Yeah I read the article you linked elsewhere. It’s not sexist to think vocal fry is annoying or that I don’t want it piercing my ears while at work. It can be used that way but I don’t think people here are doing that.
i once listened to a whole radio program on NPR (yeah I didn't pick it) where two guys had this exact same argument about how its awful and shit. one guy pointed out that he'd been doing it the whole time but since he was a guy it hadn't bothered anyone.
there was an awkward silence, and the arguments just came back up without acknowledging it, because libs are shit. I look forward to the more creative more intellectually rigorous bullshit excuse you'll come up with for this same phenomenon.
most men don't notice they're listening to a man with vocal fry unless its pointed out to them, often while making that same argument. the voices don't ping as annoying. ive seen it a billion times during the great vocal fry learning-what-that-word-means the libs had like a decade ago. do you really think you're special. ive heard multiple recorded examples. im telling you you only think its annoying because its associated with young women, who are supposed to be something that's inconsequential.
Or I don’t like it because I wear headphones at work and my ears are sensitive and it’s hurts sometimes. Could also be that, or maybe you’re correct, I’m just the leader of the He-Man-Woman-Hater-Club.
so its not vocal fry you hate, but literally anything that goes up to the frequencies that cis women typically hit at the high points of speaking in vocal fry? so its just the bodies of, like, whatever % of the population?
and you didn't think to maybe be pissed about the frequency response on your headphones, and how they don't handle high frequencies well?
or are we back to the problem being (mostly) cis women?
oh, wait, no, because you hate when men do it too, right? so it's clearly not just a matter of frequencies, because both cis and trans guys tend to have deeper speaking voices than cis women we assumed you might have been having a problem with earlier and....
oh hey we're back at this being a completely cultural thing with absolutely no connection to material condition! and what are the associations of vocal fry in your culture?
Some people’s voices are just annoying. Doesn’t have to be a woman, this specific instance is talking about two though. No one is saying they should change the way they speak. Everyone here is saying they don’t listen to it. Calm the fuck down and stop trying to paint a target on your back.
How am I supposed to know what your voice sounds like? No one here is policing your voice. You are going out of your way to scold people for being misogynistic because they are saying certain sounds make certain vibrations that either hurts their ears, they don’t like, or just don’t want to listen to. You’re being more toxic by doing that than anyone else in this thread.
okay but preferences aren't magical things that spring forth from the fucking ether. they're based on shit. they're connected to things. usually cultural biases and implications and values and shit. preferences CAN be problematic. if you're trying to avoid that so aggressively, it's because you know most of yours are rooted in problematic shit.
because if you can't ask more of your fucking desires, of your literal fucking aspirations, how can you ask more of literally anyone or anything?
Preferences can be problematic yes, but no one was trying to be problematic by saying they don’t like Red Scare and that they don’t like vocal fry, specifically theirs in this post.
This specific instance picked up on VOCAL FRY. Vocal frying is pretty much only done by young women, and they've been shit on for it for no reason, just like how young women get shit on for everything else. Maybe the actual act of vocal fry isn't annoying, rather it's just that society has told you it is.
This is a serious question, without a trace of irony: Do you think it is possible to dislike vocal fry (in any person) without it being rooted in conscious or unconscious misogyny? Roughly speaking what percentage would you estimate is due to benign preference vs. some sort of misogyny? 50:50, 25:75, 5:95? If, for the sake of argument, mine is just benign preference, are you saying I should change my preference, or just not vocalize my preference?
But I unironically immediately thought the guy reading the intro (ira glass?) to have an annoying voice while none of the women bothered me. Is that misogyny?
Saying that vocal fry is more often noticed in women and that that is a bad thing is an understandable position. What is not understandable is saying that ever criticizing vocal fry is misogyny. I have no strong feelings about Red Scare one way or the other. I opened their most recent episode and skipped to the middle to listen, and while their regular voices are tolerable, at times they draw out words in the most grating manner! Are you going to say that drawing out one word over 3 seconds like that is not a choice?
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Is this a bit?
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Yeah I read the article you linked elsewhere. It’s not sexist to think vocal fry is annoying or that I don’t want it piercing my ears while at work. It can be used that way but I don’t think people here are doing that.
i once listened to a whole radio program on NPR (yeah I didn't pick it) where two guys had this exact same argument about how its awful and shit. one guy pointed out that he'd been doing it the whole time but since he was a guy it hadn't bothered anyone.
there was an awkward silence, and the arguments just came back up without acknowledging it, because libs are shit. I look forward to the more creative more intellectually rigorous bullshit excuse you'll come up with for this same phenomenon.
Vocal fry on a guy is annoying too.
most men don't notice they're listening to a man with vocal fry unless its pointed out to them, often while making that same argument. the voices don't ping as annoying. ive seen it a billion times during the great vocal fry learning-what-that-word-means the libs had like a decade ago. do you really think you're special. ive heard multiple recorded examples. im telling you you only think its annoying because its associated with young women, who are supposed to be something that's inconsequential.
Or I don’t like it because I wear headphones at work and my ears are sensitive and it’s hurts sometimes. Could also be that, or maybe you’re correct, I’m just the leader of the He-Man-Woman-Hater-Club.
so its not vocal fry you hate, but literally anything that goes up to the frequencies that cis women typically hit at the high points of speaking in vocal fry? so its just the bodies of, like, whatever % of the population?
and you didn't think to maybe be pissed about the frequency response on your headphones, and how they don't handle high frequencies well?
or are we back to the problem being (mostly) cis women?
oh, wait, no, because you hate when men do it too, right? so it's clearly not just a matter of frequencies, because both cis and trans guys tend to have deeper speaking voices than cis women we assumed you might have been having a problem with earlier and....
oh hey we're back at this being a completely cultural thing with absolutely no connection to material condition! and what are the associations of vocal fry in your culture?
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Some people’s voices are just annoying. Doesn’t have to be a woman, this specific instance is talking about two though. No one is saying they should change the way they speak. Everyone here is saying they don’t listen to it. Calm the fuck down and stop trying to paint a target on your back.
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How am I supposed to know what your voice sounds like? No one here is policing your voice. You are going out of your way to scold people for being misogynistic because they are saying certain sounds make certain vibrations that either hurts their ears, they don’t like, or just don’t want to listen to. You’re being more toxic by doing that than anyone else in this thread.
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Yea. But it's still annoying.
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okay but preferences aren't magical things that spring forth from the fucking ether. they're based on shit. they're connected to things. usually cultural biases and implications and values and shit. preferences CAN be problematic. if you're trying to avoid that so aggressively, it's because you know most of yours are rooted in problematic shit.
because if you can't ask more of your fucking desires, of your literal fucking aspirations, how can you ask more of literally anyone or anything?
Preferences can be problematic yes, but no one was trying to be problematic by saying they don’t like Red Scare and that they don’t like vocal fry, specifically theirs in this post.
This specific instance picked up on VOCAL FRY. Vocal frying is pretty much only done by young women, and they've been shit on for it for no reason, just like how young women get shit on for everything else. Maybe the actual act of vocal fry isn't annoying, rather it's just that society has told you it is.
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as evidenced by my incorrectness lmao
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This is a serious question, without a trace of irony: Do you think it is possible to dislike vocal fry (in any person) without it being rooted in conscious or unconscious misogyny? Roughly speaking what percentage would you estimate is due to benign preference vs. some sort of misogyny? 50:50, 25:75, 5:95? If, for the sake of argument, mine is just benign preference, are you saying I should change my preference, or just not vocalize my preference?
Totally cool that all the comments here got deleted, but not the responses lying about why I said in them. Totally a cool thing to do.
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But I unironically immediately thought the guy reading the intro (ira glass?) to have an annoying voice while none of the women bothered me. Is that misogyny?
Saying that vocal fry is more often noticed in women and that that is a bad thing is an understandable position. What is not understandable is saying that ever criticizing vocal fry is misogyny. I have no strong feelings about Red Scare one way or the other. I opened their most recent episode and skipped to the middle to listen, and while their regular voices are tolerable, at times they draw out words in the most grating manner! Are you going to say that drawing out one word over 3 seconds like that is not a choice?
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Literally didn't address any of that. All you said was vocal fry has a sexist background, so any and all criticism of vocal fry must be sexist
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