On r/collapse and pissed of another rambling neoliberal ghoul by saying China cares more about it's people since it has a higher rate of home ownership among the youth and that they focus on avoiding the traps of American market speculation. In response I got this babbling paragraph of nothing burgers lmao.
"Do you have even a tiny clue as to how housing works in that market? Do you understand that the average apartment price per square foot in major cities can be over a thousand USD? Or $5-600 a square foot in Third Tier cities. Or that average income to mortgage ratios are over 100% in most cities in the country, and exceed 400% in tier one cities? Do you understand that there are many, many ghost cities containing fake housing for hundreds of thousands of occupants, in building where apartments sell for $300K USD and up? These building are often just empty shells that can never be occupied, since they don't have elevators or even stair towers. Do you understand that it's not unusual to have the government issue demolition orders for new construction mid-rise towers, as they are built so astoundingly poorly that they are in danger of collapsing, and some actually do collapse? Do you have a clue that the average urban professional clears $1100 USD/month and can't buy a place to live, under $4-500K USD within several hours of commute time to their job? Do you understand that the entire Chinese residential market is a fucking scam, that there are 65 MILLION unoccupied units, frequently purchased by extended families that have pooled every fucking dime that several generations have, to pay a down payment on an apartment, hours away? An "investment" that will never have any real value, and never be the safe haven for their money they were led to believe it is? Do you understand that the last six months have been a downward spiral in the residential market, with hundreds of billions of dollars lost, sales falling off a cliff and "values" declining at 10% year over year.
No, reality is, you don't have a tiny clue about any of this. Educate yourself and stop believing the propaganda, no matter who is pushing the lies and what country they are shilling for."
stop believing the propaganda, no matter who is pushing the lies and what country they are shilling for.
Yeah, otherwise you’ll sound like this guy.
I always love the irony of that line that is spouted by every twitter and :reddit-logo: ghoul
In all seriousness, Chinese “ghost cities” can be largely attributed to a Keynesian response to the global business cycle in order to keep people employed and productive while making use of excess domestic supply of raw materials like concrete and steel. The fact that the western world didn’t do similarly is why everything is even worse now than it was then. The Chinese built stuff, the west bailed out lending institutions, who did share buybacks and bad debt retirement instead of encouraging real production increases.
But that’s material analysis, which doesn’t account for “China bad” or “authoritarianism” so it’s hard to say what’s really going on.
"The liberal media is lying to you! That's why I find the truth with Joe Rogan!" :frothingfash:
On Joe Rogan: "ex-cia" operatives and Yeonmi Park and a whole of guests repeating CIA propaganda that's propagated by MSM
Yet liberals who hate Jow Rogan won't question for a second why they believe the same bullshit as him about DPRK
/r/collapse is an insane subreddit. 0% coherent ideology, 100% doom.
Yup, occasionally you get good takes and even peeps quoting "how to blow up a pipe line" but then you also get chuds that think economic collapse is the worst collapse ever (never mind climate change). Nine times out of ten they either get down-voted or ignored thankfully.
Last decade's ghost city is this decade's growing population hub. They did the same thing for a lot of the new rail systems when it was first being constructed -- "OH EM GEE, China is building subway stations in the middle of nowhere!!1!" -- and today it's a bustling thoroughfare. You could go digging and match the shock articles of yester-year to mundane city news of today... or you could reply "lol" and get the biggest response for the least effort.
The whole "ghost cities" thing was incredibly stupid for several reasons. Chief among is the fact that Not Just Bikes brought up in one of his latest videos, which is that historically cities have sprung up around transportion hubs, and not the other way around. So if you want people to move to a city / newly planned area, the first thing you have to do is to make sure that there is decent transportation options. Like it's literally the reason that we have almost every city in America west of Minnesota.
Seems like an obvious way to kickstart the proces. Just kind of sucks for the people who are told to either quit or move, at least that was the big point when Denmark tried to counteract the massive centralization that has been happening since the 1970's.
Is it like that though? In Taiwan it's the younger people that don't get that many options in where they can work if it's a gov position. For example, if you're young there not might be any teaching/banking/police officer/firefighter positions in a major city. Maybe in a few years after working in a ruralish area a position will open up in a big city.
I can't speak for the people of Taiwan, since they have a completely different social climate and history compared to my own little slice of scandinavia. Our right-wing liberal party tried their hand at neoliberal economic planning, and it mostly just annoyed people. Turns out you can't really "provide tax incentives" to reserve the natural trend of monopolisation and centralization inherent in our current state of capitalism.
You say "pisspiss poopoo" and send them pictures of actual pig shit over and over until they cry
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he's right about the stupid real estate speculation
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ghost cities are not ghost cities anymore
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the demolition of buildings under construction is usually used in the context of faking gdp growth, not structural instability
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build construction quality has gone up in recent years, 90s and 00s were the heydays of shittiness
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you do get less bang for your buck (poor interior quality, less usable floor space) despite 4 (because of speculation)
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that being said, there have been collapses of finished buildings with occupants inside, and peoples heads have rolled for it. remind me who got the axe for grenfell again?
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people buy houses for speculation yes, but most people actually buy because they need a house to get married and, yknow, live in
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superstructure also drives base: there is a culture of women requiring men to have bought a house/car before getting married as a sign of financial potential, which adds to the speculation
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the downward spiral is a controlled detonation by the central government (because provincial governments are too compromised) that has been cheered on by those who were previously unable to buy a house
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rent is so much fucking cheaper in china than in the states
Thanks for this, was looking for a good means to address and also whether or not the points were true or just crazed US fake stats
- Chinese houses are mostly paid for. Mayos are malding because they want a 2008-style housing collapse, but the numbers show this is simply impossible. The WORST thing that can happen even if a Chinese housing crash occurs, is that people's house values go down.
These pube-bearded bazinga brains honestly believe that people are going to riot even though they own a home and are well-fed, simply because the home went down in value. "Hey I have a job and food but my 800k ranch is now worth 500k, gonna riot brb"
Whereas the 2008 US analog would be "Hey I just LOST my job and am struggling to afford food, and my 800k ranch is also worth half of what it used to be"
This is because in 2008 bankers autosold their other stocks to take care of the margin (margin = money the bank lends to an investor in order to buy stocks).
The reason this happened is because the HOUSE loans were given to like, actual homeless people, and then the interest payments from these jobless people inevitably dried up (wow so unexpected) and we had a collective westoid :shocked-pikachu:
Instead of having a guarantee of some guy who just started his McD's job of paying back $500k, China has people who...already paid $500k and bought the house.
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americans have 0 ability to even imagine building a new city
"uuhhhh but only if they dropped the regulations so we could build horrible company town cities then we'd show chynuh!"
$1100 USD/month for a nondescript job in a major city for a historically ravaged nation is pretty good :shrug-outta-hecks: especially with communal living which is prevalent everywhere that isnt the west. like places in rural czechia thats pretty average and thats in the EU and we can live on it. its a little less than the US minimum wage but the PPP in china is one of the best in the world
personally, im just hoping to get a super juicy remote job for both me n bf and then we just go back to czechia and live with absurdly good quality of life due to the PPP difference. here in america we are just doing... ok. but we'd be saving something in the order of 170% more by living in czechia with similar accommodations
" hey are these your sources bud? https://imgur.com/gallery/jArJz56 "
