jungles of central America and Africa today. Clearly people can survive in these temperatures...what is this supposed to tell me exactly?
I mean, obviously both of these examples are textbook extreme climate and these people take measures for their own survival and if climate change continues these places in particular may become factually unlivable, but there will not come a point in which all of the earth is too hot to live on, but still isn't saying 'oh if it's over 31c and wet out we will all die' just wrong?
Am I just jaded to think that climate change can't kill all of us, just most of us?
so wet bulb is a 'perfect' condition between humidity and heat, we use water to cool our bodies and if humidity is high enough it nullifies the ability for sweat to cool you faster than surroundings heat you up
sahara is dry as a bone so itd need to get way hotter for your sweat to not work, or wetter. idk why wetbulbs dont seem to happen so often in jungles tho... seems ideal
Probably because it's cooler. Lots of shade, and the people that live there must know a thing or two about heat stroke or exhaustion. We have reached 35 degree wet bulbs on earth, but currently only actually on and around the Persian Gulf. Coastal areas are more at risk because of the water.
I think they say you can survive 140 degree surface temperature? if you're otherwise well hydrated and in the shade and the humidity is low. Evaporative cooling works really well if your surroundings are dry and you don't dehydrate or let your electrolyte balance go out of wack.
In jungles the humidity comes from all the plants evaporating water to do photosynthesis. That evaporation brings cooling, so jungles get pretty warm but not deadly hot. You can almost think of it that plants have to sweat to photosynthesize.
Coastal and swampy areas near the equator at the most at risk, because there’s so much water just sitting around.
Wet bulb will kill most of us, then there's excess CO2 in the air which start to affect the brain at about 600ppm (office buildings already sometimes get as high as 2000ppm at current 460ish levels), there's famine, flooding, fire, pandemics, etc. People who think we're gonna survive this are being very optimistic.
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I agree, I think humans are a bit too adaptable to have complete human extinction, but it could totally be like a few hundred people living in absolute hellish conditions
That etcetera is doing a lot of work, friend.🤷♂️
Nuclear war.
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:so-true: it's just like the book of genesis!
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We're not yet to the kind of temperature rises that are extinction events. We're still just at mass die-off and global collapse levels.
A lot of it is a cumulative effect too, you can survive stretches of high temp/humidity but in the future when it becomes a months long season that will be increasingly difficult. Also FWIW for several years at this point subsistence farmers in central America have been dying early from renal failure brought on by years of hard labor in ever hotter conditions.
Dry heat vs wet heat.
The jungle people only make it by hiding underneath the fauna that the rainforests provide. People having to do manual labor in them drop dead all the time. I live in one of the hottest regions of Central America. There was one point when it got up to 112 degrees Farenheit. It was very dry and my head felt like it was spinning if I was out for too long. There's going to be a point where I'll have to move and I'm still not sure where that will be.
Also note the population density of those places. Some humans can survive there, but not a lot of humans.
The study? That a couple dozen random Americans from the northeast suddenly thrust into high temperatures suffer horribly much sooner than expected based on existing research. People adapt to the temperature they live in long term, so someone used to carefully climate controlled environments struggles to handle heat.
Also people who live in the most extreme climates have developed various ways of mitigating that, whether in things like clothes that reflect sunlight and whisk away sweat while remaining breathable or in architecture that helps keep living and working spaces cool by doing things like channeling wind through cisterns or cellars and building cities to create strong, shaded breezes, along with behavioral things like just not doing heavy work during the hottest times of day.
For the Sahara, I found that one of the hottest areas is Ouargla, Algeria. The highest forecasted temperature will be 47 degC with rel. humidity of 6%. This is equivalent to a wet bulb temp of 20 degC (< 31 degC limit).
For jungles, Belmopan, Belize has forecasted temps for this week up to 33 degC with 56% rel. humidty (wet bulb temp = 26 degC).
you can use this calculator with values from different cities