Honestly what's wrong with Jimmy? He never pretend to be public intellectual fraud like Sam Harris. He's a dumbass comedian who see through the lies of the Democrat and 2 party system. His critiques of Bernie 2020 campaign was spot on. We got fucked by one phone call from Obama. Obama and his neolib silicon valley identity politics tech guys still had too much power over the electorates. Bernie should've spent the 4 years repudiating not only Trump but Obama and Hillary style triangulation, the DNC abandoning blue collar working class to be the party of the professional elite, as the reason why we got Trump in the first place. Bernie didn't. He ran a half establishment and half insurgent campaign in 2020, performed worse than he did in 2016, lost all his leverage within the party and got nothing to show for.
performed worse than he did in 2016
In 2016 he never came close to having a real shot. In 2020 he was the clear frontrunner by all accounts until Obama kneecapped him.
What makes you think Obama would not kneecap him in 2016 if he had a real shot? What's stopping Obama from doing the same in 2016 the things he did in 2020? What do you think stopping Obama from actually endorsing Biden in 2020 or Hillary in 2016? Obama endorsement is the trump card, and there is no rule saying that ex-president can't endorse. The establishment didn't even use all their cards both in 2016 and 2020. This just shows how far away we really are from winning electorally.
Are we stanning Jimmy Dore now? With how much this sub loves to hate on Vaush and call him a grifter, but now Jimmy is good because he's just a jokester?
Jimmy Dore is Bill Maher if he was to the left and also did a huge amount of cocaine
There is more to black and white. Jimmy is an idiot with hard on for Tulsi, but more than half of the time he was right. His critics on the DNC being party of professional elites, russiagate, the bullshit two party electoralism are spot on
Sure, I like to adopt the framework of useful-or-not instead of good-or-bad. And the truth is that I think Jimmy Dore's content is so incoherent that instead of being a useful pipeline to further leftist radicalization, he leaves would-be leftists to wander in a desert of hating the DNC and propaganda, but having no framework or larger understanding to tie it to. It's pretty telling that Sam Seder can sniff out Jimmy Dore fans just by how incoherent their babbling is when they're on the phone with him. If he makes you laugh that's fine, but I dont think his project is politically useful. Being right "more than half of the time" is a pretty lowwwwwwwww bar
Even from perspective of maximizing praxis Jimmy is more useful than not for mostly calling out the mainstream media hypocrisy. He kept meatheads like Joe Rogan - 'Oprah for guys' who had massive blue collar trucker audience from drifting into full right wing territory. He give platform for people like Aaron Mate to debunk Russiagate and people like Abby Martin and Norman Finkelstein to voice their support for Palestine. He also rips into Neera Tanden and other neolibs. He's the only person with no self respect from media careerism perspective who call out Syria gas attack as fraudulent conspiracy as it happens, even when regular anti war journalist like Glenn Greenwald being (rightfully) cautious and sit on the fence for a while. Anyone who help out people take a first step towards radicalization is doing praxis and doing good.
Jimmy Dore is better on Imperialism than 99% of the Berniecrat "left". He is definitely a crank, but there seems to be a specific segment of boomer/gen x cranks that are fucking spot on with critique of Imperialism. Like that Green Party dude who tapes giant pictures of Assad to his shirt and shit lmao.
Have you read his new book? He spends 3/4 of it explaining how private property is the root of all evil but then he goes on about how we should work within capitalism to address them instead of any systematic change.
Take someone who's a committed revolutionary, thinks we really have to throw out whatever there is of the capitalist system and market system and so on, take someone like that. They're still reformers. All the people you mention are still in favour of developing a decent health care system through government intervention because that's the only option. None of them say "lets not improve lives of people because we'd like to see a revolutionary change." They'd all be in favour for example. Take say OSHA, the safety and health goals in the workplace, for years its been declining under Bush probably disappeared. But everyone you mentioned would be in favour of strengthening those regulations, they're government regulations. Because what you're in favour of if you're serious, and the people you mention are, is pressing the institutions to the limits. Seeing what they can achieve. You're not gonna get mass popular movements trying to overthrow the institutions until people recognize they cannot satisfy our needs. Therefore you try to press reform as far as possible within the structure of existing institutions meanwhile developing alternative institutions from within building the future in the present society. That goes on simultaneously.
why do a lot of vague leftists go on tucker? is he the only booking they can get?
My favorite guest to do that was that one Dutch historian who was first congratulated for trolling billionaires, before proceeding to troll Tucker into a triggered rant which ended up not being aired.
I think it’s reasonable. Sharing your views and pushing back on Tucker Carlsons show is better than not being able to do that on any MSM outlet.
What I see in a lot of (online) leftists these days is a complete aversion to any personality or media that even shows a bit of reactionary take, as if people are irredeemable if they are not 100% on-board with your leftist take (see Joe Rogan for reference). To me, this is a sign of low self-esteem after years of being fractured.
Also if you disagree with me on any topic you're a liberal electoralist. LOOK AT HOW MUCH MORE RADICAL I AM EVERYONE.
I don't want Dore to represent the Left. lol.
The dude is barely a social democrat. Why are people defending him?
I think there's a vas deferens between platforming a Nazi versus simply appearing on their show and making a passionate oeuvre for your cause while delegitimizing their arguments. I vote Team Chaos.
Horseshoe theory.
The right does it (invites people like Dore on) to perpetuate that idea to normalize their own genocidal beliefs.
lol at people downvoting I'm not blaming anyone for exploiting these platforms I am explaining why they let people like Dore or other leftists on in the first place. Chill the fuck out people.
Are they trying for a "here's a leftist saying the left has gone too far!" ? The first thing if that is the case is to affirm that the Democrats are not left.
By "that idea" I meant horseshoe theory and that they invite leftists on to try to normalize their own ideology. I am not saying it is bad for people to exploit those platforms, just explaining their motivation for including actual leftists on their platform.
Horseshoe theory is obviously bullshit.
How does having someone leftwing on validate their own ideas? If the person competent they'll make a good argument. Or get shouted down like Bregman.
It doesn't but it signals to liberals that the far left is similar. It's disingenuous scare tactics. Whether it is effective or not that's the logic at play.
It doesn’t but it signals to liberals that the far left is similar.
Not if the don't act rabid like Carlson.
And they're booking these people to signal to liberals? Seems kinda 4D chess :\
What I mean is that they are booking these people that criticize liberals to their network, that liberals inherently write off as propaganda in an effort to deflate their legitimacy.
I think people are misunderstanding me, see my above edit.
they are booking these people that criticize liberals to their network
I think this is the purpose, "look what the leftist says about his liberal cohorts!"
If you find another MSM platform that will let leftist speak to millions of people please tell us about it.
jimmy dore isn't a leftist. he's an electoralist progressive who doesn't know how electoralism even works.
also, sam seder does way more for the left than jimmy dore, and he's often on MSNBC.
both are socdems either way
Sam seder is a lib that russia gates on MSNBC, he's not left.
not really a counter point but ok, sam continually voices the worst liberal takes, while surrounding himself with more progressive voices to give himself more legitimacy.
He's a career climber, but go ahead and stan a russiagater.
What are you scared of? That leftists will vote for Trump? Or that...libs will care? I don't get it.
