I want downvotes back too. It's important to measure just how hot my takes are and to determine how many enemies I have
Theres no reason to talk about controversial topics if all you get is downvotes its actively harmful to discussion
But I wanna do one of those bits where I just say disgusting stuff but it's just a bit because I'm going for the low score.
Oh no, i'll have to defend my position or accept feedback if people downvote! How will people know to take my 100% true and unbaised points on why to vote for an actual war criminal seriously if they just see downbears?????????
It's literally antithetical to "discussion." Aiming for upvotes creates a groupthink bubble and then there's no bad opinions to throw against the wall to challenge preconceived notions. For example, there are plenty of people here who are voting for Biden because they hate Trump that much and they feel scared to talk about it even though it's an actual legitimate position.
Mimicking one of reddit's least popular decisions WRT site structure, functionality, etc. (read: it is non political) is probably not a good thing but wtf do I know.
Yeah I hated that change. It encouraged hive mind shit.
You used to be able to post a hot take and see 400 downvotes and 399 upvotes, and that is pretty effective post if you are going against some established wisdom - it shows there's a break in an assumed consensus.
Now it looks like 2 people cruised past the comment and downvoted it.
This is bullshit, why even remove it? Knowing how many people disagree with your post is just as valuable as knowing how many agree.
So you'd stop feeling so bad about being a terrible poster.
But now you dont even see the upvotes in my posts whats even the point of downvotes and upvotes if theyre only used to boost the hot algorithm and not contribute to discussion
I want to see it normally, not buried so easily that they can then remove it even further in the next update.
Why do they keep changing the wrong shit on this site when the light mode is still broken. Insane.
You mean like most of Reddit, the purpose of this website to supplement?
You're hung up on light mode for a reddit replacement but then act overly aggressive towards copying reddit on downvotes. Odd, but ok
Because we're trying to turn this site into an alternative for people on the subreddit and making it dark mode default drives away most users.
No social media sites are dark mode, it drives users away, as evidenced by a once 10,000 member online sub becoming only ever 500 people here.
Showing all votes is an improvement over reddit though.
Unless you have data or something else you're just conclusion shopping your own pet theory. Plenty of social sites have dark modes so are you confusing just the default behavior for usage? Regardless if your goal is to not drive away users or to foster a good community acting with such hostility contradicts yourself. With due respect you could ease off or step away a bit as whatever valid points you bring up are immediately off putting by your general attitude. This site ain't some rich execs handing you excuses show some class solidarity
No social media sites have dark mode as default, so when trying to make a substitute one to transition users it's a dumb idea.
I don't think those two ideas correlate anywhere near how you think they do and this comes off more as a personal projection onto how at-large user bases would behave. There's ample data to show the popularity of dark modes and their usage rate over light modes when available and there are several other more logical and simple reasons to think a user base from a banned sub didn't make it here than to assume they were all online enough to transition to discord, then here, but bounced because changing a user profile drop down was One Step Too Far. You have valid light mode feedback, but you don't need to wrap it up in pet theories to make said feedback.
It's one of the few features this site was doing better than Reddit.
I said elsewhere, knowing how many people disagree with your post is just as valuable (to me, more) as knowing how many agree with you.
lol it's so damn clear some users juggle several profiles at once, nothing like dovetailing a day-old thread where you and one other person are going back and forth yet weirdly all their posts go +3 and all of yours go -3 within minutes
LMAO who the hell has vote alts on this goddamn website already, tell me so i can march them to the wall
Remember the vote bots from the early days, you could get +20 to 40 upbears instantly if you hit the right keywords. The mods and Devs did a good job with fixing that though, o7 to them
Yeah that's a great benefit too, it's just additional transparency in this site that lends itself to really easy vote manipulation. The best way to combat that is letting people see both up and down votes on posts and comments.
yeah, and i don't want to point fingers, but there's very specifically one sentiment on this site that seems to be in the minority yet the voting ratio would have you believe otherwise
the obvious one. it really speaks to the weakness of the ideology when it can't stand on its own merits and has to be manipulated
its all fun and games until the stalinists give themselves too many internet points :angery:
Also, as light mode representative, upvotes are blue now for some reason.
Upvotes should stay the same color across every theme. Upvotes being dark blue and downvotes being purple are basically the same color.
Light mode looked good with them as the deeper gold color they were yesterday. It was only neon yellow that hurt to look at.
Please fix
I switched back to Base theme once it was mostly usable after the fix yesterdayish. Some dropdowns are still unreadable and the text post thumbnails sort of flicker to invisible when hovering over them, but it's an improvement.
I do think there should be a shared experience upvote/downvote color association though. Having it vary by theme is like changing the icon by theme from an arrow to a check to an eye emoji, it's jarring and interrupts the shared experience that the site is trying to convey.
can you make a post in !feedback@hexbear.net with your comments on the current state of light mode? the theming system is pretty far along now so it'll be really easy to make tweaks _
I'll take screenshots as I go, but right now having all upvotes be blue and so close to downvote color is disorienting and defeats the purpose of assigning them both colors at all.
They still show up if you hover over the number. On mobile, it only works on comments. Post downvotes are invisible on mobile.
There would be a number showing how much downbears a post or comment got next to the downbear icon/arrow
Yeah, I'm on the mobile web version so that could be it, I can still see the culminative amount of upbears/downbears, just not the separate amount of upbears/downbears that would be next to the up and down arrows
Are new comments purple for you? Also my upbears are an orange-yellow
:-(
Welcome to not knowing how controversial or irony poisoned your takes areApparently if you press and hold on the bear it will show you now.
All that does is upvote you, you jerk. I have to hover to get the breakdown.
You can't hover on mobile lol, my advice is mobile/touch screen only
head on over to !commrequest@hexbear.net to show support for new communities
The reason is embedded in a document debunking the Uyghur genocide. You have to read through it because I obfuscated any words you might search by.
Looking at mod groups. I'm pretty sure it's a bi-product of testing design changes and they just couldn't figure out where to put it. Will probably reappear.
With that said, I'm actually not against removing the display of downvotes. Data objectively shows they're harmful to activity and user behaviour. It's the worst part of reddit.
It’s the worst part of reddit.
It was removed from reddit years ago. You can only see the overall score now instead of the individual numbers of upvotes and downvotes. IMO both being clearly visible like this site had before is better because it tells you whether or not that -15 post is just universally hated or controversial.
I'm referring to downvoting altogether. I misspoke in the other comment. I don't actually know what the data behind a display of downvotes is, but downvotes themselves have significant negative effects on overall user behaviour, activity and happiness. They also create circlejerk communities and I think a major concern right now is struggle sessions are potentially alienating various people for not conforming on some topics to ML views. If socdems and anarchists are alienated too hard (which is happening in some of the struggle threads) the site is just a second lemmy with no ability to attract libs and convert them.
What the fuck? You want to actually entirely remove downvotes?
Do you workshop for the worst possible ideas or is it just what flows off the top of your head?
Are you rebro? You come across just as combatively but maybe slightly less natural? I really don't understand why you're constantly rude though, stop acting like you're in a bar fight all the time, there's just no need for it. It comes off like a performance.
Not everyone who criticizes you is rebr0. If I come off combative it's because the litany of things this site has been doing wrong from the woke censoring, the dark mode default, the community splintering, the design shifts, etc. are almost solely negative in user impact.
When something improves I'm positive about it, but you see my negative comments on threads like these where you just removed all downvotes displaying. Seriously.
Nah don't give me that. There's a difference between constructive criticism and open hostility and personal attacks. Nobody has any problem with constructive criticism, everyone has a big problem with constantly be called names, personal attacks, ableism and other elements of the way you're expressing criticism.
The people are putting in absolutely constant work into things, flat out, and this behaviour serves only to demotivate people. In addition to that it comes across as if you're actively trying to get other users to engage in it too, and you're pretending that users are leaving when I demonstrated in the last thread that's not happening. It has made me wonder more than once if your intentions are harmful.
But but but... One of the most upbeared posts yesterday complained about activity decreasing.. They were wrong but it matters to people.
The more you piss off people by ruining the only good things this site has over Reddit the more people will continue to leave.
Put the downvote display back, not this baby proof "only upvotes" trash.
oh the number displayed atm is actually the total score of the post, not just upvotes
I know that. I'm talking about awoo's idea of completely removing downvotes.
i can assure you that will never happen site-wide . iirc lemmy has a per-community feature that allows you to disable downvotes? i could have dreamt that tho lol
Shouldn't happen anywhere, and hiding downvotes is a step towards it.
we didn't actually hide them intentionally. it was something we meant to handle properly in the redesign but we were migrating to react at the same time that was happening. it really was just a big miss. there was a lot going on right then and we only had one FE dev at the time. we should have an update out later today that adds these back!
also, i checked, looks like that's an instance-wide feature, not a per community one. it's not something we will ever enable on our instance. that's not even something up for debate.
I'm glad you're fixing it, but it's reasonable to assume no one would have without this thread and people expressing their discontent with the issue, which is why these threads are important.
Thanks!
I agree with you, but the tone of this thread is incredibly reminiscent of the abuse we often receive in our day jobs which is really demoralizing. :(
we use this site too. we also hate dealing with some of the same things annoying like that live update bug that erased your comments or the live re-sorting. aaahh those are infuriating to think about
yeah do the developers want this to be like reddit? They have a donation button for a reason after all also wahts up with the increasing number of users but it doesnt correlate with site activity
User churn. Online communities are always in a permanent state of decline, activity always falling. New users are coming but they're currently basically just keeping the place at a steady level of activity. In order for new users to be producing more activity for the site the quantity of incoming users must be higher than the user churn itself.
hmmm im not a fan of isolationism like most of the posters here but unless its getting shilled constantly everywyhere in socialmedia i dont see how it can sustain growth over the 10 000 discord userbase
Being everywhere in social media is precisely what it needs, yes. Achieving that requires actually having resources of use that people elsewhere online want to link to though and building those takes time. Things like c/tactics will become resources that don't exist elsewhere that will be referred to often. Piggy backing on waves of influencer audiences is probably the largest ROI in terms of time invested and user waves though. Attracting influencers to come do Chapo interviews with the userbase will result in their userbases coming to Chapo to take part in the interviews and a portion of those waves of people would find various things they enjoy during their visit that causes them to re-visit later. Lots of leftist influencers are out there with hundreds of thousands in their audiences, we just need the right strategy to actually get them to come here, probably start with smaller ones and work upwards.
These are just thoughts I personally had for the record. I'm not an admin or even a sitewide mod.
Time to get the tiktok house to promote chapo.chat so we can lead the gen z revolution.
But on a serious note you're right, we need more visibility on the internet
Don't do that please, last time we tried that the site went down, please don't fuck the servers or their data. @VolcelPolice pls
Thats dumb as fuck the old system was better when it showed both at the same time
Thanks for this, now I know how to go back to posting the most irony poisoned /controversial takes
we're actually brainstorming the best way to display upvotes and downvotes without cluttering the UI. it's been an open discussion. they are not gone permanently.
Cluttering the ui what the fuck is that fucking bear in the sidebar it schorched my fucking eyes untill i blocked it with ublock the numbers on the sides of the arrows dont take any horizontal or vertical space that gets in the way of anything else in this reddit clone
you did not just call hexbear "that fucking bear" she deserves respect. 😤
please remember we are a team of volunteers. we don't do this full time. we won't always get everything correct at first but we are always open to constructive feedback.
it all goes to hosting costs and tooling. everything i do for lemmy and chapo i do for free
Are you a designer, do you know all the different use cases and edge cases? No you do not. This was caught in between updates. Chill the fuck out.
Seems like your brain power could be used to help then instead of armchair howling 🤔
It was planned to be brought back differently. But caught in the updates.
