You are not Winston. You are not in the Party. You are a prole. The party doesn't give a shit about what you think, do or say. The only exception is if you pose a meaningful threat to the Party. In which case, the Republican-Democrat Party, the Capitalist Party of the United States of America will threaten you, disappear you, etc, etc, just like they have done to every threat in American history.
The criticisms should be exactly the same for private sector but it has the aesthetics of public sector so that's what centrists/conservatives latch onto.
but then they want to ban anyone that says its cool to kill slave owners. smh what happened to your frozen fruits centrists?
if the centrists and conservatives really believed those things were "bad apples" and not frothing at the bit to do those things themselves, why do they not believe in taking any measures to curtail those actions?
poor poor misunderstood "bad" apples. they deserve a spot in the barrel, surely. you cant just go throwing out a whole entire apple just because it has one little blemish... oh sure, the blemish is a fungal growth, but we eat mushrooms all the time! its mostly fine, is all im saying
:stalin-stressed:
I can imagine someone equating proper pronoun use to Newspeak. "They're changing language so that it will have NO MEANING!"
I agree with most of your points, but the proles aren't portrayed like you say they are. They are repeatedly emphasises to be the only hope. Their poverty, stupidity, etc, is created by the Party.
thinking of themselves as somehow uniquely informed about the dangers of institutions. It’s “baby’s first totalitarianism.”
Reactionaries: "wow you think I'm a terrible person, real original, you're just a special snowflake"
the book literally stops so that the protagonist can read a book on political theory lol
I recommend showing this to anyone beginning to question Orwell.
Asimov rules and the Foundation series is one of the best sci-fi series to introduce non-liberal worldviews to someone with.
It gives a fairly easy to understand look at different eras of civilization encapsulated by different periods after the death of a rome-esque civilization.
It's softer than explaining like imperialism and its reverberating effects to someone and is easy to read since it's just good fucking sci-fi.
I'm not saying it as a replacement to like theory and education, but it's good for weening someone off stuff like Orwell and Rowling.
Sending a reader down the Asimov path helps open the mind to non-liberal views of society.
I read the book but don't quite see the radicalization potential.
It helped me lol, maybe radicalization wasn't the right word but it definitely set me on the path.
I've thought about this recently vis a vis my mother, a fairly high up person in the ultimate PMC institution, the IMF. See, in 1984, there is some time dedicated to the fact that Party members like Winston live intentionally austere and unpleasant lives. They are watched all the time, wear awful party uniforms, go to constant meetings, and work grinding desk jobs. The proles live in poverty, but their lives are less rigidly controlled. I think the American PMC class is really approaching Party levels. When I think of my mother and her regular 15-hour workdays, how the IMF literally has a tracker on their employee's iPhones and sends them warnings based on where they go, how they have this overbearing company culture of always being on your email and ready for another meeting; well, I think of Winston
Oh yeah for sure. Feds are an extreme example of the middle class subculture that celebrates being an overworked bug
I disagree. I thought the mystery of the neurolinguistic programming was super cool and it doesn't really unravel until the third act.
I hate 1984. The only good part is the appendix because Orwell couldn't fit his rapey misogynist tropes there. Not to be a snowflake but high-schoolers shouldn't have to read a character having a r*pe fantasy about a woman he doesn't know.
Wow you know this is pretty Orwellian, just like in 1984. Big brother, am I right?
Better take: Liberals who use 1984 as the basis of their sociopolitical views - Why do you base your perceptions of reality on fiction books?
Of course we all know they base their perceptions of reality on fiction books anyways a la harry potter, game of thrones, etc.
because fiction is an easily digestable allegory for reality. fiction is not some antithetical thing to perceiving reality, its a tool for viewing reality in a way you might otherwise have not.
the same as a biography or history can tell you about what has happened, fiction can postulate about what might happen, what could have happened, what one hopes for or dreams of.
so no, that is not the "real" question. the question could be why they have stopped reading there, and become entrenched in viewing things through a poor lens.
tldr; btfo lib, go read another book.
It's actually pretty good. Orwell bad and all that, but you can really easily break libs by pointing out the west is already a 1984esque state under capitalism.
I also thought it was pretty good when I read it, but for me it was mostly just because I was so used to seeing dystopian societies in fiction that get brought down by teenagers that it was neat seeing one that was actually competent.
Orwell was a garbage person but he did have talent as a writer. Part of the reason people can get through the ham fisted political messaging in 1984 is that it’s very readable, as is Animal Farm.
His non-fiction is actually a fun read, and he’s very good at describing misery and melancholy, they guy was also just an angry miserable git who through he was smarter than everyone. Yah know like most writers.
Orwell was a racist, antisemetic and homophobic, besides ratting out Communist and fellow travellers. Beside each name, he also noted that they were Jews, homosexuals and in the case of Black activists like Paul Robeson, he labelled him "anti-white". You know who uses the term "anti-white" nowadays, the far-right white nationalists/supremacists, and they love Orwell.
Yeah that is shitty. I can't defend that. Stalin apologists need to go though.
Why would we apologize for Stalin when the man did literally nothing wrong?
Haha. Jokes.
He stopped at Berlin.
setting aside the issue of Stalinism, Orwell sold out a lot of comrades to the government. Orwell bad
Fuck if I know. It's a damn long list, and I don't really care if they supported Stalin. You don't send the police names. Here's the list if you wanna look through it https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orwell%27s_list
He gave those names while in a sanitarium for late stage tuberculosis. Don't forget that either. He was pretty out of it by the time the people looking for the list showed up.
Steinbeck and Chaplin are the only two I recognize. Kind of shitty on his part.
Fidel, Ho, and Sankara are (mostly) good. I just dislike Mao and Stalin. You're basically saying that I'm incapable of critical though, which is hurtful.
I went through that exact phase lol. Anti-communist anarchism is a great gateway ideology to actual anarchism, or towards MLism.
they’re incapable of properly engaging with leftist thought
Marxist Leninists will never, ever talk about the proletariat in communist countries, they're incapable of doing so.
Lol stupid leftists don't immediately recognize references to books they read in highschool 😏😏
