It's kind of weird seeing so many ppl on this site say things like "if it was my partner I would beat the shit out of someone" and similar stuff (see this thread: https://hexbear.net/post/183672). Not gonna lie it's kinda weird hearing that from nominal leftists. It sounds no different than some machismo person trying to start a fight cuz his honor was disrespected or something. This is what I said in that thread:
I mean I get the sentiment, but it also kinda feels like some kind of toxic machismo holdover. Kind of like “how dare you make fun of MY wife, if you insult her you basically insult ME!” I dunno it sounds kinda possessive, as if someone damaged your property, therefore damaged your pride.
So how do ppl justify this? I'm genuinely curious.
One thing I've seen some people say is that "he was standing up for someone." But that still sounds like some "you've disrespected m'lady sir, shall we duel?" shit. Like I see this stuff all the time from dads who get mad at their daughter's dates ("don't you dare lay a hand on her or I'll kill you") or brothers that are very possessive of girl family members ("if you mistreat my sister I'll kill you!") or even chuds getting triggered about the flag ("if you disrespect the flag I'll kill you!").
I dunno sounds very honor culture-y. Also sounds like retributive justice, which is fine I guess if you believe in that but we've seen the horrors that has wreaked on minority communities in places like the US. I dunno lemme know what you all think.
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Two rich jerks getting into a slap fight on live TV?
The only thing funnier would be if they got into a duel
two multi millionaire shoot each other,
yeah i support honor culture
I also accept "this is fake drama created because nobody cares about the Oscars"
But then you'd have to accept that the people running the Oscars are capable of thinking up something funny or interesting. Not very plausible.
the only people capable of writing this event do not work on the Oscars production team. i’m not sure that people who would even spin this up would work on a writing team. rich fuckheads most definitely couldn’t think of it.
therefore this was a spontaneous combustion in the timeline and thats why it is so fuckin funny
Right? These two are entertainers, and them getting into a fight is the most entertaining thing possible.
Makes me feel almost like after the revolution: dance for me, rich piggies, entertain me!
Will Smith, Jada Pinkett Smith, and Chris Rock have all known each other for decades. Chris Rock has a lonnnnng history of mocking Jada Pinkett Smith, including when she boycotted the Oscar six years ago for being racist. This is about more than just a single joke.
Slapping isn't great, though, sure. It's good Will Smith apologized later in the night. :reddit-logo: has been getting hella racist and misogynist about this, so I imagine most here are probably counter riffing.
"honor culture" is a weird way to phrase standing up to a shitty person, but ok.
Mostly, it's funny to watch two millionaires fight it out.
Yeah. The year she didn't attend was a year that was especially bad and a lot of black actors and artists boycotted. Spike Lee didn't go either.
Now he’s pushing crypto ads lol.
what does that have to do with him boycotting the oscars 6 years ago?
Nothing really, just seeing that name reminded me of the recent crypto ad that's all.
I can't speak to the context of will Smith but I would slap someone who was disrespecting my wife or kids. I don't think it's a leftist philosophy but it isn't rooted in anything other than wanting to stick up for someone I love.
Others have different motivations and assumptions and that leads to a lot of the "mlady" shit
I would feel similarly about someone disrespecting my male loved ones so...
If you make fun of the person I love's appearance on national tv, in a crowd full of a couple thousands, you might just get slapped. Hell, you make fun of anyone's body like that and you might see some hands.
I can’t speak to the context of will Smith but I would slap someone who was disrespecting my wife or kids.
I mean it's one thing to defend your family or loved ones against violence. But to respond to a verbal insult with physical retribution?
it's a slap - the universal signal to "fucking stop you moron". The harm done by a slap is 1% physical (if you're a tiny baby) and 99% public humiliation.
thank you for your service comrade o7
here is your award for wrecking a wrecker: :order-of-lenin:
I'm not sure this person is a wrecker and in a way I can see where their coming from as people I know from abusive backgrounds have expressed similar opinions to this on the slap incident
well occasionally people are going to disagree about things. Although yeah comparing two people getting in a fight to domestic abuse deeply removes a lot of the important context of domestic abuse
I guess I’ll keep that in mind next time I see a husband slap a wife across the face when they’re arguing in a restaurant.
what the fuck. how about we don't equate a guy fighting another guy to domestic abuse? that would be great.
it’s a slap - the universal signal to “fucking stop you moron”. The harm done by a slap is 1% physical (if you’re a tiny baby) and 99% public humiliation.
This is what the other person said. If a slap is a "universal signal" and "1% physical (if you're a tiny baby)" then I don't know how else to interpret that I guess...
I mean sure, I could see being unable to interpret it any other way if youre a fucking moron
I mean in effect you’re calling them “low-IQ” or some kind of other race-realist BS right
Lol yeah man, you got me, im secretly a nazi and this is how I get my kicks. Put 5% more effort into your bait and stop crowing about being insulted like there's a teacher here who give a shit, moron.
Well if you only start to process information at the point of hand-to-face impact you might be dumb enough to compare those two things.
slapping can be warranted =/= slapping is always warranted
it’s a slap - the universal signal to “fucking stop you moron”. The harm done by a slap is 1% physical (if you’re a tiny baby) and 99% public humiliation.
Your own words, just sayin...
once again, saying a slap can be justified doesn't give you carte blanche to claim that I condone slapping for any given action.
in the case of ridiculing someone for a disease, I think it is justified, personally. Chris rock wasn't in any actual danger - it was 100% public humiliation and Chris Rock had already humiliated Jada, so eh.
If I offend someone to the point of wanting to slap me that's fine.
If I offend someone to the point of wanting to slap me that’s fine.
The problem is that where is that line? Some people can get trigger happy real fast
If someone is throwing out unjustified slaps then they will be held accountable by society's judgment. This in turn will effect people's personal judgment when debating whether to slap or not.
The line is drawn by the context and can't be articulated universally with language.
The line is drawn by the context and can’t be articulated universally with language.
Makes sense, so maybe it might be best not to say a slap is:
the universal signal to “fucking stop you moron”. The harm done by a slap is 1% physical (if you’re a tiny baby) and 99% public humiliation.
But sure I see what you're saying.
universal signal =/= universally justified
a slap always means the person has had enough and is expressing their rage at a person so that the person they perceive as a malevolent moron stops.
that doesn't mean that the slapper used good judgment. Example: a drunk person who imagined being insulted.
it’s a slap - the universal signal to “fucking stop you moron”. The harm done by a slap is 1% physical (if you’re a tiny baby) and 99% public humiliation.
Your own words, just sayin…
:very-intelligent: I gotcha with the ol' switchrooooooo
Is that some sort of line you don't cross? You'd bruise someone's soul but not their cheek?
There's always an issue with escalating violence. But sometimes the escalation is part of the message.
retributive escalation of violence is a bad behavior cycle to get into. I don't think he should be punished as there wasn't any actual injury caused or any danger of that happening but he was very much wrong for escalating things to violence.
retributive escalation of violence is a bad behavior cycle to get into
Yes totally agree
Abusing your spouse in any form is domestic abuse and categorically wrong. I'm clearly talking about people slapping people they don't hold any special power over be it economic, emotional, etc.
You are grasping at straws and making me spell out things as if it is your first day on Earth.
I’m clearly talking about people slapping people they don’t hold any special power over be it economic, emotional, etc.
Yeah you've made that clear now, but your original comment:
it’s a slap - the universal signal to “fucking stop you moron”. The harm done by a slap is 1% physical (if you’re a tiny baby) and 99% public humiliation.
was not very clear. But I see what you're saying. Still don't necessarily fully agree but I see where you're coming from
yeah Will Smith escalated things here which is the pattern of behavior that leads to vendettas. There were responses available other than violence that he was very much in the wrong for not taking such as yelling "fuck you"
There were responses available other than violence
A diss track followed by a prolonged rap battle beef would have been interesting...
Yeah I'm getting a lot of privileged vibes from the "pro-slap" people. Like life isn't some kind of telenovella or teen drama show...
I would not support Will Smith shooting Chris Rock for insulting his wife, no. But slapping? Chris Rock was literally playing it off as funny moments after, like, "Will Smith just slapped the shit out of me 🤣." Idk I guess I feel similar to like, when Richard Spencer got punched or Andy Ngo got milkshaked. I mean, obviously they deserved it way more, but I just mean in terms of, they can walk away from it and be perfectly fine so who tf cares.
One thing I’ve seen some people say is that “he was standing up for someone.” But that still sounds like some “you’ve disrespected m’lady sir, shall we duel?” shit. Like I see this stuff all the time from dads who get mad at their daughter’s dates (“don’t you dare lay a hand on her or I’ll kill you”) or brothers that are very possessive of girl family members (“if you mistreat my sister I’ll kill you!”) or even chuds getting triggered about the flag (“if you disrespect the flag I’ll kill you!”).
Duel. Kill. Kill. Kill. Every comparison you made involved murder, but we're just talking about someone getting slapped. Don't you think that's a bit of a false equivalence?
Duel. Kill. Kill. Kill. Every comparison you made involved murder, but we’re just talking about someone getting slapped. Don’t you think that’s a bit of a false equivalence?
There's no doubt in my mind that if Will Smith punched Chris Rock really hard ppl here would also support it. It's the reasoning behind it that seems similar to me. In the examples I gave above would they actually kill the person? No, they're expressing that they would be really angry and possible beat, punch, smack, or even slap the person.
There’s no doubt in my mind that if Will Smith punched Chris Rock really hard ppl here would also support it.
Weird assumption. Why do you think this? I would expect that if Will Smith, say, broke Chris Rock's nose, people would feel pretty differently about it.
In the examples I gave above would they actually kill the person? No
Again, weird assumption. Pretty sure at least some of those threats are sincere.
Weird assumption. Why do you think this? I would expect that if Will Smith, say, broke Chris Rock’s nose, people would feel pretty differently about it.
Eh not too sure about that. Lots of toxic masculinity (still lingering in leftists too IMO), so they might see it as "righteous"
Again, this is purely speculation. If you wanna make up a scenario where people defend a more severe assault just so you can get mad at those people, that's on you.
If you wanna make up a scenario where people defend a more severe assault just so you can get mad at those people, that’s on you.
that's basically all they're doing in this thread lol it's good slop.
:party-parrot-popcorn:
Yeah getting wrecker vibes for sure, but it's entertaining to watch the twists.
It's funny watching all of the sleeper accounts pop up like meerkats whenever they think they might be able to make a sitewide struggle session happen lolol
putting on my sunglasses and saying in a hacker voice "I've been activated", except it's to start a struggle session :fedposting:
:stupidpol: account A posts bigoted bullshit of side 1
:stupidpol: account B posts bigoted bullshit of side 2
:stupidpol: account C posts "omg hexbar do better im leaving 4evr"
...
:stupidpol: "this will show them"
Someone just did apparently: https://hexbear.net/post/183847/comment/2295431
I would expect that if Will Smith, say, broke Chris Rock’s nose, people would feel pretty differently about it.
Nah still alright.
My main feeling is that no one was ever in any real danger or was seriously injured so seeking punishment is just counterproductive.
I think there are levels of offense. I think insulting someone on a medical condition is more egregious than just a regular insult. I can understand violence coming about if it is an insult on a medical condition.
I also can understand the concern about retributive justice but I don't necessarily think a slap is a particularly great offense for the one Chris Rock was doling out. It was a fair exchange.
Yeah the situation was a very public one between rich celebrities in Hollywood, but I wonder how many would actually do the same in a more normal setting. It could end up with the cops coming in and all sorts of nasty stuff...
It could end up with the cops coming in and all sorts of nasty stuff…
I mean yeah, are you surprised people are living vicariously through this then?
Good point, maybe it's just projection, but from what I've seen a lot of the comments in favor of slapping seem very sincere.
You can be sincere about wanting something to happen while also knowing you probably couldn't get away it.
Example: murdering a pig
It could. It could not. I don't know. I spent a large portion of my 20's being a drunk non political person. Generally, if anything came to the level of altercations, the people I was around were able to squash the encounter without it interrupting into a full fight. I have broken up more than one fight and often not been alone. I think the violence alone isn't something that is ringing alarm bells for people who are left, but rather how are the community norms when an altercation breaks out?
and now Jada’s “honor” will be contaminated by incels accusing her of forcing Will Smith to smack Rock.
Yeah I definitely foresee a spike in the "actually men aren't evil it's women who manipulate them into violence" kind of sentiments unfortunately
I do somewhat support honor. When someone insults my friends, I am hurt as well because they are dear to me as people. I wish to use my strength on their behalf.
Seems like a very big leap to go from "My loved one is being humiliated in front of a huge crowd and on television by some shitty comedian who thinks he will never see any consequences" to "Waah my honor was disrespected im gonna start a fight". The whole "sticks and stones" thing is fucking bullshit, words can cut extremely deeply and you're just expected to fucking take it if its from a comedian because of this bullshit about "oh your triggered lol xd?".
You also need to better define what the fuck honor culture is, otherwise you just end up with "the concept of honor exists in this culture, therefore this is honor culture".
"Honor culture" is a phrase I've only ever heard used by guys who think they're being really slick about their Islamophobia
My partner and I would kick the shit out of the guy, not just me. Checkmate, liberal
I think it's pretty silly to actually seriously justify or criticize the hilarious moment of The Fresh Price smacking The Donkey from Shrek. Enjoy the vibes, ignore moralizing, there were no problematic power dynamics between two super rich cishet-coded black guys. Return to slap.
Chris Rock = Putin I guess. But wait Will Smith initiated physical violence so he's Putin?? But Smith was also defending his wife's honor (so the wife is Ukraine and Smith is the US)??? Lib brainworms...
most of the lib "discourse" has been "will smith is evil because violence always bad"
Libs are the ones most against this lol, most of them are making some absurd comparisons between Will Smith and Putin.
