Considering how much power house progressives have now?
They don't have that much power, though. They can't get M4A passed, they can't get the Green New Deal passed, they can't get stimulus checks passed, they can't get student debt forgiveness passed, they can't shut down military bases, etc., etc., etc.
There are 8 progressives in the House now. That's enough to pressure the remaining ~200 Democrats in a few preliminary areas, but it's not enough to boss those ~200 Democrats around.
But they don't really fight for anything either. Like AOC lost a committee seat.
The main reason I "support" this force the vote thing isn't for a symbolic vote on M4A or to see who actually supports it (we already know). It's really just because I want to see them fight the establishment. Otherwise I really don't see how they differ from Pelosi.
Idk I feel like them fighting won't hurt them any and might actually make people like them more and get more of them elected. Worked for the Tea Party. And they got Boehner to retire.
Honestly this is the only #ForceTheVote argument I have a lot of respect for. I think there are some key things that AOC does that distinguish her from Pelosi - most notably she literally does boots-on-the-ground mutual aid in her district while Pelosi talks about ice cream in her $20k fridge. She's called on Pelosi and Schumer to both retire (and IIRC Pelosi promised to retire by 2022, although that was from before AOC took office). Regardless, there is a need for shock-and-awe style tactics in addition to the wonkery that the left accomplished here, even if I firmly believe what the Squad did here is much more significant than ForceTheVote . I hope to see the Squad and the left do more things like sit-ins and organized protests against corporate Dems, because we need that kind of fight in them.
I think a lot of people make the Tea Party comparison without remembering that the Tea Party started with at least twice the number of Congressional reps as the Squad had plus the Tea Party had access to unlimited Koch Brothers money plus friendly Fox News hosts. The left has neither money pools nor friends in the mainstream media; what we're trying to accomplish is a thousand times more difficult than what the Tea Party did.
The main reason I “support” this force the vote thing isn’t for a symbolic vote on M4A or to see who actually supports it (we already know). It’s really just because I want to see them fight the establishment. Otherwise I really don’t see how they differ from Pelosi.
Honestly this is the only #ForceTheVote argument I have a lot of respect for.
If you talk to anyone Force the Vote organizing spaces, they will tell you this is the goal. I feel like I'm going insane. You just live for Twitter drama.
It’s really just because I want to see them fight the establishment.
I don't see how this is anything besides demanding performative politics. You know it won't accomplish anything. You know they don't even have the power to accomplish what you're asking. But you want them to put on a show anyways?
Yeah I guess. Probably just looking for something to feel hopeful for in this hellword.
I just don't think they'll fight when it actually matters. Like when the next CARES comes about are they just gonna roll over when they could hold it up? Idk. Kinda feel like they will.
But they don’t really fight for anything either. Like AOC lost a committee seat.
And one reason she lost that committee seat was Henry Cuellar opposing her, that guy was hit with a primary challenger who AOC endorsed who got 48% of the vote. She could possible agree to not give out endorsements to primary challengers in exchange for a seat
They don't have government power, but they have people power - and not just passive support, activists and demonstrators. Start a public fight - attract media attention, point out poll results and rallies in support. Call out Breonna Taylor's killers or Jeffrey Epstein or just the fact that the economy is in the toilet. The public is not with the establishment - the public's mad.
Start a public fight - attract media attention, point out poll results and rallies in support. Call out Breonna Taylor’s killers or Jeffrey Epstein or just the fact that the economy is in the toilet.
I'm all for this, because this is stuff they can actually do. The issue I have is when people start slamming them for stuff they that's not actually within their power.
They don't have that much power, though. They can't get M4A passed, they can't get the Green New Deal passed, they can't get stimulus checks passed, they can't get student debt forgiveness passed, they can't shut down military bases, etc., etc., etc.
There are 8 progressives in the House now. That's enough to pressure the remaining ~200 Democrats in a few preliminary areas, but it's not enough to boss those ~200 Democrats around.
Yeah I know.
But they don't really fight for anything either. Like AOC lost a committee seat.
The main reason I "support" this force the vote thing isn't for a symbolic vote on M4A or to see who actually supports it (we already know). It's really just because I want to see them fight the establishment. Otherwise I really don't see how they differ from Pelosi.
Idk I feel like them fighting won't hurt them any and might actually make people like them more and get more of them elected. Worked for the Tea Party. And they got Boehner to retire.
Just want to see more fight I guess.
Honestly this is the only #ForceTheVote argument I have a lot of respect for. I think there are some key things that AOC does that distinguish her from Pelosi - most notably she literally does boots-on-the-ground mutual aid in her district while Pelosi talks about ice cream in her $20k fridge. She's called on Pelosi and Schumer to both retire (and IIRC Pelosi promised to retire by 2022, although that was from before AOC took office). Regardless, there is a need for shock-and-awe style tactics in addition to the wonkery that the left accomplished here, even if I firmly believe what the Squad did here is much more significant than ForceTheVote . I hope to see the Squad and the left do more things like sit-ins and organized protests against corporate Dems, because we need that kind of fight in them.
I think a lot of people make the Tea Party comparison without remembering that the Tea Party started with at least twice the number of Congressional reps as the Squad had plus the Tea Party had access to unlimited Koch Brothers money plus friendly Fox News hosts. The left has neither money pools nor friends in the mainstream media; what we're trying to accomplish is a thousand times more difficult than what the Tea Party did.
If you talk to anyone Force the Vote organizing spaces, they will tell you this is the goal. I feel like I'm going insane. You just live for Twitter drama.
I don't see how this is anything besides demanding performative politics. You know it won't accomplish anything. You know they don't even have the power to accomplish what you're asking. But you want them to put on a show anyways?
Yeah I guess. Probably just looking for something to feel hopeful for in this hellword.
I just don't think they'll fight when it actually matters. Like when the next CARES comes about are they just gonna roll over when they could hold it up? Idk. Kinda feel like they will.
And one reason she lost that committee seat was Henry Cuellar opposing her, that guy was hit with a primary challenger who AOC endorsed who got 48% of the vote. She could possible agree to not give out endorsements to primary challengers in exchange for a seat
They don't have government power, but they have people power - and not just passive support, activists and demonstrators. Start a public fight - attract media attention, point out poll results and rallies in support. Call out Breonna Taylor's killers or Jeffrey Epstein or just the fact that the economy is in the toilet. The public is not with the establishment - the public's mad.
I'm all for this, because this is stuff they can actually do. The issue I have is when people start slamming them for stuff they that's not actually within their power.
Perfectly fair. Don't "slam" them - but do tell them that you want them to do more. That helps them make their case.